Cell in PS3, was it worth the wait?

Acert93

Artist formerly known as Acert93
Legend
Yes, worth the wait.

Look, from the way the fabs were shaping up a lot of us who were not over projecting were looking at a 1:8 cell under 4GHz. 3.2GHz is surprising a little, but a 1:7 makes sense (and I believe nAo even had mentioned that a few months ago as a possiblity due to yields).

Still, you are looking at 218GFLOPs and an INSANELY fast memory architecture/bus.

What I think is more surprising is how the xCPU outdid itself. Many of us were skeptical that it would break 3GHz. In fact they hit 3.2GHz and hit 115GFLOPs. Impressive indeed.

Not as impressive as 218GFLOPs, but these are just all paper numbers. I tend to think the CELL, once gotten under control (especially the SPE cache size) it will be better because it is designed from the ground up to be multithreaded/stream.

The CELL also is totally scalable--to judge CELL this gen misses the big picture. PS is now officially a PLATFORM. I suspect we may see something like a 4:32 CELL @ 8GHz in 6 years, maybe even 8:64. The tools will already be in place, and progammers will have the basics handily whipped. And since it is built to scale I see the PS4 as potentually a "dream machine". Not sure what MS will have an answer for this... there will be something, but I doubt anything as high performing as CELL. Call me pessimistic. But we have already begun to see diminishing returns soo...

I think CELL lived up to its expectations--at least mine.

xCPU over achieved. It should be fairly easy to program for also, it has 1MB of L2 cache (compared to 512K for the CELL). And I really see the 3 PPC cores downplayed.

Maybe someone here can answer this: The PPC cores take up a ton of realestate, much more than a SPE. But we tend to focus on the SPE/VMX units. Obviously the PPC core is valiable, if not MS could have gone with a PPC with 8 VMX--but they did not. The PPC is good at Integer and basic processing.

True, it may not be great at physics (VMX for those) or vertex shaders (VMX and VS units on the GPU), but it can do a lot right.

So, what am I missing? If the PPC cores are useless why use all the realestate for them? Why do we rarely mention the performance of the PPC cores? If the PPC cores are usless for gaming why did not MS just go with more VMX units or something? PPC are useful for something, right?
 
PC-Engine said:
The XDR memory doesn't seem like it's insanely fast compared to GDDR3.

Yeah, what up with that? I recall some people projecting 60GB/s from Yellowstone. Unless I am missing something, right now it looks just as fast and probably 3 times more expansive.
 
I seem to remember thoughts on the Toshiba multistream video demo from awhile back, wondering how that would translate to HD and they showed that 12 simultaneously could be possible during the conference.

Each SPE is capable of 32 single precision GFLOPS @ 4Ghz, at 3.2 Ghz the aggregate GFLOPS are 179.2 for 7 SPE's, giving the PPE roughly 39 GFLOPS to make up the remainder. Sound reasonably comparable to each of the XCPU triple cores? Hopefully they scale reasonably linearly with clockspeed.
 
RE: Topic Title

I'll answer that after I've played a few PS3 games.

OT: I love Tacitblue's sig. It will be even better if you can make it bold, coloured, and flashing.
 
Acert93 said:
So, what am I missing? If the PPC cores are useless why use all the realestate for them? Why do we rarely mention the performance of the PPC cores? If the PPC cores are usless for gaming why did not MS just go with more VMX units or something? PPC are useful for something, right?


They're useful for operations that's not just hardcore number crunching I suppose.
As far as I know, and I really don't know I'm just guessing, the VMX units works more or less like the SIMD units found in a most PC processors - it was a couple of years ago that I worked with this kind of stuff so don't flame me - so they can't do conditional branching and other neat stuff that programmers have been spoiled with over the years.
Brains and brawns, I guess.
But please note that this guess conflicts quite a bit with the whole IOE thing.

Perhaps a single PPC with a lot of VMX units would have trouble feeding those units all by itself and at the same time try keep up with all the other tasks, unless the VMX units themselves would be a bit more advanced and self reliant... like CELL :D
 
My question is: why didn't MS add more vmx units? Or even add a PPU?

Just look at how the MS execs make excuses for the lack of floating point computing power. If they just added a PhysX chip, they wouldn't have to make lame excuses. X360 will always have the stigma of being underpowered now. I predict this decision not to add more "floppage" will come back to bite them. PS3 will take the majority of the videogame console marketshare.
 
My question is: why didn't MS add more vmx units? Or even add a PPU?

Just look at how the MS execs make excuses for the lack of floating point computing power. If they just added a PhysX chip, they wouldn't have to make lame excuses. X360 will always have the stigma of being underpowered now. I predict this decision not to add more "floppage" will come back to bite them. PS3 will take the majority of the videogame console marketshare.

Besides Fanboys, would anyone care? Comparing XCPU to CELL by simply counting FMAC-FLOPS does not yield a lot of meaningful information.
 
bbot said:
My question is: why didn't MS add more vmx units? Or even add a PPU?
Because it gets too hot or exponentially expensive because of yield problems. Do you want MS XBOX business in the red forever?
 
MrSingh said:
7SPE's functional, but another will be reserved for OS/security...

Singh, the specs the PDF from SCEI's site) say 7 SPE's functional with one used for yields: so if one goes to PS/Security it will be one of those 7 SPE's.

Were you trying to say this instead: "7SPE's functional, but 1 of them will be reserved for OS/security..." ?
 
jvd said:
Cell ?

As great as they made it out to sound ?

Doesn't Cell have the performance they were saying all along? One SPE = 32GFLOPs.

The whole 1TFLOP thing (which they "reached" anyway, thanks to Tinkerbell's gold powder) was always about 4 8 cells together...

But yeah, definately a cool processor.

Still not too sure about what they said in the conference, that we'll be able to play games simultaneously to browsing the net or watching moveis. That sounds way too PC to me. I'd want my games to use the full power of the PS3 with no overhead left for "other stuff". If you know what i mean.
 
I don't think sony has put much thought into the online aspects of the console . I don't think thats sony's strength either. I think thier strength is the other media features . I think ms's strength will be online . Ms has alot of experiance with it . The only bummer is no wifi built into the x360 .
 
jvd said:
I don't think sony has put much thought into the online aspects of the console .
If you think so then you should watch what SCEI CTO Masa Chatani had to say in the E3 conference.
 
jvd said:
I don't think sony has put much thought into the online aspects of the console . I don't think thats sony's strength either. I think thier strength is the other media features . I think ms's strength will be online . Ms has alot of experiance with it . The only bummer is no wifi built into the x360 .

It really is funny to see the roles being inversed this time around. MS are the ones making you buy addons for certain features (wi-fi) and Sony the ones including everything you need straight in the box...
Go figure...
 
one said:
jvd said:
I don't think sony has put much thought into the online aspects of the console .
If you think so then you should watch what SCEI CTO Masa Chatani had to say in the E3 conference.
i don't need to watch. Just listen and thats because they didn't show anything . Ms already has a fleshed out world that works .
 
Back
Top