Bioshock: Anyone think it's overrated

[Todd33]

Bioshock has received many perfect 10s, so why is it I find it almost a chore to keep slogging through it? Fort Frolic was a great level, but it was lagging before that and does after it (I'm at the point where I

Spoiler

killed Ryan, then my game crashed

).

Things that I dislike:

• Vending machines, ruins the immersive nature. Who puts ammo and stuff in vending machines?
• Too many things, ammo types, weapons, plasmids, etc. You don't need or use 1/3 of it, so it feels like filler.
• After killing you 20th Big Daddy and your 100th Splicer the combat gets stale. Respawning makes it worse.
• Death is meaningless with the chambers, same is true for the health packs and plasmids and upgrades related to health.
• Hacking. It was cool the first few dozen times, the mini-game gets old fast and kills the immersion.
• Money, I have to buy junk yet I can't hold more than $500. Running back to bodies for cash is fun, really.
• No NPCs to interact with, everyone is dead or dies immediately. It feels like a nightmare world instead of a real one, but the "scary" nightmare feeling wears off after a couple of hours.
• Combat gets too easy too fast. The first few Big Daddies require a lot of thinking and work, after you get upgraded plasmids and weapons you can kill all slicers instantly and BDs in 20 secs.

The game does most things right, it pulls you in but then fails to keep you immersed. After a few levels I'm just running around grabbing junk and flipping switches because a voice in my head tells me too, the big arrow make the whole thing trivial. The story isn't bad, but I find myself playing it just to get to the end, maybe it's just too long?

Maybe the game has a strong finish, but so far I'd give it a solid 8.9/10.

 

[valioso]

Personally I thought it was one of the best fps's I have played.

 

[AlphaWolf]

Personally I thought it was one of the best fps's I have played.

Agreed, since deus ex there's nothing I've enjoyed as much. And since its been so long since I played that it could just be my memory playing tricks on me.

 

[digitalwanderer]

You have some valid arguments there Todd, but I think the game succeeded way more than it failed in delivering fun immersion.

Every game is going to have some unrealistic bits, and I prefer more options in how to interact with the world than less. I personally find the concept of a city built under the ocean in the 50's a bit harder to stomach than ammo lying around, where do we draw the "realistic" line?

I give the game a 9.5 just because it took some chances and for the most part pulled 'em off.

Oh, and for the plot. One of the surprises actually surprised the hell out of me and is now among my great gaming memories.

Take a guess which moment, would you kindly?

 

[swaaye]

It was a decent game, but I think Shock 2 was better. I just played that a little over a year ago now. It has such great ambience to it, and it was a really cool environment to wander around in. I liked the more complex RPG elements as well. There's no denying that Bioshock created a fascinating world though.

Bioshock really did seem like a console-ized version of the Shock 2 gameplay. Much less complicated, really. Though this could also be seen as just consolidation of the basic elements of Shock 2's gameplay. Some of what Shock 2 did was over-the-top in complexity. Still, there's little reason to replay Bioshock from a character development standpoint (alternate little sister storyline isn't THAT enticing). There is just very little you'll miss the first time through.

I'd probably give it an 8/10.

 

[rbushner]

I don't think it's quite a 10, but it is pretty close.

The things that are done well, are done exceptionally well, there just are a couple annoying things that bring it down.

Spoiler

I'm torn on whether the extensive fetch quests where to illustrate the whole "would you kindly" thing or just a way to try and make backtracking not seem repetitive. After this point (where Atlas is exposed) the game really seems to be a grind.

I didn't find it having much replayability, the first time through was fun, the storyline was far more intriguing to me than the gameplay. It's a great game though, easily one of the best this year.

9.7

 

[woundingchaney]

I think just about everyone has a tendency to lower their initial opinions of a title when looking at it in retrospect. This is the case for me with Bioshock. The initial play through was one of the most enjoyable fps games I have encountered in the last 4 years, but without a mp or any real reason to play through it its mainly just sitting on my hdd now.


If anything the game is a great game and imo should always be considered as so, but it just doesnt have long enough legs to keep me enticed for more than a month.

 

[Acert93]

There will always be people who dislike a game that hundreds like. Dimes-to-Dollars and all.

With Top10 rated games there is only the ability to be overrated or correctly rated. A lower scoring game has an equal amount of consumers thinking it is underrated as well as overrated.

If someone can give a game an 8 or 9 because certain elements (no MP, too long, etc) aren't to their specific tastes and not necessarily faults, it is a good indication that the issue is possibly more one of preference and not rating.

