Gabe Newell: Valve will release its own console-like PC

I think this will have a real uphill struggle against the new next gen consoles.

It wont offer much of anything they wont, actually a good deal less (especially than XBO with all it's Kinect/multimedia shenanigans). The graphics wont be vastly better, especially than the next gen consoles for several years, and the pricing will also be higher. PC's are also just infinitely more complicated than console, another barrier. Any controllers will also be much less sophisticated (consider MS claimed to invest $100 million in XBO controller, and that's just basically an enhancement of 360 controller)

Getting another layer of AA (cant even say higher res since most TV's are 1080P) or what have you on your graphical settings over the next gen consoles wont compel anybody but a few.
 
If you want simultaneous users in both rooms, the long video cable will be an unworkable solution. One PC, two displays, two sets of keyb/mouse, that does infighting and constant stealing of focus and input events. You would need a VM solution with USB passthrough as a minimum, preferably VGA passthrough (a real GPU used by a VM).

With the steambox frontend to a desktop PC there still can be a problem : Microsoft doesn't allow simultaneous use unless you spend about $1000 in software licenses (you need Windows Server and a remote use license. At least, games and all run on it : it's just an edition of Windows 7 or 8)

Linux on a desktop PC that streams games to a steambox frontend could be a workable solution - you limit yourself to a limited linux Steam subset of games. But if possible that's an interesting nerdy solution.

At that point, even running a long cable is an unknown concept to most of the general population though. Lots of people can't even plug a computer into some random audio gear even though a very cheap cable is all what's needed (even if you want to plug a brand new computer into a 40 year old audio receiver, or a 20 year old computer into a brand new amp)
 
My guess is even in the case of PC plus Steam Machine - 2 users will not be able to be supported. I cannot see how somebody can do anything meaningfull on a computer that is busy streaming Crysis 3.
 
My guess is even in the case of PC plus Steam Machine - 2 users will not be able to be supported. I cannot see how somebody can do anything meaningfull on a computer that is busy streaming Crysis 3.


There's plenty of free CPU time. Let's say your PC is very powerful (i5, FX etc.) and the game uses 90% of CPU resources, you then have 10% of a fast multicore CPU left to browse beyond3D, listen to music etc.
That's with a really exceptionally multithreaded game, a game might use less.
If you're CPU strained, modern OSes (like Windows XP and up, linux etc.) support changing the priorities in the task manager and such. So the game can have highest priority, or maybe a Skype video chat has highest priority, a video encoding in the background (when you don't care how long it takes) can have lowest priority, your browser at medium.. It should work. PCs can do that stuff anyway (4 to 12 CPU threads, huge memory, SSD and/or multiple hard drives)

Six years ago I ran into a trouble with simultaneous usage. With a role reversal : game was played on the PC that runs it (Warcraft III on Wine), a couple desktops were streamed to thin clients (it's linux, doing that is free if someone sets it up)
There were annoying Warcraft slowdowns, with that guy who visited graphics intensive websites, with flash plugin. Setting the game's priority higher made it more bearable. Then the PC was upgraded from single core Athlon XP w/ 1.5GB to Q6600 w/ 4GB.. Problem gone.
 
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Yes Valve have shown little info so far

We all agree that consoles can extract more performance than a equivalant PC eg try doing last of us / uncharted3 / GTA5 / killzone etc on a similar specced PC with 512mb memory. Impossible

I just ran geekbench on the same machine linux & win 8
Linux
285 MB memory used to get to desktop
http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench3/84758
single core 2735 multicore 9125

Windows 8
1305MB memory used to get to desktop
http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench3/84769
single core 2662 multicore 8739

singlecore 2.75% faster
multicore 4.41% faster

OK not much improvement in CPU power (big difference in memory footprint though) but what I expect is the steam OS will have a very thin layer between the OS->graphics card. OK the OS will be less stable (game crashing can bring down the machine) but the performance difference will be huge, close to what a console OS can do, esp if the game is draw call bound

I wouldnt be surprised if the same game would be
steam OS = 60hz, win 8 = 30hz or
steam OS = 1920p, win 8 = 720p

hell people overclock their machine to gain 20%, youre seriously telling me they wouldnt install another OS for a 100% improvement
 
Yes Valve have shown little info so far

We all agree that consoles can extract more performance than a equivalant PC eg try doing last of us / uncharted3 / GTA5 / killzone etc on a similar specced PC with 512mb memory. Impossible
If "mantle" (or Nvidia counter part I would be surprised if they don't follow suit) makes it to linux, it would further mitigate the difference between PC (running either linux or windows) and console.

http://techreport.com/news/25429/micron-sampling-2gb-hybrid-memory-cube
If Steam OS manages to maintain some traction by 2015 there should be pretty awesome hardware available.
 
