Killzone Prerendered E3 Trailer Talk

[dubert]

It *could* be rendered in realtime, if the lighting is baked into maps, etc...
BUT when you see a close up on the characters face, you can see small tiny strands of facial hair, which concludes that it is prerendered... Yes there are tricks to do "hair", but not with that detail. Also the AA is too good to be realtime on current hardware.
In general people give too much credit to the hardware nowadays. You simply cannot do the stuff you can do with prerendered animations.
Of course there are tricks to pull off some stuff that "looks" like, but for example, global illumination you couldn't move the lights in realtime, because the lighting is baked into textures.

I'm a programmer in a major CG company, so I'd like to know what I'm talking about.
The software we make, was used to render the Killzone 2 trailer and the Call of duty 2 TV ad.

 

[ralexand]

The software we make, was used to render the Killzone 2 trailer.

Wow, that statement is just, just ... Wow!

 

[HappyBread]

Wow, that statement is just, just ... Wow!

Explain.

 

[ralexand]

Explain.

Maybe I'm confused. Is he claiming he wrote the software that rendered the Killzone e3 demo?

 

[HappyBread]

He's claiming his company makes the software. Who is the company you work for, dubert?

 

[Fox5]

Well, it is a possibility it is pre-rendered in the sense that it is what Capcom believes is obtainable on the upcoming systems. I see little reason to think it isn't possible on next generation consoles. The graphics are very nice. It might be aiming too high, but I do remember being blown away by the first demos of Shenmue for Dreamcast and saying that even that couldn't be realtime. After that, I take this with a much more open mind, because it can happen.

And if it is indeed realtime, then Capcom have really turned it around.

Those Shenmue videos shimmered like hell though, even worse than the actual game due to compression artifacts. (and the actual game was pretty bad, made worse due to its low framerate)

But in practice there is no huge difference between CGI and a pure grafik demo (like 3D Mark).

The non interactive, usually (semi) static camera allow effects, scenes you can really dream about in an interactive game. (Using matpainting, precaculated occlusion culling - the whole scene is optimized for 2 or 3 camera perspectives and so on...)

That is obvious, and the cause we still have no games that look like 3D Mark 2002/03.

I'm still waiting for a game that looks, in every aspect, like the Nature demo of 3dmark01.
I would be so happy if next gen games look like 3dmark05. I'd assume the top of the line video cards are able to run 05's demos at speeds that would be considered playable now? Oh, and good animations would be nice, gears of war looks good but the animations don't.

 

[Axsider]

It *could* be rendered in realtime, if the lighting is baked into maps, etc...
BUT when you see a close up on the characters face, you can see small tiny strands of facial hair, which concludes that it is prerendered... Yes there are tricks to do "hair", but not with that detail. Also the AA is too good to be realtime on current hardware.
In general people give too much credit to the hardware nowadays. You simply cannot do the stuff you can do with prerendered animations.
Of course there are tricks to pull off some stuff that "looks" like, but for example, global illumination you couldn't move the lights in realtime, because the lighting is baked into textures.

I'm a programmer in a major CG company, so I'd like to know what I'm talking about.
The software we make, was used to render the Killzone 2 trailer and the Call of duty 2 TV ad.

lol
It's funny the read your signature: "When you say PS/PS2 has great games... You'll know you have been brainwashed!!!"
A little bit suspicious, ha!?
Disregarding how unprofessional you sound (yeah, I said that) you are just talking crap.
After seeing some "stuff" in this early "PS3 phase" (Naughty Dogs game, Factor 5, a special SCE WW/SCEI title, Evo Studios game, and so on) it is possible to do such Killzone 2 (no, not 3) graphics. Yeah, the animations in this video are a little bit TOO good for a game at the moment (at the moment!!), but... yeah, just wait and see. They are not out of this world. Sure not.

You worked on the software , which was used to render Killzone. And now? If this is actually true, you know nothing about the PS3. After reading your post, ...no you know nothing.

That's all I have to say.

 

[dubert]

Maybe I'm confused. Is he claiming he wrote the software that rendered the Killzone e3 demo?

No, I didn't write the entire software, but I am part of the dev team that makes the software.
And yes, Killzone 2 trailer is in fact rendered in LightWave3D by Axis animation.

 

[Laa-Yosh]

He's claiming his company makes the software. Who is the company you work for, dubert?

That'd be Newtek, developer of Lightwave.

 

[Laa-Yosh]

And yes, Killzone 2 trailer is in fact rendered in LightWave3D by Axis animation.

I wonder how long it takes until someone calls you a liar...

 

[HappyBread]

That'd be Newtek, developer of Lightwave.


I wonder how long it takes until someone calls you a liar...

Thanks.



dubert is a liar.

 

[ROG27]

I wonder how long it takes until someone calls you a liar...

See I think it's a good thing that Sony got called out on using Prerendered target video for their up and coming hot franchise (Killzone universe is a great idea...just not executed effectively in the first game due to hardware limitations)....

All the yelling and screaming will do from the ******s is make sony and guerilla's effort to build quality into the game unrelenting. I would not be surprised if the final build of the game came very, very close to the prerendered target...unlike some other companies that don't really need to worry about living up to expectations because they monopolize their arena with exclusivity and licensing agreements (cough cough madden 2006 cough cough EA sports)

 

[dubert]

lol
It's funny the read your signature: "When you say PS/PS2 has great games... You'll know you have been brainwashed!!!"
A little bit suspicious, ha!?
Disregarding how unprofessional you sound (yeah, I said that) you are just talking crap.
After seeing some "stuff" in this early "PS3 phase" (Naughty Dogs game, Factor 5, a special SCE WW/SCEI title, Evo Studios game, and so on) it is possible to do such Killzone 2 (no, not 3) graphics. Yeah, the animations in this video are a little bit TOO good for a game at the moment (at the moment!!), but... yeah, just wait and see. They are not out of this world. Sure not.

You worked on the software , which was used to render Killzone. And now? If this is actually true, you know nothing about the PS3. After reading your post, ...no you know nothing.

That's all I have to say.

Hehe, my sig is just to agravate you Sony ******s, since your fanaticism is really getting out of hand...

 

[ralexand]

Hehe, my sig is just to agravate you Sony ******s, since your fanaticism is really getting out of hand...

Okay, dubert is a liar. Why do you waste your time here kid?

 

[dubert]

Okay, dubert is a liar. Why do you waste your time here kid?

Fine, don't believe me.

 

[ralexand]

Fine, don't believe me.

It would be fine if you didn't come across as a huge ****** with that last comment.

By the way, I said f a n b o y, nothing obscene.

 

[dubert]

It would be fine if you didn't come across as a huge ****** with that last comment.

By the way, I said f a n b o y, nothing obscene.

Hehe, it was meant as a joke.
And I said f a n b o y too, but I didn't know it was a word that will be sencored...

 

[BTOA]

Wasn't the PS3 KZ E3 demo called out as being CG rendered after E3 05?

If so, ws dubert one of the posters who called it out as being CG render during the summer?

 

[tema]

Sony wanted a full blown next generation Killzone trailer, Lightwave3D was the fastest for this short notice. What dubert doesn't tell you is all assets and supervision came from Guerilla-Games.

You are a liar.

 

[dubert]

Sony wanted a full blown next generation Killzone trailer, Lightwave3D was the fastest for this short notice. What dubert doesn't tell you is all assets and supervision came from Guerilla-Games.

You are a liar.

How does this make me a liar?
It is LightWave regardless of the assets. It is not realtime, and that is the point.
Besides, how do you know Guerilla Games didn't model the characters, etc, in LightWave's modeler?