Haswell vs Kaveri

Discussion in 'Architecture and Products' started by AnarchX, Feb 8, 2012.

  1. Blazkowicz

    Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2004
    Messages:
    5,607
    Likes Received:
    256
    To rephrase, it's like a taller Intel NUC with a high TDP Intel CPU (as long as 65W is considered "high" in this context) with Iris 5200 graphics.
    It's awesome, but it costs a fucking ton of money as it uses that almost experimental eDRAM die with high speed special connection to the CPU. From above review, it also has not enough cooling.
     
    #1341 Blazkowicz, Mar 20, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 20, 2014
  2. DSC

    DSC
    Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2003
    Messages:
    689
    Likes Received:
    3
  3. Wynix

    Veteran Regular

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2013
    Messages:
    1,052
    Likes Received:
    57
  4. 3dilettante

    Legend Alpha

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2003
    Messages:
    8,122
    Likes Received:
    2,873
    Location:
    Well within 3d
    Given the rumored 28nm standard bulk process and TDP reduction for Carrizo, a Kaveri vs. Carrizo thread may be a more appropriate.
     
  5. Wynix

    Veteran Regular

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2013
    Messages:
    1,052
    Likes Received:
    57
    :lol:

    :cry:
     
  6. Andrew Lauritzen

    Moderator Veteran

    Joined:
    May 21, 2004
    Messages:
    2,526
    Likes Received:
    454
    Location:
    British Columbia, Canada
    It's completely possible; different test scenarios make comparisons between them meaningless (let alone different patches of BF4). In particular, the scene they used in the Brix Pro review is known to be one of the heaviest in BF4 (outdoors, lots of objects and effects) single player whereas the scene they used in the Kaveri review is pretty light (indoors, small area).
     
  7. Priyadarshi

    Newcomer

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2012
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    USA
    But doesn't that make the review a bit meaningless since the reviewer can cherry pick the areas to show a greater performance difference between two GPUs. The only way to settle this is making a more comprehensive review using different maps.
     
  8. Lightman

    Veteran Subscriber

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2008
    Messages:
    1,804
    Likes Received:
    475
    Location:
    Torquay, UK

    BF4 map they tested Brix Pro on is the best case scenario for Iris Pro vs Kaveri as not only they used most CPU intensive scenario, they also dropped effects to Low. AMD tend to do relatively better the higher shader load as then it becomes more compute limited and less bandwidth constrained.

    Anyway it is only one measuring point, but it shows potential of Intel Graphics and what good solution to memory bandwidth can bring to socketed GPU's :)
     
  9. Andrew Lauritzen

    Moderator Veteran

    Joined:
    May 21, 2004
    Messages:
    2,526
    Likes Received:
    454
    Location:
    British Columbia, Canada
    No? Unless every review is meaningless...

    Agreed on the "low" part, but I don't think that area is particularly CPU intensive. I doubt Kaveri is CPU limited at 25-30fps - even on low... that would be ultra-sad for single player (and you'd see a much larger difference with Mantle in that case I think). More likely the difference in that scene is memory bandwidth-related as there are a lot of blend/post-FX things going on with the wind and rain.

    Easy to test though, just someone with a Kaveri load it up with those settings and check the GPU load.
     
  10. DSC

    DSC
    Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2003
    Messages:
    689
    Likes Received:
    3
  11. firstminion

    Newcomer

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2013
    Messages:
    217
    Likes Received:
    46
    Pretty much, yes. We can't say much with a sample size of one. OFC that doesn't apply only to tech reviews.
     
  12. Paran

    Regular Newcomer

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2011
    Messages:
    251
    Likes Received:
    14
    This is new to me, Intel recommends multi-rank memory.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  13. homerdog

    homerdog donator of the year
    Legend Veteran Subscriber

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2008
    Messages:
    6,153
    Likes Received:
    928
    Location:
    still camping with a mauler
    This is in reference to IGP performance right? Doubt it would make much difference with a discreet GPU in there.
     
  14. Paran

    Regular Newcomer

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2011
    Messages:
    251
    Likes Received:
    14
    Integrated GPU of course.
     
  15. Andrew Lauritzen

    Moderator Veteran

    Joined:
    May 21, 2004
    Messages:
    2,526
    Likes Received:
    454
    Location:
    British Columbia, Canada
    Wow, 7% is more different than I would have thought. Granted this is a specific graphics benchmark but still.
     
  16. Psycho

    Regular

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2008
    Messages:
    745
    Likes Received:
    39
    Location:
    Copenhagen
  17. Andrew Lauritzen

    Moderator Veteran

    Joined:
    May 21, 2004
    Messages:
    2,526
    Likes Received:
    454
    Location:
    British Columbia, Canada
    The 4670k is a GT2 GPU whereas the one Intel tested is GT3 (i.e. twice as big). It's definitely expected that the latter will be much more significantly bottlenecked by DRAM bandwidth than the former.

    I'm curious how much it matters for Iris Pro though... i.e. how much of that "scatter" parallelism is the EDRAM just able to eat directly? Someone should do a test :)
     
  18. mczak

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2002
    Messages:
    3,015
    Likes Received:
    112
    That would be true if they'd have the same TDP but they do not. From some quick googling it seems the 28W GT3 is slightly slower than a 84W GT2 (which is most likely always running at max IGP clocks) in vantage (p score). Even the projected performance in that slide with 31/35W would only make that roughly equal, so I would expect them to be similarly affected.
    The slide doesn't mention it, is the memory really running at ddr3-1600 or something lower to artificially exaggerate the differences?
     
  19. Paran

    Regular Newcomer

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2011
    Messages:
    251
    Likes Received:
    14
    28W Iris is heavily memory bottlenecked.
     
  20. mczak

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2002
    Messages:
    3,015
    Likes Received:
    112
    Yes but the math doesn't work out the slightest bit if you assume GT3 is heavily bottlenecked but GT2 is not, if they both have roughly the same performance in the end (it would essentially mean the GT2 would be not bottlenecked at all by bandwidth, whereas any additional shader capacity the GT3 has is completely wasted due to bandwidth constraints). Because both have very similar performance in the end, both should be equally bottlenecked by bandwidth, therefore both should benefit similarly from dual rank memory. At least unless there's a specific reason why GT2 could not benefit from more open pages (which is possible maybe GT3 having twice the ROPs could play a role here).
     
Loading...

Share This Page

  • About Us

    Beyond3D has been around for over a decade and prides itself on being the best place on the web for in-depth, technically-driven discussion and analysis of 3D graphics hardware. If you love pixels and transistors, you've come to the right place!

    Beyond3D is proudly published by GPU Tools Ltd.
Loading...