Is there a non-religious reason as to why same sex unions...

[nelg]

What I am saying is that you cannot force yourself to be attracted to something that you naturally are not . If you think that you can, then ask yourself, could you make yourself attracted to someone of the same sex.

 

[jvd]

Sigh. All the talk about pedophiles is moot. Pedophiles are trying to have sex with children. Children have been legally defined as people who are incapable of making sexual decisions with adults, and cannot consent to any sexual activity with those "of age". Thus Pedophilia is basically similar to rape. Arbitrary, but true.

That is patently different than two consenting adults, be they heterosexual or homosexual.

Unless homosexuality is a defect in an adult compromising thier judgement .

WHo is to say that you do not have a defect that makes you a heterophob.

Most pedophiles have defects taht cause them to be that way. Either cause from abuse or imbalancing in his brain .

 

[Natoma]

Oh stop.

 

[jvd]

Oh stop.

see you are a heterophob

 

[Natoma]

The hatred coming from conservatives. I cannot describe the pain that is in my heart after reading these articles, especially following Bush's state of the union last night. Sigh.

Bans on gay marriage:

Ohio:

http://www.365gay.com/newscon04/01/012104ohioRts.htm

The Ohio Senate Wednesday passed one of the most severe anti-gay pieces of legislation in the country. The bill, which has already passed the House, declares same-sex marriages are against the "strong public policy" of Ohio.

The state already had one law to prevent same-sex marriage, but the new legislation, which passed 18 - 15, goes further, preventing courts from recognizing marriages or civil unions from outside the state, and preventing the state from offering health and pension benefits to unmarried partners.

Democratic Dissenters:

"We are appalled that at this time in the history of the state of Ohio when we need to be as welcoming as we possibly can ... that we would put a sign on our door that says, 'We don't want you here,'" said Sen. Eric Fingerhut (D-Cleveland).

Sen. C.J. Prentiss (D-Cleveland) said the bill reminded her of the days in the United States when lawyers would defend laws that said black citizens were inferior and didn't deserve the same rights as whites.

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Virginia:

http://www.365gay.com/newscon04/01/012104vaAmend.htm

Sponsored by Del. Robert G. McDonnell, it calls on Congress to enact legislation starting in motion the amendment process to define marriage as a union between a man and a woman and to make illegal civil unions between couples of the same sex.

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Georgia:

http://www.365gay.com/newscon04/01/012104georgiaAmend.htm

GOP leaders in the Georgia Senate introduced legislation Wednesday to block same-sex couples from marrying. The move comes only a day after President Bush's State of the Union address in which he said the U.S. "must defend the sanctity of marriage."

Georgia Republicans are calling for an amendment to the state constitution defining marriage only as a union between a man and a woman. Today's bill would begin that processes, even though Georgia already has legislation to stop gays from marrying.

Dissenting Voices:

"The purpose of amendments is to create protections for the citizens of Georgia, not to write discrimination into the constitution," said Allen Thornell, executive director of Georgia Equality.

"Individual rights are not based upon just what the majority at one point in time feels, but are based on principles higher than that."

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Ohio's ban is especially severe. This outright bigoted rejection causes a feeling that is difficult to describe. And I'm not usually one at a loss for words.

 

[ByteMe]

At least a few of states are doing this right. Ohio is an example that should be followed.

 

[Tim Murray]

Most pedophiles have defects taht cause them to be that way. Either cause from abuse or imbalancing in his brain .

Oh fucking hell. Does anyone actually believe the "pedophilia is equivalent to homosexuality" argument? It's total bullshit. Why? A pedophile engages in sexual activity with a child (or at least tries to). A homosexual engages in sexual activity with a consenting adult.

See the difference? Adult? Child? Yeah. Okay. Case rested.

 

[THe_KELRaTH]

I don't see homosexuality as a long term problem as I expect that in future generations the faulty gene will be rectified and this is why society should allow current homosexuals to live their life out without persecution.

I don't really see the point in homosexuals trying to get marriage status as for one thing it only costs money. In UK there are no tax or other advantages, both partners pay same amount of tax but if one partner is ill and needs benefits then because they're in a marriage they don't get the same amount of benefit as if they were 2 single people.

 

[London Geezer]

I don't really see the point in homosexuals trying to get marriage status as for one thing it only costs money. In UK there are no tax or other advantages, both partners pay same amount of tax but if one partner is ill and needs benefits then because they're in a marriage they don't get the same amount of benefit as if they were 2 single people.

Maybe in Surrey Heath the law is different from the rest of the country. Or maybe i just didn't get what you're trying to say.

 

[THe_KELRaTH]

What I was saying is as a single person, if you are ill and claim sickpay + say rent/mortgage, etc you are entitled to recieve these cost of living expenses but if you are married your partners salary is taken into consideration and you cannot claim for your share of the bills even though you paid in the same amount as a single person. Therefore, logically you would be far better off without the marriage status.

Even married ppl's pensions are lower than 2 single persons pensions (by about 50%)

 

[hjs]

I can't believe what i read here. Religion and Law had nothing to do with each other. So why a law against mariage of homosexuals? Next law, al ugly women have to carry masks (or that thing the taliban used for there women)?

What wrong if you love someone of the same sex, you don't hurt anybody whit you're feelings.
Oh and all you religious people, do you only have sex to reproduce?

Or is it because i work in Amsterdam i'm way to liberal

 

[THe_KELRaTH]

You're sounding like those females that can't have children so therefore MUST have children at a fanatic "any cost", rather than looking at adoption or even that maybe there's too many ppl in the world already so one less in the world isn't such a bad thing.
The marriage status doesn't make you love someone any more or less whatever the gender.