Btw, I think the subject line and poll aren't very compatible. The scoring range is too narrow, and just because someone thinks the game is a 9.2, we don't know how their grading scale compares to other critical outlets, if they like the general genre (or the story), etc They are asking two quite distinct questions: Is the game overrated (title), and, what would you rate the game (poll). I can give a game a 9.0 rating when Metacritic gave it a 9.5 and not think it is overrated.

Finally, 360 games = overrated; PS3 games = underrated. How many threads have we seen engage in this theme? A harmless thread, but past transgressions of these forums should have worn out any goodwill toward debating other people's opinions and critical acclaim. [EDIT: I will add the fact that open discussion of conspiracies in the media survived in other threads on the same theme makes me think tons of posters here are idiots (yes, idiots) and blindingly devoted fanbois and the lack of insta-delete on such posts really tarnishes the image of the B3D forums as a place of sensibility and industry insight. Like I said, these threads have destroyed any goodwill I have for these topics on these forums.]

Do we really need a thread everytime someone doesn't like a game or thinks it is overrated? Can not a user just post in the game's thread a number of reasons why they didn't like the game instead of CHALLENGING the entire industry? Oh, a new thread visibility to boot.

 

[arhra]

Oh, and for the plot. One of the surprises actually surprised the hell out of me and is now among my great gaming memories.

Take a guess which moment, would you kindly?

The big problem i had with it was that the entire plot conceit fell straight on its arse after that big reveal (which will, admittedly, remain one of my most memorable moments in gaming for years to come). Or rather, after the point where

Spoiler

you wake up in the orphanage after having been de-conditioned and with free will supposedly restored... and then proceed to continue to blindly follow the instructions you're given as the game doesn't allow you to do anything else meaningful

.

 

[swaaye]

Do we really need a thread everytime someone doesn't like a game or thinks it is overrated? Can not a user just post in the game's thread a number of reasons why they didn't like the game instead of CHALLENGING the entire industry? Oh, a new thread visibility to boot.

Well I thought Todd33's original post was rather well thought out. If he wants to make a thread about it, I think it's fine. I don't see him attacking the entire industry. He doesn't even bring up anything like that.

 

[AlphaWolf]

Well I thought Todd33's original post was rather well thought out. If he wants to make a thread about it, I think it's fine. I don't see him attacking the entire industry. He doesn't even bring up anything like that.

So we won't have any problems when the "MGS4 overrated?" or "Killzone2 Overrated?" threads start?

I personally don't think its a big deal, but I can see where Joshua is coming from. Todd certainly could have made the title less inflammatory.

 

[Acert93]

Well I thought Todd33's original post was rather well thought out. If he wants to make a thread about it, I think it's fine. I don't see him attacking the entire industry. He doesn't even bring up anything like that.

I don't have a problem with his opinion.
I don't have a problem with him posting his opinion.
Based on all the other points I made (and alternatives suggested) I don't find the thread constructive.

A post in the Bioshock thread would have been great. Having to endure, as Alphawolf noted, the perpetual, "This game is overrated IMO threads!" serves no value... especially in light of the moronic postings in the Heavenly Sword and Lair threads.

If posters at B3D didn't believe in media conspiracies and constantly ride the agenda train it wouldn't be so bad. But I totally agree with AlphaWorlf: I doubt a, "Heavenly Sword is Overrated" thread would be allowed to survive when the same purpose (expressing that opinion) could be done in the Heavenly Sword thread.

 

[Falkster]

I hate the term overrated. Seriously, it just doesn't make sense. There are those that believe the game deserves to be scored higher, does that now mean the game is underrated? Of course not. The game deserved how it was rated, I'm not egotistical enough to think that my opinion should override the opinion of most reviewers. If I didn't like the game as much as others, I would just admit that it's not my cup of tea rather than implying everyone else is wrong. Guh.

Edit: That said, there's nothing wrong with the original post (sans title). I can respect that people don't like the game as much as others. I just hate the term overrated.

 

[Todd33]

Thanks for the opinions save the console war thread crap. Sorry if the title sounds too direct, it was a simple choice of words.

As I play Bioshock I look back on games like Half-Life 2, while the combat is for the large part a typical shooter, the simplicity along with the seamless story telling made it a more compelling game IMO.

For a point of reference I could not get into STALKER, I think I gave up at the first big town with the bar under ground.

 

[Acert93]

I hate the term overrated. Seriously, it just doesn't make sense. There are those that believe the game deserves to be scored higher, does that now mean the game is underrated? Of course not. The game deserved how it was rated, I'm not egotistical enough to think that my opinion should override the opinion of most reviewers. If I didn't like the game as much as others, I would just admit that it's not my cup of tea rather than implying everyone else is wrong. Guh.

I agree. Now overhyped, well, I think that does happen. I think games that are above 9.5 tend to get overhyped... but in general those last few percentage points tend to be more valuable/rare as well. Inverted bell curve.

