Ideas for troll-free forums

[Shifty Geezer]

Debate in the console forum has seen a lot of complaining of late about trolling as newbies have appeared and 'old favourites' reincarnated one way or another. This is a problem of all forums but i've been thinking of possible solutions, though they may not be possible with the present version of phpBB.

Idea one is that mod powers are extended on a per thread basis to the thread starter. A forum member creating a topic to discuss a particular idea can control how derailed it gets and can knock out trouble makers. This would add an extra layer of 'policing' that the mods don't need to pay constant attention, individuals get to talk about what they want, but there's no real restrictions to debate or freedom of speech (apart from forum rules) as anyone kicked off a thread by the 'thread-mod' can start their own to make their (what thread-mod regards as unwanted) points.

Idea two is for invitation only forums. Provide open public rooms for debate modded as they currently are, but extend invitations to those who've shown they can carry a debate without dropping into trollish/arsonistic tendencies to another forum that is free to be viewed by the public, but which only those invited can post. This'll ensure no quick-and-easy trouble-making on that forum as a pest would need to hold intelligent debate in the open forum for a few months before being granted access to the closed forum. Not many trolls will (or even can?) keep up that level of maturity for that long

 

[London Geezer]

Both ideas i had some time ago, though i think Dave said mod powers at thread level is not technically possible. Besides, someone who's not totally mature might just open his own thread and "decide what's good for it and what isn't" - giving way to one sided bitching contests with no way for intelligent people to respond.

I think it would be wise to make it harder or more kid-unfriendly to enter the forums. There are way too many kids coming here, signing up, crap all over the place, leave the forums in a right state, then go. To then forget their username, come back the week after under a new name, and start again.

Especially after E3 and with a whole new generation of consoles to bithc about, the console forum has been a little bit of a mess. Not helped by the fact that it's not covered by mods a lot. It's good when they're around, but it's useless to have 2 mods in the same timezone or close, going to work and sleep at about the same time, leaving the forum unwatched, then come back together, when really, only one mod is needed at any one time to extinguish the flames.

 

[Druga Runda]

idea one is to allow for thread "dictators" which might work, but I am not sure whether software allows it or not, and the secon is like the "developers" forum but than who gets the invitation, and surely the level of activity will drop.

Overall it is the price you pay for freedom, IMO it's worth it you are always free to skip the threads you consider unworthy, and mods lock the worst offenders anyhow.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Besides, someone who's not totally mature might just open his own thread and "decide what's good for it and what isn't" - giving way to one sided bitching contests with no way for intelligent people to respond.

True, but at least we can ignore those, plus the mods would still have powers to ban miscreants. It wouldn't stop pollution of the forum, but it could have a dramatic improvement over pollution of individual threads. Though as said, I don't think phpBB supports it. Maybe I should mail them with the suggestion?

but it's useless to have 2 mods in the same timezone or close, going to work and sleep at about the same time

Why are they going to sleep if they've got modding to do? Lightweights

 

[London Geezer]

Why are they going to sleep if they've got modding to do? Lightweights

I know it's totally unacceptable. Eating, drinking, sleeping and going to work shouldn't be allowed when you have a forum to take care of. I'll complain to Dave now.

 

[koldfuzion1]

Anyone like my sticky idea? (See my other thread-- feel free to lock it now that this one has gotten going). Just figured you'd create a couple stickies that cover the principal topics that involve all the mud-slinging and funnel most of that traffic there, with lighter policing in the stickies which are intended to be a bit more of a free for all that more senior folks can ignore. Then police other threads more heavily, if someone e.g. goes off topic on some Sony PR point, or starts some stupid thread like "Sony pwns M$ -- Discuss" they are gently reminded that that belongs up in the stickies. Then, they are not so gently reminded if they fail to comply. Maybe this has been attempted before with little success. Seems like a decent partial solution IMHO.

 

[Farid]

We need more mods, more mods who have banning rights too.

The general quality of the Console forum has reached an all time low.
Sonic and jvd do a great job, really, but there's still a lot to do, at least grant Sonic and jvd the rights to ban people.

Dave, Neeyik, can you guys use a little of your magical powers on the Console forum, please?

 

[London Geezer]

We need more mods, more mods who have banning rights too.

The general quality of the Console forum has reached an all time low.
Sonic and jvd do a great job, really, but there's still a lot to do, at least grant Sonic and jvd the rights to ban people.

Dave, Neeyik, can you guys use a little of your magical powers on the Console forum, please?

Neeyik sometimes sticks his nose in and cleans up a bit, but we need more of that. Like, there haven't been any mods on here for the last 9 hours. That's just too long, and just one more mod would be enough.

 

[Neeyik]

I do try but with work during the day (and often during the night), I just don't get the time to sit through the threads and moderate them - however, I don't mind it if people PM me to look at particular threads that need attention so if immediate attention isn't necessary, it's one solution to the problem.