Hasn't France just BANNED those face masks, skullcaps in schools etc

 

[London Geezer]

I can't believe what i read here. Religion and Law had nothing to do with each other. So why a law against mariage of homosexuals? Next law, al ugly women have to carry masks (or that thing the taliban used for there women)?

What wrong if you love someone of the same sex, you don't hurt anybody whit you're feelings.
Oh and all you religious people, do you only have sex to reproduce?

Or is it because i work in Amsterdam i'm way to liberal

WOW... Now THAT was an incoherent stream of consciousness..... i mean, kudos, not even i could do such a good job! Just kidding....





Anyway,

What I was saying is as a single person, if you are ill and claim sickpay + say rent/mortgage, etc you are entitled to recieve these cost of living expenses but if you are married your partners salary is taken into consideration and you cannot claim for your share of the bills even though you paid in the same amount as a single person. Therefore, logically you would be far better off without the marriage status.

Even married ppl's pensions are lower than 2 single persons pensions (by about 50%)

Evidently those people bragging about the whole same-sex-union thing are not the ones claiming benefits. In fact, they couldn't care less about benefits at all, rather about all those advantages they will get once their union is legally on the same level as straight ones. Unless i missed a few points here and there...

 

[Legion]

What I am saying is that you cannot force yourself to be attracted to something that you naturally are not . If you think that you can, then ask yourself, could you make yourself attracted to someone of the same sex.

really, so you can't force yourself to like something that you dislike? I can't force myself to find something attractive that i never did in the first place? This is fact?

well then i stick to my pedophilia analogy. If they can't force themselves to be attracted to children then they must have been born that way. I guess we are just punishing them for something they can't help.

 

[Legion]

Sigh. All the talk about pedophiles is moot. Pedophiles are trying to have sex with children. Children have been legally defined as people who are incapable of making sexual decisions with adults, and cannot consent to any sexual activity with those "of age". Thus Pedophilia is basically similar to rape. Arbitrary, but true.

You are again confusing control issues of child molester and attraction issues of pedophiles. Infact a pedophile is one who has a fixation on children and often incapable of caring on relationships with adult males or females. So again this has little to do with societal defined norms of sexual consent and more to do with psychological development. The legal argument is infact moot. It has nothing to do with the nature of their attraction to the underdeveloped body of a pubescent child. It has more to do with our legalities. Consent laws could disappear but the psychological definition of pedophilia would exist because its not directly based on an arbitrary legal definition.

ped·o·phile ( P ) Pronunciation Key (pd-fl, pd-)
n.
An adult who is sexually attracted to a child or children.

http://members.cox.net/kenny50/molester_vs_pedophile.htm

http://www.paedosexualitaet.de/pedo/def.html

"Expert opinion seems to favour the view that the term "paedophile" should not be used to cover all adults who commit sexual offences against children (of whatever age). For example, under the American Psychiatric Association criteria, a person can be a paedophile without ever having sexually molested or abused a child, and can sexually molest a child without being a paedophile. The categories of child molester and paedophile overlap, but are not identical. Some paedophiles simply phantasise or act out their fantasies in ways that are not illegal. Conversely, some persons sexually abuse children without having any attraction to them, as the Victorian Government's submission explained.

 

[Legion]

Most pedophiles have defects taht cause them to be that way. Either cause from abuse or imbalancing in his brain .

Oh fucking hell. Does anyone actually believe the "pedophilia is equivalent to homosexuality" argument? It's total bullshit. Why? A pedophile engages in sexual activity with a child (or at least tries to). A homosexual engages in sexual activity with a consenting adult.

See the difference? Adult? Child? Yeah. Okay. Case rested.

As if on an organic level this is relevant...

"Oh fucking hell. Does anyone actually believe the "homosexuality is equivalent to heterosexuality" argument? It's total bullshit. Why? A homosexual engages in sexual activity with a person of the same sex (or at least tries to). A heterosexual engages in sexual activity with a person of the opposite sex.

See the difference? Opposite? Same? Yeah. Okay. Case rested."

I thought i might poke fun at the spurious nature of this argument.

I guess i just made an excellent argument against gay marriage...right.

 

[Natoma]

Most pedophiles have defects taht cause them to be that way. Either cause from abuse or imbalancing in his brain .

Oh fucking hell. Does anyone actually believe the "pedophilia is equivalent to homosexuality" argument? It's total bullshit. Why? A pedophile engages in sexual activity with a child (or at least tries to). A homosexual engages in sexual activity with a consenting adult.

See the difference? Adult? Child? Yeah. Okay. Case rested.

Apparently some can't see the difference Baron. See just above.

 

[Legion]

Most pedophiles have defects taht cause them to be that way. Either cause from abuse or imbalancing in his brain .

Oh fucking hell. Does anyone actually believe the "pedophilia is equivalent to homosexuality" argument? It's total bullshit. Why? A pedophile engages in sexual activity with a child (or at least tries to). A homosexual engages in sexual activity with a consenting adult.

See the difference? Adult? Child? Yeah. Okay. Case rested.

Apparently some can't see the difference Baron. See just above.

Of course because some are opporating with an incorrect definition of what a paedophile is...right...because sexual orientation is a dimorphic genetic predisposition...yeah...and so much evidence backs this up...sure.

 

[Natoma]

Moving along.........

 

[Legion]

Moving along.........

be my guest.