Kyle throws a [H]issy fit about CrossFire shipping late

Discussion in 'Graphics and Semiconductor Industry' started by Junkstyle, Oct 4, 2005.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Sobek

    Sobek Locally Operating
    Veteran

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2004
    Messages:
    1,774
    Likes Received:
    18
    Location:
    QLD, Australia
    You can? awesome!

    :D
     
  2. jb

    jb
    Veteran

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2002
    Messages:
    1,636
    Likes Received:
    7
    Actually Kyle you can buy a xfire masters card and xfire mobo today...your right they are late...but a two week window is not a bad start..
     
  3. HaLDoL

    Newcomer

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2004
    Messages:
    140
    Likes Received:
    2
    Show me. And no pre-order stuff, I'm looking for mass availability.
     
  4. Dave Baumann

    Dave Baumann Gamerscore Wh...
    Moderator Legend

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2002
    Messages:
    14,079
    Likes Received:
    648
    Location:
    O Canada!
    Look around the forum, its not difficult to find.
     
  5. bigz

    Regular

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2004
    Messages:
    350
    Likes Received:
    6
    #265 bigz, Oct 7, 2005
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 7, 2005
  6. Geo

    Geo Mostly Harmless
    Legend

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2002
    Messages:
    9,116
    Likes Received:
    213
    Location:
    Uffda-land
    Whoa, didn't realize ati.com doesn't sell outside NA. . .but apparently they don't. I can see that being an ouchie for this gen of CrossFire master cards. At any rate, they claim to have the X850 for sale. . .same price as regular X850 too (at least at their store).
     
  7. bigz

    Regular

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2004
    Messages:
    350
    Likes Received:
    6
    Yep, you can't buy from ATI.com in the UK.
     
  8. Geo

    Geo Mostly Harmless
    Legend

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2002
    Messages:
    9,116
    Likes Received:
    213
    Location:
    Uffda-land
    I was going to quip about someone needing to tell them about "the special relationship", and then realized they are Canadian and it is supposed to be even specialer! Specialmost? Or something.

    I mean, really. . .what is the point of being a company store if not to be the supplier of last resort? They certainly don't --and can't, or their partners would have a hissy-- compete on price!
     
    #268 Geo, Oct 7, 2005
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 7, 2005
  9. bigz

    Regular

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2004
    Messages:
    350
    Likes Received:
    6
    I've spoken to a couple of retailers and they've heard "next week" for X850 CrossFire Edition cards. They also said words to the effect of "we'll believe it when we see them". X1800 XT CrossFire Edition cards are looking likely to hit on time in the first half of November, though.
     
  10. Rys

    Rys PowerVR
    Moderator Veteran Alpha

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2003
    Messages:
    4,156
    Likes Received:
    1,432
    Location:
    Beyond3D HQ
  11. Mariner

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2002
    Messages:
    1,596
    Likes Received:
    233
    Wow! Well done. Nice wide-ranging insult to most of the board members.

    Personally, I'm not an ATI fboy (although my PC at home uses a Radeon 9600 in *gasp* an nForce motherboard), but I do recognise differences in the way HOCP has treated X1800 as opposed to previous NV paper launches. Have ATI had it coming? After the supply problems with the various PE editions of R420/R480 and then the Crossfire delays, perhaps so, but this isn't anything we haven't seen in the past from NV also. I just find it hard to believe that one well-executed launch from NV (7800GTX) requires a whole change in reviewing practice, (not to mention that the X1600 is reviewed despite the fact it won't be available for a while yet). More pertinently, Kyle's actions actually provide positive PR for NV and calls into question ATI's integrity which is why some are wondering if there is something else behind his stance - it just seems too lopsided to be sincere. This is only amplified by his snarky comments on the news page about ATI's VS3.0 implementation.

    If Kyle wanted to make a point, it seems to me that it would just have been more sensible to do the tests but then have a flashing banner saying "FROM PAST EXPERIENCE, WE KNOW THAT THESE CARDS MAY NOT BE AVAILABLE FOR SOME WEEKS".

    Just my viewpoint.
     
    digitalwanderer likes this.
  12. Geo

    Geo Mostly Harmless
    Legend

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2002
    Messages:
    9,116
    Likes Received:
    213
    Location:
    Uffda-land
    Indeed. To support that, you'd have to come up with a situation where NV was treated in a similar matter on something of the same relative importance (I mean, new gens don't come along all that often) by a major site, and then show how the folks here were indifferent to it.

    I mean, did *any* of the major sites take a pass on the NV30 preview in November of 2002? I think not, and that was a much more severe case. I just looked at the Anand preview from Nov 18, 2002, which announced availability in Feb. 2003. As I recall, it turned out to actually be early March.

    Now, I can hear a greenjeans saying "Oh, there you go bringing up NV30 again". But the point is not to bash NV --the point is the reviewing community still gave them all the breaks on passing on their communications on the matter.
     
  13. Acert93

    Acert93 Artist formerly known as Acert93
    Legend

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2004
    Messages:
    7,782
    Likes Received:
    162
    Location:
    Seattle
    About sums it up.

    The BFG thing bothers me because last summer when I was shopping for GPUs some of HardOCPs benchmarks were TOTALLY irrelevant because of their reliance on non-stock cards. The BFG cards were, at the time, a bit more expensive and harder to find. So the benchmarks comparing X800Pros to 6800GT OCs were misleading to the actual mainstream products on the market, it was also not in the same price class.

