Baseless Next Generation Rumors with no Technical Merits [post E3 2019, pre GDC 2020] [XBSX, PS5]

[chris1515]

Prime number or bust

https://www.resetera.com/threads/ne...ces-spicing-2019.91830/page-287#post-19279014

Look, as I've been saying since roughly March 2018 (in this very thread), next-gen is coming in 2020. That Semiaccurate article saying 2018 (lol) got people's hopes up for 2019, but by now I hope it's clear that the PS5 ain't coming out this fall.

And, despite all the rumors about devkits being out (usually from rumormongers who are wrong more often than not), the number of people briefed on next-gen is still very limited. Even within companies like, say, DICE, there'll be a small team of engineers who now have a rough idea of specs, and everyone else will know when they need to know. Not a lot of devs are disclosed on next-gen right now.

In other words, don't expect much in the way of substantial leakage just yet. The only thing to know for sure is that both Sony and Microsoft are aiming higher than that "10.7 teraflops" number that Google threw out last week. (And, as has been reported, Microsoft's got a few things in the works.)

From Jason Schreier a credible source, I will not be surprise if the two consoles are within 0,1 Tflops.

 

[PSman1700]

Might be worth waiting for the 5nm gpus then.

 

[PSman1700]

Stadias TF aint navi flops though.

 

[chris1515]

Stadias TF aint navi flops though.

Again I doubt devs or journalists speak in GCN flops. The other sources @Kleegamefan talking about more than 10 Tflops said RDNA Flops. Same Matt(working in the industry and mod in Resetera) seems to said the two consoles will be powerful, performance nearly equal and everyone PS5 or Xbox Scarlett owner will be happy.

EDIT: @Kleegamefan said it will not be very impressive at 10-11 Tflops maybe because of less than 12 Tflops raw Tflops, I suppose his first reaction after reading the flops before Navi reveal was not a good one on the GPU side. And he was happy after seeing prototype of a next gen games.

I suppose too, he was not impressed seeing RAM size probably 18 to 20 GB but with SSD this is ok.

And I suppose 10-11 Tflops RDA/RDNA 2 GPU will not be impressive compare to high end AMD RDNA 2 GPU next year or high end Ampere Nvidia GPU* in 2020 and less poweful than high end 2018 Nvidia GPU.

* I am not sure 10-11 Tflops RDNA GPU will be competitive against midrange Ampere GPU. Midrange Ampere GPU being more powerful than 10-11 Tflops RDNA would be very far from a surprise on my side. This is NVIDIA after all.

 

[ultragpu]

Prime number or bust

We ain't having 7TF you flog , 11 TF for Scarlett and 13 TF for PS5 it is then.

 

[PSman1700]

It just doesnt make sense to fight a tf war against another architecture found in stadia. Also stadia can upgrade.

I wouldn't put too much fate in those 'sources' either. There's also sources claiming unimpressive specs, which might mean a lower tf number. But all we are doing is grasping after the highest TF number, as said this gen isn't about TF numbers.
Yes all console owners will be happy as we will see 7 years of advancement and the graphics will gobsmack most of us.

 

[PSman1700]

We ain't having 7TF you flog , 11 TF for Scarlett and 13 TF for PS5 it is then.

14TF according to some trusted pastebin so atleast that.

 

[ultragpu]

14TF according to some trusted pastebin so atleast that.

He said prime numbers only and 14 is not.

 

[chris1515]

It just doesnt make sense to fight a tf war against another architecture found in stadia. Also stadia can upgrade.

I wouldn't put too much fate in those 'sources' either. There's also sources claiming unimpressive specs, which might mean a lower tf number. But all we are doing is grasping after the highest TF number, as said this gen isn't about TF numbers.
Yes all console owners will be happy as we will see 7 years of advancement and the graphics will gobsmack most of us.

