Baseless Next Generation Rumors with no Technical Merits [post E3 2019, pre GDC 2020] [XBSX, PS5]
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How fast can it go from 40db to 100db ?
Sony: the fastest
Sony: the fastest
Let's be honest here, Sony and Microsoft more than likely know the final target specs not only from the conversations within the game development community, but also from the silicon targets which AMD can provide within 200-300w footprint. And if we're really truly honest with ourselves, Sony has more incentive on providing a better product – even if it’s marginal. And more than likely Microsoft doesn’t even care in the grand scheme of things. The majority of Sony’s business, its livelihood, is tied to the PlayStation brand being successful. Microsoft could easily sneeze out the Xbox hardware-brand without it impacting the company’s bottom-line, its investors and other endeavors. Microsoft's bread and butter will always be their OS/Apps, cloud and product services, something Sony Corp can't provide.
Tkumpathenurple
Veteran
I don't put much stock in this either, but there's a chance that MS are further focusing on their XBox+PC ecosystem, and therefore treating the XBox as a more entry-level product. Not to the extent that it's significantly underpowered, but to the extent that they're not pushing the silicon/cooling/secondary invisible chip to its limits.
Sony are likely to try some more console exclusivity this coming generation. If MS focus on further pushing their console+PC ecosystem, they can ameliorate Sony's exclusivity advantage to some extent.
Sony are likely to try some more console exclusivity this coming generation. If MS focus on further pushing their console+PC ecosystem, they can ameliorate Sony's exclusivity advantage to some extent.
If it's as close as he says it is; it's not leading at all.
If we stick to the technical, MS has already developed everything that is going to help them for next gen.
Start with the security and licensing features built into the chip since XBO; it's never been broken and I think PS4 has been much closer to being hacked.
Their licensing, game pass and BC all working in harmony well before Scarlett is launched
Looking at the cooling solution on Xbox One X combined with the Hovis method; this probably allowed MS to put in some additionally shittier yield chips but still manage to run the higher clock rates with stability.
Their OS is now finally stable; with a strong flighting system.
All their audio is already complete.
They don't need to invent any new controllers; everything from XBO is carrying forward.
They've known about ray tracing API coming in well in advance.
They've completed they've been pushing forward on their command processor customizations for a long time now.
They've already showing the documentation for DXR 1.1
They've showcased their DirectML, and we've seen their ML/AI chips already being pushed for the new Surface line.
From my perspective, MS is operating from a really strong foundation of technology that should easily let them maximize their price/performance for their console. And admittedly, we know very little about Scarlett. I mean everything I mentioned above was done and shipped out in 2017 minus the ray tracing and directML. No one has any idea what MS has been putting its resources into for Scarlett aside xCloud which is a different team from the hardware team.
There's no reason to believe here that Sony is going to have any substantial difference over MS in clocks or in hardware unless the two are making cases to adjust how their silicon used.
HBRU
Regular
I think the better system will be the one with the bigger (or wider) bandwidth (and better RT in the long run) and not more TF or RAM.... also games esclusive are of course important... So Sony 90% will be better as gaming only machine... MS can provide a PC/Console that can be even more interesting......
I was with you up to the point you started with this line of thoughts.
MS has every reason to also try and make the console successful, given that they also see gaming as one of their core pillars.
Both Sony and MS will 'give their all', it's easy to argue its more important to MS because they may see this as their final chance.
I think until we know where both companies invested we won't know who has the most powerful console depending on how you want to measure it.
Which features if any was cherry picked from RDNA 2, what customizations was requested, size and cooling of the console, etc.
Either console could end up on top.
But yea, I think that MS has decent foundations, but so does Sony.
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I disagree there. MS has a bright future in cloud computing. If the console flops, it's no great loss. For Sony. PS is a significant part of their operations and identity. They've been out front 3 out of 4 generations, and level pegging for their worst attempt. The incentive to be the best, number one console has to be stronger with Sony as they have more riding on it.
Cloud computing maybe, but not gaming.
They could become just a provider, and maybe have a couple studios for a few third party games I guess, but at that point they would just sell them of.
Streaming is only just beginning, and there will be many companies competing.
With a strong console foundation that will only help their cloud goals.
Will anyone pay for xcloud or gamepass when they could be playing on PS5 and PSnow if next xbox is crap?
Gamepass is great, but people assume Sony won't make psnow just as competitive.