Do bare in mind that I don't have mod rights for all forums; I don't think there is anything behind this, just a case of Dave not having sufficient spare time to sit down to perform admin work - basically, for Dave and others, it's a case of crushing B3D duties in wherever that's possible. In addition to the mod rights, I have no power to ban users as this is a decision for the EIC.

More mods might help but there is another way, one which in the long term has a far more satisfactory result. Don't bite back - I've seen far, far too many threads end up being locked because of regular, and normally sensible, forums users unable/unwilling to hold off with a put-down, rolling-eyes-smilie, etc. I use a physics teacher discussion board that has no moderators - we just all do it ourselves, so if any thread becomes to heated or overtly silly, we all just back off and leave it alone. Blatantly provocative threads simply aren't responded to at all.

For a forum such as the console board, this obviously isn't ever really going to happen. B3D picks up a huge amount of traffic from other sites and search engines, and purely by statistics alone we're going to end up with a reasonable degree of users who are just content with posting noise for the sake of it. Mind you, some people simply cannot help it - it's just the way they are and cannot actually see anything wrong with what they are doing.

To be honest, I'm a little in-between asking Dave for more mods or not; ideally B3D should need as little moderation (other than thread moving, closing of repeated topics, etc) as possible but even the most naive of us know this isn't possible just yet. The site content demands a typical user of, if I may say, above average intelligence and education - one would expect this to produce threads that need no administration but...

Dave's pretty busy with...ummm, something (tee hee) right now so might not get round to seeing this thread for a bit (even if he gets PM'd, so please don't folks!). Until we've had chance to discuss this properly, can I suggest the following rules for the time being?

(1) Reread your post before clicking submit - ask yourself: is there any need for this content or that remark? Am I just venting some anger or am I offering valid advice?

(2) Do not respond at all to threads that are clearly written by somebody who shows no regard for courteous discussion.

(3) If you see a thread going off-track then PM me. Then do (2)!

 

[Ragemare]

The site content demands a typical user of, if I may say, above average intelligence and education - one would expect this to produce threads that need no administration but...

Ha!

 

[digitalwanderer]

Best way to keep a forum troll free is to have ogres patrol it.

 

[jvd]

I was on the forum from 10pm est to 5am est and got back on at 11 am est . and i'm still on till most likely 5pm est . I'm on alot , my new job lets me peek in .


It would be nice if dave could give sonic ban powers so we don't have to bother him all the time . There are about 9 people that would get banned in a second and it would reduce 90% of our problems . but i don't think its possible on phpbb

 

[digitalwanderer]

It would be nice if dave could give sonic ban powers so we don't have to bother him all the time . There are about 9 people that would get banned in a second and it would reduce 90% of our problems . but i don't think its possible on phpbb

Nope, it can't be done on this board's software. We use the same at EB and hit the same dilema, it's how I weaseled an admin position.

 

[Sonic]

Why isn't it possible? I don't pretend to know the inner workings of this board's software but why can't it be implemented by the people who write it? Other board softwares let you ban people from individual forums like the cosnole board and they can post anywhere else. Even that would make a world of difference.

If us mods were to get banning privileges then I think it would be best to commuiacate with each other first so there are no surprises.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Now I'm informed Sonic and jvd don't have banning capabilities, the presence of some individuals makes sense. I wondered how some managed to stay around even when they were known trouble makers but if all that can be done by the forum mods is edit their trolling, it sounds like a time consuming and rather ineffecient method.

Considering the popularity of phpBB I'm surprised there's not more support for forum modding. There must be a lot of call for it.

 

[koldfuzion1]

Another small suggestion: a Hall of Shame. Again, maybe this has been tried but I couldn't find one on here. Maybe not very useful deterrent, but at a minimum can be entertaining.

 

[Farid]

Considering the popularity of phpBB I'm surprised there's not more support for forum modding. There must be a lot of call for it.

There are tons of mods* for phpBB, including mods that gives Moderators temporary and permanent ban rights.
It just that most of thoses mods, or hacks, have to be recoded for each update of the forum software, which can or not be trivial.

*As in modification.

 

[digitalwanderer]

It just that most of thoses mods, or hacks, have to be recoded for each update of the forum software, which can or not be trivial.

Trivial or not it's usually a pain in the ass and ends up breaking something. :?

 

[Farid]

Trivial or not it's usually a pain in the ass and ends up breaking something. :?

If you're using a bunch of hacks, and if you're just a script-kiddy (Copy/Paste), then yes it's usually a chore that ends up screwing the whole board.
But if you stick with only one hack you should be able to deal with it.

Personaly, I think the easier solution would be to give Sonic the Admin position, he would use his power only on the console forum, and he and jvd would at least be able to help some of the trolls to the door.

 

[bloodbob]

I'm pretty sure this forum is using pretty standard code. Suggesting reasonable large code changes probably isn't a useful idea.

Give killer and DW mod rights to all the forums. Problem solved.