The source talking about unimpressive spec is @Kleegamefan and he said GPU are 10-11 Tflops RDNA, this is the same guy. He was not impressed at all seeing the specs and his friend showed him prototype of the game running on PS5 devkit it makes him feeling better. I can guarantee if you don't know something about RDNA and someone comes and say the GPU will be 10-11 TFlops you compare to Xbox One X and PS4 Pro and you are not impressed at all.

Same for RAM size, compared to other gen to gen improvement this is weak. @Kleegamefan said 20 GB. But with SSD this is ok.

EDIT: Stadia can use double Stadia Unit. This is not the problem at all. He just told than one Stadia unit is far from the two next gen consoles.

 

[PSman1700]

About double the TF to a new architecture from a premium 499 dollar console lauching just some years prior is kinda impressive anyway.
We have no idea about TF, but it doesn't matter really anyway, that PS5 number will do a HZD2 that a potentional 16TF ampere wont match for a while. It's the games that matter. But yeah i guess ~10TF navi2 isn't impossible but it's quite a milestone seeing thats 5700xt level with RT on a newer arch. We will see

Edit: wouldn't say 20gb is unimpressive either. If it is gddr6 it is.

 

[chris1515]

About double the TF to a new architecture from a premium 499 dollar console lauching just some years prior is kinda impressive anyway.
We have no idea about TF, but it doesn't matter really anyway, that PS5 number will do a HZD2 that a potentional 16TF ampere wont match for a while. It's the games that matter. But yeah i guess ~10TF navi2 isn't impossible but it's quite a milestone seeing thats 5700xt level with RT on a newer arch. We will see

Edit: wouldn't say 20gb is unimpressive either. If it is gddr6 it is.

I think very high end Ampere GPU 3080 Ti will probably be more or less 20 TFlops at least. Midrange at least 2080 level, and maybe more 2080 Super or 2080 Ti?.

EDIT: Again people were thinking 32 GB or 24 GB because they compared to prevous RAM size increase. Some said 32 GB is ok but not very good because the multiplicator x8 between gen is not reached and the true goal is 64 GB of RAM.

EDIT: Maybe one console is 10.1 Tflops and the other 10.2 Tflops but from a marketing point of view it is much better than 9.99 Tflops.

EDIT: And he was videogame journalist but this is not someone specialize on videogame technical analysis like Digitalfoundry.

 

[PSman1700]

I think very high end Ampere GPU 3080 Ti will probably be more or less 20 TFlops at least.

Your very high on the TF's there too i think. You could be right again, but it sounds very high. 2080Ti is 13/14TF somewhere, a 6TF increase since 2018... i guess it's possible, dunno NV announced they would be increase raster performance by alot, but then again another architecture, so a 17TF ampere perhaps equals 20TF's turing. Were talking about monsters then, i mean 10TF of turing is already very powerfull. They need to increase RT performance too.
But ok, if there's 20TF gpu's out there the consoles should atleast be 10TF ye half a year later, but then again TF isn't all, if not MS finally starts to create games like sony does.

EDIT: Again people were thinking 32 GB or 24 GB because they compared to prevous RAM size increase. Some said 32 GB is ok but not very good because the multiplicator x8 between gen is not reached and the true goal is 64 GB of RAM.

We can't expect jumps like previous generations, and 16GB gddr6 just for games would be about what we have today for the high-end just for graphics, if 4 to 6gb of those go to non-graphics.

EDIT: Maybe one console is 10.1 Tflops and the other 10.2 Tflops but from a marketing point of view it is much better than 9.99 Tflops.

True, there's also RT performance though, which Sony and MS can boast about, which stadia doesn't have. Anyway in my point of view stadia isnät even important, whatever specs it will have. Maybe in the future streaming will be more important but i doubt the ps5 has something to worry about next year.

EDIT: And he was videogame journalist but this is not someone specialize on videogame technical analysis like Digitalfoundry.

Yeah and both don't know the specs ,)

 

[bbot]

Just to be clear: 5nm for the whole Project Scarlett SoC. And I was wrong about Tom Warren posting on Resetera. It's a tweet of his.