And I don't disagree from a product success standpoint. My point was more so, that Sony NEEDS the PlayStation brand (PS5) to be successful, more so than Microsoft with the Xbox brand from a financial standpoint. That the Sony Corp of today; it's financial stability; is mostly tied to the PlayStation brand being successful. Something Microsoft doesn't necessarily have to worry about with Xbox. I'm not downplaying the Xbox brand or Microsoft wanting their brand to succeed. As I stated before, Sony has more incentive on securing PS5 spot as being more powerful or faster, even if it's marginal, on making sure their financial stability is a replication of PS4s success.
I don't agree with the idea that Sony needs PS5 to be more successful and MS can just write it off if they fail.
Success is absolutely critical for both. MS is looking for more growth markets to protect their margins (which eventually will fall) on Azure.
As for the reasoning that Sony would be willing to do X or Y more than MS. We're talking about betting after the flop. You can look at your hand, have an idea of their hand. But how much will you reasonably bet on you winning before you have more information. Over doing it could lead to a generational win, sure, but it could lead to loss revenues over an optimal amount (which is being a eek better than your competitor) but not needing to subsidize or put your hardware on sale more often.
For a company like Sony who needs this generation to be successful, not because they need to win, but because it's a major source of their revenue; they still need to keep care with not going overboard to the point that MS is under-pricing them from the get go and Sony needs to lose money to keep up.
With a whole new market coming in the form of streaming, there is less risk to invest there and gain a slew of customers, than to come in with an overpriced console.
Success is absolutely critical for both. MS is looking for more growth markets to protect their margins (which eventually will fall) on Azure.
As for the reasoning that Sony would be willing to do X or Y more than MS. We're talking about betting after the flop. You can look at your hand, have an idea of their hand. But how much will you reasonably bet on you winning before you have more information. Over doing it could lead to a generational win, sure, but it could lead to loss revenues over an optimal amount (which is being a eek better than your competitor) but not needing to subsidize or put your hardware on sale more often.
For a company like Sony who needs this generation to be successful, not because they need to win, but because it's a major source of their revenue; they still need to keep care with not going overboard to the point that MS is under-pricing them from the get go and Sony needs to lose money to keep up.
With a whole new market coming in the form of streaming, there is less risk to invest there and gain a slew of customers, than to come in with an overpriced console.
What do you mean " as close as" = "not leading at all"?
I don;t argue some logic such as "if 10% or even 5% of advantage is taking the lead or not".
I just want to discuss how can SONY take some advantage if you mentioned MS already does everything technically "best (?)".
D
Deleted member 13524
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To be honest, to launch the upcoming fastest console all Sony has to do is release the PS5 at least one day before Scarlett.
Since the console forum has recently become a place centered on discussing semantics, the upcoming console could be considered the console that is closest to release.
And in that case the PS5 only needs to be faster than the XBoneX.
Please provide context if you're linking to other forums.
Who's "Kleegamefan" and why is his post relevant?
Yea, I see it as they both have good reasons for wanting it to be successful beyond just not wanting to make a crap product.
Sony - Main division in the company
MS - Going from underwhelming gen (possibly getting out of gaming) to deciding to double down on it.
Sony - Has mind share, global reach, strong foundations
MS - investing in gaming, trying to lay foundations.
MS has the harder task, but I have no reason to believe their not up to making next gen a lot more successful for them.
Context on this individual has been provided many times (see link below) , not only in this thread, but also other threads as well.
Anyhow, Kleegamefan is a verified poster (without the verified moniker) who has worked in the gaming industry sometime back, for Game Informer I believe (SushiX was his name-handle I believe), and still has connections with certain developers.
And him stating "it is" was in response to PS5 being faster, which he stated on prior occasions.
https://forum.beyond3d.com/search/51244037/?q=Kleegamefan&o=relevance&c[node]=27
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Because leading by a hair isn't usable information. Its much too accurate in a time of guessing when we're still trying to figure out our precision.
The difference between One and 1S 914 - 853: 61 Mhz which translated a move of 1.31 TF to 1.4 TF or approximately 7% clock speed difference.
If the difference is that small it is likely subject to change by retail. Meaning the lead they hold onto with the devkits is nothing more than leading with a devkit and not useful information for retail. And thus this information (provided by Klee) does not imply an actual lead. (not yet at least)
D
Deleted member 11852
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Spoiler alert dude!
I asked because you mentioned your digital library and connected it to the console price. The only causality I could see here is if you assumed you had to "rebuy" so you preferred a cheaper console which didn't make much sense to me.
I call buying games but not playing them not rational behaviour which I'm surely guilty for. It happens a lot with game series and certain fire sales or the free games from the console live services.
Reading your paragraph you must have completely missed the argument.
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