DirectX Next - Longhorn only !?

[ninelven]

It’s generally agreed that SM3.0 requires a move to 32 bit floats (some still think it’s not)
But - The spec requires it...

I think what it is saying here is that some ATI employees feel that fp24 would be sufficient at this time. However the spec requires fp32, and even if R420 supported all the SM3.0 features, it wouldn't get the badge on a technicality.

Steer people away from flow control in ps3.0 because we expect it to hurt badly. [Also it’s the main extra feature on NV40 vs R420 so let’s discourage people from using it until R5xx shows up with decent performance...]

It is indeed talking about flow control here. My question, at first, would be: does it hurt badly for R420 only or for both chips. Then there is the use of "expect" so, I would conclude that they don't expect NV40 to be very fast with flow control, but they really don't know for sure. On the other hand, they seem to be quite certain R500 will be fast here .

 

[KimB]

Two weeks, guys. Have patience.

All we do no for sure is that ATI's next part will not have pixel shader branching support.

Branching is, of course, a performance optimization. Sometimes it will be faster, sometimes it will be slower. Hopefully drivers will become smart enough to figure out which is which and always pick the faster route.

 

[oddfellow]

Two weeks, guys. Have patience.

Yep, I guess you're right.

*sigh*

 

[mreman4k]

Digital wanderer, I read that more to mean that it will be the R420 myself ... I mean they know everything, so the comment only makes sense in the "dont tip off too much information" kind of way.

You arent going to tell someone who knows R500 is coming out this year with 512 MB not to mention that the R420 is coming out this year with 512 MB. Makes little sense, would be like putting "dont lie about this" in there. Which doesnt seem the style of the rest of the comments.

I interpreted that part exactly the same way. To me that means..

"Hey we have a 512MB R420, but dont mention that is a R420, just that we have a 512MB card... "

 

[Dave Baumann]

I am surprised at the proposition that they sell more integrated graphics chipsets then Nvidia, considering the popularity of nforce and relative obscurity of ATi's offering.

I always thought that most of the NF2 chipsets sold included the SPP, not the IGP as a northbridge.

The popular school of though regarding NV's integrated was that, generally, nForce was a relatively expensive, high end chipset because of the high level of features it employs - this is of course not the market for high volume integrated chipsets, as these are usually the lower end of the market. In both of ATI's chipsets they have targetted a very low end price point purposely for volume.

 

[Laa-Yosh]

To me that means..

"Hey we have a 512MB R420, but dont mention that is a R420, just that we have a 512MB card... "

Actually he does not mention whose card it is, ATI or Nvidia

 

[MfA]

BTW I say again, this should be on the front page

 

[speng]

This is certainly entertaining.

Speng.

 

[oddfellow]

It’s generally agreed that SM3.0 requires a move to 32 bit floats (some still think it’s not)
But - The spec requires it...

I think what it is saying here is that some ATI employees feel that fp24 would be sufficient at this time. However the spec requires fp32, and even if R420 supported all the SM3.0 features, it wouldn't get the badge on a technicality.

Yep. Even if the meaning of the rest of the notes on that slide are in dispute, here he seems to be suggesting that technically R420 does not support shader model 3.

I wonder what features nVidia will be pushing on their launch??

 

[hoom]

Well I'm reading it like r420 is being called sm3.0 with full vs3.0 and absolute minimum ps3.0 with very limited (please don't use it) or no ps3.0 flow control.
Remember, the min spec for ps3.0 is relatively minor, while its the optional extras like flow control that get iffy.

Reading the bits about Directx next, doesn't it look like he's talking about r500?
If r500 is sm4.0, then surely r420 must be the sm3.0 hardware they are talking about.
Or is r600 expected by then?

 

[digitalwanderer]

Time for me "thicky-question-o-the-day"....what is "flow-control" and why is it important?

 

[Trawler]

Well I'm reading it like r420 is being called sm3.0 with full vs3.0 and absolute minimum ps3.0 with very limited (please don't use it) or no ps3.0 flow control.

I agree. Why else would ATI devote two whole slides to SM3 if it's not something they'd be supporting in the near future?

 

[g__day]

What an amazing find!!!

Interesting to see R500 is when ATi is finally moving to a cached virtual memory system for textures - like a CPU uses for paging!

 

[Tahir2]

Time for me "thicky-question-o-the-day"....what is "flow-control" and why is it important?

'Flow control' is when you can 'control' the 'flow' ... ahem

 

[Bambers]

Time for me "thicky-question-o-the-day"....what is "flow-control" and why is it important?

google is your friend .

Flow control in programming is branching and loops. i.e. in basic its the if...then, for...next and similar statements

 

[digitalwanderer]

Thanks Bambers (and sort of Tahir ). If I google the terms here I usually just end up more confused as the explanations I find are generally more technical than my original question. (I have GOT to find a good basic tutorial on modern vid cards and put some edumacation time in with it, I'm behind on my homework again. )


EDITED BITS: Oh yeah, I heard back from someone at ATi and they were a bit shocked as hell to find out about this and are probably stirring up things a bit behind the scenes as I type.

 

[Tahir2]

I thought my explanation was better... you know from one thicky to another.

But you prefer Bambers 'technical' description.. fine.. hmpph!

 

[Ante P]

So what's the next buzzword? TPU?

 

[DemoCoder]

If this presentation is from ATi, then it confirms what I always knew. ATi does marketing the same way as nVidia.

No way. ATI is a pure, ethical, corp fighting for truth and justice. They would never stoop to underhanded PR tactics. Their HW speaks for itself, remember, no need to downplay other people's HW with PR. I bet this presentation was written by NVidia, which then hacked into ATI's website and uploaded it there.

Of course, there are two ways to view this. NVidia is more evil than ATI. Or, NVidia does a piss poor job at hiding it, and ATI is very sneaky.

 

[whql]

Well, Huddy probably picked up a few things during his years at nvidia.