 

[Shortbread]

Good, you showed that PS5 SoC will be use 7nm node. Now show that Arden will use 7nm. AMD has not officially announced "RDNA2". I don't trust that slide, and if you do trust that slide, you'll have to conclude that PS5 will not use RDNA2, since RDNA2 is for 7nm+, not 7nm.

That's your prerogative, and your opinion. Not an actual fact. Both PS5 and Xbox Next will have 7nm chips. No secret sauce nodes to be had, nor 80CU dreams. These systems would be lucky if they receive 48CU.

 

[chris1515]

Your very high on the TF's there too i think. You could be right again, but it sounds very high. 2080Ti is 13/14TF somewhere, a 6TF increase since 2018... i guess it's possible, dunno NV announced they would be increase raster performance by alot, but then again another architecture, so a 17TF ampere perhaps equals 20TF's turing. Were talking about monsters then, i mean 10TF of turing is already very powerfull. They need to increase RT performance too.
But ok, if there's 20TF gpu's out there the consoles should atleast be 10TF ye half a year later, but then again TF isn't all, if not MS finally starts to create games like sony does.



We can't expect jumps like previous generations, and 16GB gddr6 just for games would be about what we have today for the high-end just for graphics, if 4 to 6gb of those go to non-graphics.



True, there's also RT performance though, which Sony and MS can boast about, which stadia doesn't have. Anyway in my point of view stadia isnät even important, whatever specs it will have. Maybe in the future streaming will be more important but i doubt the ps5 has something to worry about next year.



Yeah and both don't know the specs ,)

And both know the target specs, if you think some journalist like Jason Schreier or Richard Leadbetter does not have the target specs but out of Sony or MS no one knows the final specs probably.

Again when you know someone working in the industry and you don't say too much everything is possible, Klee said he knows the exact target specs but promise to not be too precise. He talked about the next-generation consoles because Andrew Reiner(Gameinformer) is an ex colleague when he was working at EGM and he was shocked how people talk like he was a piece of shit because he said one piece of plastic is more powerful than the other.

When a resetera mod or Jason Schreier announce before Naughty Dog the delay and for kotaku the new release date, I can say you the target specs are known by many peoples(people inside the industry and videogame journalist). Mark Cerny told one of the goal of Wired Interview was to counter leaks.

Same for he second one, they gave details about dualshock 5 because it will be inside devkit gave to third party soon after the interview.

Edit: I think 3080TI will be 17 to 20 TFlops.

 

[Pinstripe]

Prime numbers ya say?

7.x TFLOPS on 7nm RDNA1 it is then.
Can only see >=11.x TFPLOS on 7nm+ EUV RDNA2 happening. Probably selling at a loss due to yuge die.

Source: My educated opinion.

 

[PSman1700]

Do 80CU gpu's even exist today in the consumer space?

 

[Shortbread]

Do 80CU gpu's even exist today in the consumer space?

No. Top-end at the moment... 64CUs with Vega GCN 5 and 40CUs with Navi.

 

[PSman1700]

And both know the target specs

I highly doubt journalists know anything. Not DF, not some forum member or even the mighty Jason Schreier.

he said one piece of plastic is more powerful than the other.

I don't doubt that one will be more powerfull then the other. Probably in Sony's favor but that's a personal guess. Doesn't matter anyway as there's more at play then just raw power. (like TF, RT, SSD speeds etc).

I can say you the target specs are known by many peoples.

And none of those want to sacrifice loosing their job or position etc for a darn TF number.

Maybe look at the PS4 leaks and final specs, when did we know there what was going to be in it?

 

[Deleted member 13524]

Do 80CU gpu's even exist today in the consumer space?

Depends on what you call a "CU" and what you call consumer.
The GV100 has 84 SM (nvidia's equivalent to CUs) and the Titan V has exactly 80 SM enabled.

It's a >800mm^2 large GPU though.