Yes Valve have shown little info so far

We all agree that consoles can extract more performance than a equivalant PC eg try doing last of us / uncharted3 / GTA5 / killzone etc on a similar specced PC with 512mb memory. Impossible

I just ran geekbench on the same machine linux & win 8
Linux
285 MB memory used to get to desktop
http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench3/84758
single core 2735 multicore 9125

Windows 8
1305MB memory used to get to desktop
http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench3/84769
single core 2662 multicore 8739

singlecore 2.75% faster
multicore 4.41% faster

OK not much improvement in CPU power (big difference in memory footprint though) but what I expect is the steam OS will have a very thin layer between the OS->graphics card. OK the OS will be less stable (game crashing can bring down the machine) but the performance difference will be huge, close to what a console OS can do, esp if the game is draw call bound

I wouldnt be surprised if the same game would be
steam OS = 60hz, win 8 = 30hz or
steam OS = 1920p, win 8 = 720p

hell people overclock their machine to gain 20%, youre seriously telling me they wouldnt install another OS for a 100% improvement

You can replace Windows Explorer as shell manager with other less memory hungry programs.
 
If "mantle" (or Nvidia counter part I would be surprised if they don't follow suit) makes it to linux, it would further mitigate the difference between PC (running either linux or windows) and console.

http://techreport.com/news/25429/micron-sampling-2gb-hybrid-memory-cube
If Steam OS manages to maintain some traction by 2015 there should be pretty awesome hardware available.

MS has improved performance with each OS since vista , even 8.1 will use less resources than 8. I wouldn't be surprised if MS keeps this up through even more revisions of the OS .

But as some one asked , I wouldn't add another OS . The beauty of windows is that I can simply stop playing and move to another task.
 
@liolio yeah just reading about mantle, a bit of a coincidence. Yeah something like that or even a couple of tailor made opengl extensions. The thing is if the valve hardware spec guarantees it's gonna be there you can take Advantage of it. Esp if it's limited to only from one manufacturer eg amd or nvidia (not both). with direct x since it's gotta run at a higher level for stability etc and on greater diversity of hardware it can never compete performance wise.
 
OK not much improvement in CPU power (big difference in memory footprint though)
Memory is there to be used. Windows 8 does a fairly good job at releasing resources when another application needs them. Also there's something terribly wrong about stuff you've got installed on your machine. My Win8 w/o a lot of crap installed takes a little more than half a gig (and it should be sub-300MB on a clean machine AFAICT).
 
Steam controller:

controller.jpg


Complete catalog
The Steam Controller is designed to work with all the games on Steam: past, present, and future. Even the older titles in the catalog and the ones which were not built with controller support. (We’ve fooled those older games into thinking they’re being played with a keyboard and mouse, but we’ve designed a gamepad that’s nothing like either one of those devices.) We think you’ll agree that we’re onto something with the Steam Controller, and now we want your help with the design process.

Superior performance
Traditional gamepads force us to accept compromises. We’ve made it a goal to improve upon the resolution and fidelity of input that’s possible with those devices. The Steam controller offers a new and, we believe, vastly superior control scheme, all while enabling you to play from the comfort of your sofa. Built with high-precision input technologies and focused on low-latency performance, the Steam controller is just what the living-room ordered.

Dual trackpads
The most prominent elements of the Steam controller are its two circular trackpads. Driven by the player’s thumbs, each one has a high-resolution trackpad as its base. It is also clickable, allowing the entire surface to act as a button. The trackpads allow far higher fidelity input than has previously been possible with traditional handheld controllers. Steam gamers, who are used to the input associated with PCs, will appreciate that the Steam Controller’s resolution approaches that of a desktop mouse.

Whole genres of games that were previously only playable with a keyboard and mouse are now accessible from the sofa. RTS games. Casual, cursor-driven games. Strategy games. 4x space exploration games. A huge variety of indie games. Simulation titles. And of course, Euro Truck Simulator 2.

In addition, games like first-person shooters that are designed around precise aiming within a large visual field now benefit from the trackpads’ high resolution and absolute position control.

Haptics
Trackpads, by their nature, are less physical than thumbsticks. By themselves, they are “light touch” devices and don’t offer the kind of visceral feedback that players get from pushing joysticks around. As we investigated trackpad-based input devices, it became clear through testing that we had to find ways to add more physicality to the experience. It also became clear that “rumble”, as it has been traditionally implemented (a lopsided weight spun around a single axis), was not going to be enough. Not even close.