    I actually purchased a 6800GT but it always seemed "odd" that HardOCP would use lopsided comparisons like this. "OC" cards were not the norm for the 6800GT series and cost more, so I don't understand how someone can honestly use it in gaming benchmarks against a competitors stock card.

    Indeed. You can add SLI into the mix as well as Kyle admitts. Why was NV given the benefit of the doubt?

    Oddly, I was at tomshardware.com this morning and they did a full "preview" on the 65nm Intel P4. What I found odd about this is their preview is basically the same information you get from their reviews. What is odd is that they said they would no longer be reviewing parts they could not buy.

    I see nothing wrong with what they did--the clearly say it wont be available for a while--but it begs the question of the rollercoaster, "We wont review this, but we will that".

    Which kind of draws back to the Hard[OCP] X1600 review. Why were certain parts not reviewed due to "availability" and yet other parts in the same situation were? On the face there is no easy explaination.

    NV30... SLI... BFG OCs... odd flip flops on reviewing unavailable products...

    Ps- Not that it is really relevant or matters, but I know people who had the X800XT PE preordered and they received theres last summer. Numerous times it was made available as well. While it surely was a weak SKU I remember the same issue with NV's "Ultra Extreme" which basically, for all practical purposes, never existed. Yet people did not have a problem reviewing it.

    This is why I always read what drivers were used in a test, the system configuration, and compare with other sites results. Review sites are *companies* and they recieved advertising and products from the companies they evaluate. Most start off very small. I remember when I was in a very similar situation reviewing games. We learned very quickly that as a small fledgling site that when a publisher or developer passes on review material and you don't give it a good review, well, unless your volume of readers/market impact grows they wont do ANY more favors for you.

    It is what it is. Bigger sites can avoid some of this, but there is always those roots. So unless a site buys their own review material from retail and uses puts some control on advertising (e.g. use a thrid party to negotiate) I think these small hardware websites will ALWAYS be under a cloud. It is pretty obvious to me some have ties with NV and others with ATI. Keeping strong ties with a company can be very difficult in a market heavily influenced by consumer perception.
     
    digitalwanderer likes this.
  14. nelg

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2003
    Messages:
    1,557
    Likes Received:
    42
    Location:
    Toronto
    IIRC Kyle is good friends with someone at BFG and, IMHO, he has given BFG a disproportionate amount of attention compared to other nV IHVs.
     
  15. Pete

    Pete Moderate Nuisance
    Moderator Veteran

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    4,925
    Likes Received:
    315
    Well, he's free to do that, just don't pretend that he's doing his readers a service by comparing OCed NV cards to stock-clocked ATI cards. But I doubt he'd use BFG cards simply b/c he has a friend there. I mean, [H] has a wider readership than him and his buddies.

    Yes, I don't think anyone sells OCed ATI cards (well, maybe Sapphire, albeit rarely), and OCed nV cards are a bit more common (at least at the high end), but it's still not a fair representation. Then again, I also take issue with his (and most reviewers') street price vs. MSRP arguement. Surely someone might read the article a week or month after it's been posted, in which case prices should have narrowed, leaving performance as the big differentiator.

    BTW, the prices on both XLs have dropped since last night. The ATI at ASS is down to $459 (MSRP + $10), and the C3D at MPC is down to $436. Both prices are before S&H, in which case ASS will take me for an extra $12, while MPC will hit me up for a mere $6.50.
     
  16. mattredd

    Newcomer

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2003
    Messages:
    26
    Likes Received:
    0
    According to his "front page news" he suggests that you cannot find any GTOs or GTOs in stock at retail.

    http://www.dabs.com/ProductList.aspx?SearchTerms=+x800gto&SearchMode=ALL&SearchKey=All&PageMode=3&NavigationKey=0&SearchType=1

    (Nice new site BTW)

    and

    http://www.overclockers.co.uk/acatalog/X800PCI_Series.html

    and

    http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.asp?Submit=Go&DEPA=0&type=&description=x800gto&Category=0&minPrice=&maxPrice=&Go.x=0&Go.y=0

    Maybe he should spend more time investigating his news items rather than trying to work out what ATI stands for.
     
  17. nagus

    Newcomer

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2002
    Messages:
    134
    Likes Received:
    5
  18. nagus

    Newcomer

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2002
    Messages:
    134
    Likes Received:
    5
    and just for the record... X1800XL Boards are also in Stock @ Newegg
     
    Jawed likes this.
  19. IRQ Conflict

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2005
    Messages:
    64
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    DV,AB,Canada
    Kewl! Toms, HA, INQ and now [H]. Now I have even more variety in BS hardware sites to laugh at!
     
  20. BRiT

    BRiT (╯°□°)╯
    Moderator Legend Alpha Subscriber

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    12,284
    Likes Received:
    8,480
    Location:
    Cleveland
    Oh My Gawd. He really is a [T]ard puppet for Nvidia. The GTOs are supposed to be vendor only products.
     
Loading...
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page

  • About Us

    Beyond3D has been around for over a decade and prides itself on being the best place on the web for in-depth, technically-driven discussion and analysis of 3D graphics hardware. If you love pixels and transistors, you've come to the right place!

    Beyond3D is proudly published by GPU Tools Ltd.
Loading...