Low-cost emerging market SoC/phone discussion

Discussion in 'Mobile Devices and SoCs' started by ToTTenTranz, May 12, 2011.

  1. Exophase

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    Yeah, and another third is image compression. Can you explain why that's more representative? I'm not saying definitively either are or aren't, but saying that they're over-weighted three orders of magnitude (1000 times!) is pretty out there. Encryption and decryption is not that unusual. Maybe it's I/O limited a lot of the same, but so is compression and decompression. Throwing out the the encryption results entirely (except where influenced by acceleration instructions) and relying entirely on some the other set to gauge overall performance doesn't seem like a step in a better direction.

    When you get down to it, a benchmark isn't necessarily representative based on what specific task it accomplishes but on how similar the states it puts the CPU in are to other programs. In other words, the memory locality of reference spread, memory parallelism, mix of ALU operations and ratio between it and loads/stores, amount of branches and branch mispredictions, presence of floating point code, utilization of vectorization, and so on. But, since this stuff rarely gets analyzed outside of SPEC, we're stuck with just judging the benchmarks by what they do.
     
  2. Gubbi

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    Because the access patterns correlates better with other workloads; contigeous access with good locality for the IDCT bit and pseudo random accesses for the entropy inflater.

    Really? I thought I was being generous. How many cycles are used to encrypt/decrypt SSL streams versus cycles spent rendering the webpage ? How many cycles are spent validating an app signature versus actually running the app ?.

    Exactly! And that is why crypto hashes needs to go. They are weighted way too heavily and have very poor correlation with other tasks.

    Cheers
     
  3. Erinyes

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    Seems pretty good on the CPU front and hopefully it has good power efficiency. GPU performance is what I'm more interested in as the Adreno 306 naming does not suggest too much of a performance increase from 305, which admittedly was a little underpowered for 720p devices.

    Also curiously, there have been no leaks on the Mediatek 6732 yet, which is very similar to this chip. I wonder if its been delayed.
     
  4. tangey

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    I note that rockchip have some new socs coming out, including an octa A53 "Maybach", with an unspecified gles3.0 GPU. They are pretty much in bed with Mali now, so probably a Mali, but its not like them not to even mention the family.

    [​IMG]
     
  5. Nebuchadnezzar

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    The initial 8916 devices aren't using AArch32 for whatever reason. You can see the crypto improvement in the newer platforms which do run it: http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench3/compare/792706?baseline=801039 (Take into account the higher clocks too).
     
  6. Ailuros

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  7. wco81

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    Any ideas on what the volumes are like?

    These Mediatek SOCs are for sub $200 or sub $100 phones?

    But are these segments still expanding as fast?

    It seems a lot of the momentum is around vendors like Xiaomi, which is eating Samsung's lunch in China and perhaps some other Asian markets. As far as I can tell, they use mostly SnapDragons, not cheaper SOCs.

    Or will devices for the Indian and other emerging markets eventually overwhelm higher-priced products?
     
  8. Mariner

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    The first chinaphones containing the Mediatek MT6595 are now available. This is a big.LITTLE quad-A17/quad-A7 chip so it's the first time that Mediatek have had a part performant enough to give the big boys even close to a run for their money. Similarly, Huawei have their similar Kirin big.LITTLE chip so it will be interesting to see how these chips perform in comparison to the Snapdragon and Exynos devices when pricing is taken into account.

    A good possibility that they will have the best price/performance on the market, perhaps?
     
  9. Blazkowicz

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    Interesting thread. There's a review of the $35 Firefox OS phone, which is using a single-core Cortex A5 SoC (built on 40nm and with integrated 2G, as far as I can understand)

    It's a really horrible phone, kind of as if you used a PC that is constantly swapping with the hard drive in PIO mode and your background apps got killed by the kernel because the PC is out of memory.
    Device only have 128MB RAM and 256MB flash.

    http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2014/10/testing-a-35-firefox-os-phone-how-bad-could-it-be/

    Using the web as the platform for even built-in contacts, calendar etc. makes things worse, but the reality is the web is extremely memory hungry so if your goal is to use a web browser you need much memory.
    For the really lowest cost markets (either penny pinchers or places that have cell phones but no running water) I guess cheap high density DRAM is critical.
     
  10. Ailuros

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  11. mboeller

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  12. Ailuros

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    That's a new one then especially for tinydeal.

    If I personally want a chinese phone then primarily because of a possible outstanding price/performance ratio; at $450 or more I don't really need to do Meizu any favours and just buy any other smartphone available in local markets at the same price. I don't know who takes those decisions at Meizu but they obviously have little or no grasp of reality for anything outside China.
     
  13. wco81

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    Are there any concerns about the security/privacy of these Chinese phones?

    American companies are wary of Huawei networking equipment, because of concerns about backdoors for the Chinese govt. to spy on people who use this equipment.

    Similarly, there are widespread reports of Hong Kong protesters having their phones hacked and being used against them as surveillance devices:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/02/b...ts-of-scrutiny-through-their-phones.html?_r=0
     
  14. Alexko

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    Clearly, the NSA would never do anything like this on US devices.
     
  15. wco81

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    Maybe, but at least Apple and Google have said they'd enable encryption of all data.

    Chinese vendors are using their own hardware and OS?
     
  16. Blazkowicz

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    There's a Chinese networking industry in part because of the very same concerns about backdoors planted by the US.
    Cynical people are also quick to point to Google and Apple will hand encryption keys over on request.

    But there are serious issues orthogonal to that anyway such as the tracks you leave on the web or the detailed list of all your calls that your carrier has regardless, and the limited time for which you receive security updates (Apple currently is leading there). Hopefully mobile stuff will mature and get more PC-like for some things : even if a mobile phone is unsupported by its carrier or phone vendor, shouldn't the OS vendor provide critical updates to the OS?
     
  17. wco81

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    I thought there was a Chinese networking industry so they can steal trade secrets from the Ciscos and Junipers.
     
  18. orangpelupa

    orangpelupa Elite Bug Hunter
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    btw in Indonesia theres
    HiMax Polymer that is sold around 150 USD online to 170 USD retail physical store.
    2 GB RAM
    8 Cores CPU (i think @ 1,6GHz)
    I forgot the GPU
    IPS screen (its beautiful and seems fused together)

    its basically outperform and the screen out-quality other phones from Sony and Samsung that sold for around 300-400 USD.

    EDIT:
    the spec list
    http://www.himax.co.id/id/index/pintro/1/2
     
  19. Mariner

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    The Himax Polymer is a rebadged/OEM version of the Coolpad F1 (which I own). Uses the MT6952 octa-core A7 and a Mali GPU.

    An excellent phone for the price - cheap, well-built, good performance, good specs, lots of ROMs available.

    With smartphones this good, I don't think I'll find myself spending much more than $200 on a phone in the future.

    orangpelupa, if you're interested in messing around the with phone/installing new ROMs and so forth, check out the following forum:

    http://www.modaco.com/forum/778-coolpad-f1/
     
  20. orangpelupa

    orangpelupa Elite Bug Hunter
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    thanks for the info, just checked the forum and wow its an active community :D

    unfortunately its my friends who use himax, im still on Sony Ericsson Xperia SP. The only thing that my phone win over himax/coolpad is the GPS :lol:
     
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