The Steam Controller is built around a new generation of super-precise haptic feedback, employing dual linear resonant actuators. These small, strong, weighted electro-magnets are attached to each of the dual trackpads. They are capable of delivering a wide range of force and vibration, allowing precise control over frequency, amplitude, and direction of movement.

This haptic capability provides a vital channel of information to the player - delivering in-game information about speed, boundaries, thresholds, textures, action confirmations, or any other events about which game designers want players to be aware. It is a higher-bandwidth haptic information channel than exists in any other consumer product that we know of. As a parlour trick they can even play audio waveforms and function as speakers.

Touch Screen
In the center of the controller is another touch-enabled surface, this one backed by a high-resolution screen. This surface, too, is critical to achieving the controller’s primary goal - supporting all games in the Steam catalog. The screen allows an infinite number of discrete actions to be made available to the player, without requiring an infinite number of physical buttons.

The whole screen itself is also clickable, like a large single button. So actions are not invoked by a simple touch, they instead require a click. This allows a player to touch the screen, browse available actions, and only then commit to the one they want. Players can swipe through pages of actions in games where that’s appropriate. When programmed by game developers using our API, the touch screen can work as a scrolling menu, a radial dial, provide secondary info like a map or use other custom input modes we haven’t thought of yet.

In order to avoid forcing players to divide their attention between screens, a critical feature of the Steam Controller comes from its deep integration with Steam. When a player touches the controller screen, its display is overlayed on top of the game they’re playing, allowing the player to leave their attention squarely on the action, where it belongs.

Buttons
Every button and input zone has been placed based on frequency of use, precision required and ergonomic comfort. There are a total of sixteen buttons on the Steam Controller. Half of them are accessible to the player without requiring thumbs to be lifted from the trackpads, including two on the back. All controls and buttons have been placed symmetrically, making left or right handedness switchable via a software config checkbox.

Shared configurations
In order to support the full catalog of existing Steam games (none of which were built with the Steam Controller in mind), we have built in a legacy mode that allows the controller to present itself as a keyboard and mouse. The Steam Community can use the configuration tool to create and share bindings for their favorite games. Players can choose from a list of the most popular configurations.

Openness
The Steam Controller was designed from the ground up to be hackable. Just as the Steam Community and Workshop contributors currently deliver tremendous value via additions to software products on Steam, we believe that they will meaningfully contribute to the design of the Steam Controller. We plan to make tools available that will enable users to participate in all aspects of the experience, from industrial design to electrical engineering. We can’t wait to see what you come up with.


controller_bindings.jpg





Wow I dont know what to think. Seems like it could be a bit of a revolution, or fall flat on it's face. I've always contemplated a major change in the controller paradigm, something more like mouse keyboard. This looks like a proper attempt, but I cant tell from looking at it if it'll work at all.
 
Disappointing I think. Doesn't seem to actually solve the keyboard issue. For instance as someone who plays dota, I don't believe this is a practical solution. I'm not against the controller itself per say, but it's just another controller to me.

Thus the problem remains, how do I play dota on my couch? :cry: :p (cue "but just buy a bluetooth kb/mouse...")
 
That controller ... so weird. I'm honestly very curious to try it, because it's so different than what we've had for yours and years. It's basically a dual mouse. How f'ed is that?
 
Disappointing I think. Doesn't seem to actually solve the keyboard issue. For instance as someone who plays dota, I don't believe this is a practical solution. I'm not against the controller itself per say, but it's just another controller to me.

Thus the problem remains, how do I play dota on my couch? :cry: :p (cue "but just buy a bluetooth kb/mouse...")

Hot keys mapped to the touch screen? I have no idea if that would be suitable or not, just throwing it out there.
 
Hot keys mapped to the touch screen? I have no idea if that would be suitable or not, just throwing it out there.

Up, down, left, right, diagonal up to the right, diagonal up to the left, diagonal down to the right, diagonal down to the left, circle clockwise, circle counter clockwise, letter L, upside down L, inverted L, inverted upside-down L, lightning bolt, boobs, letter c, triangle ...

So many options that could never possible get confusing ;)
 
Wow, major kudos to Valve for finally implementing haptic tech into major consumer product!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUWy2GW7XQ4

The haptic feedback seems similar to the new rumble in the Xbox One controller, and the touchscreen is similar to the touchpad on the PS4. So it's like the hybrid of those two controllers, but replacing the sticks with dual trackpads. It's kind of crazy and genius, but maybe horrible to use at first. I'd like to try it, even though I think it will be an absolute failure with gamers, who are the most change-averse crybabies in the known universe.
 
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