Ratings are curious beasts. They aren't a science, and like noted above your initial play experience may diverge strongly with later ones... it is typically to look at old games/consoles either too favorably/negatively down the line. Time also makes us relook at our priorities (single play games typically get worse in hindsight because a good MP game provides months, even years, of value and fun) and is impacted by new software releases and announcements.

I would say some games are overlooked. Some are over exposed. But mainly I just think my tastes and criteria are WAAAY different than the critical press. I think most SP experiences are pretty lame to be quite honest. The limitations of the technology really, really annoys me. I also think most wine sucks, but not overrated for those who like that kind of thing.

I am not saying there are never overrated games--I think individial press members can/do that. But I think it goes back to more of an opinion as humans are very subjective beings. As an industry, with dozens of outlets giving reviews, I think it is hard to say the industry as a whole underrates/overrates games as it is an average consensus of critics.

Based on the sales of some games (like NFS games) critics and consumers often part paths. Recognizing the different criteria of critics -- and the number of games they play and their typically jaded perspective -- it looks much akin to movies. At which point the best thing is to

a. try a demo
b. read reviews of reviewers you tend to agree with a lot
c. word of mouth

 

[RobertR1]

No game appeals to everyone.

I found Bioshock to be cool but not cool enough to warrant another play through (like I've done with Gears and Halo3) . Maybe I'll change my mind but as it stand, I'll likely get traded in for Call of Duty 4. A coupe of levels will bigger areas would have made a world of difference. Or atlest give me the illusion of expansive areas.

However, I'm glad I bought it and played through it.

 

[digitalwanderer]

For a point of reference I could not get into STALKER, I think I gave up at the first big town with the bar under ground.

Wow, that's the opposite of me. By that time STALKER had suckered me in good and I was up late nights playing.

It was the combat in STALKER for me, the enemies seemed intelligent and no two fights were really the same.

 

[Subtlesnake]

I don't think the complaints related to the ammo machines are entirely fair, as Rapture underwent a civil war, so the residents would have needed ammunition and other supplies. As for the special ammo types, well those for the most part have to be created using the u-invent machines, so they end up being something of a prized item, and there are what, 6 weapons altogether? With regard to the plasmids I think there are a core group that are useful, and are needed for those sections where you're being bombarded by enemies (such as at Fort Frolic, or the later escort mission), but I would agree that some are superfluous.

For me, the problem with Bioshock was A.) that you rarely had to make any meaningful choices, and B.) the game wasn't set up entirely like a shooter.

So yes, you could evolve your character by adding plasmids, but there was only ever a small group of plasmids that were actually worth using, and you had more than enough Adam to buy anything you needed, anyway. So it wasn't a case of 'where do I want to take my character' but rather, 'lets buy this small set of useful plasmids and be done with it'. Equally, the gene tonics gave you a very limited range of possibilities, allowing you essentially to be good with the wrench, or good at hacking. Finally, the only real moral choice was made so black and white by the game as to remove any requirement to actually think for yourself .

And with regards to combat, the levels felt more like real world environments than a series of structured encounters, which in a sense is a good thing, but it meant that combat consisted of running into and gunning down random wandering splicers. Contrast this to what happens in games like Half-Life 2 or Stalker or FEAR or Halo 3 where you're facing down squads of coordinated enemies in intricate combat spaces, and have to use cover intelligently.

I didn't feel that the same carefully constructed combat sequences were there in Bioshock, and as a result I had a lot less fun with the game than I expected to. Of course, if you have a different set of preferences then the situation is different. I would still rate the game highly primarily because of the story and level design.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Do we really need a thread everytime someone doesn't like a game or thinks it is overrated? Can not a user just post in the game's thread a number of reasons why they didn't like the game instead of CHALLENGING the entire industry? Oh, a new thread visibility to boot.

I agree with this point. Because a poll was added and people have voted, I'll let this thread stay. But in future, people just post their personal take on a game in the game's existing thread if there is one. If you want to add your own score, just peg it on the top/bottom of your critique.

 

[swaaye]

Todd33, you should check out the Through the Looking Glass forums. They have a Bioshock-specific section. Might be more receptive than some of what you got here, too. Their specialty over there is these more complex FPS games, like Bioshock, Thief, System Shock, STALKER, and others.
http://www.ttlg.com/forums/

Also check out the thread over in the PC gaming area
http://forum.beyond3d.com/showthread.php?t=43741

This console area is loaded with hype, and some people take their game/platform way too personally. That is a big problem with some console forums. I think the history here of threads that explode into ridiculous pissing contests is the catalyst for some of the above responses.