Baseless Next Generation Rumors with no Technical Merits [post E3 2019, pre GDC 2020] [XBSX, PS5]

[BRiT]

I have no clue what they have been doing with their time.
BC is done.
DXR is done
OS is done
Game Pass is done
Security and licensing is done.
DirectML is done.
Customizations that were never used from XBO are done.
Hovis method can be re-used.
Simulations can be improved on
Devkits redesigned as done.

Obviously, they've been busy getting their own 5nm Fabrication Plant online.

 

[Proelite]

Why because it's in favor of XB2 ? I'll be popping champagnes when PS5 eventually turns out to be a 12.9TF monster like Osiris has been hinting lately. I'm sure it'll be no big deal to you since it's only less than 20% difference and maybe XB2 would have faster CPU or DX12 novelty etc

Real men win wagers and then drink champagne in a victory toast.

Rangers vs ultragpu

 

[iroboto]

Obviously, they've been busy getting their own 5nm Fabrication Plant online.

working really hard on putting in an auxiliary 3D stacked GPU but ensuring it stays off. To time the perfect moment to turn it on after launch when people have spent all their money on the competition and locked into their subscription services, and allow a narrative that your console is 50% weaker.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Real men win wagers and then drink champagne beer in a victory toast.

FTFY.

 

[Megadrive1988]

Curious to see if they go for an all in 1 device again. I mean, speculatively, the hardware is more powerful than a majority of PCs out there. It could easily be a device that runs W10 applications as well as xbox ones. With the addition of mouse and keyboard; tied in with Office 365 subscriptions with ultimate-- and some current hints that the device could be a speaker/tower like alexa/google hub in terms of form factor. i mean, you're going to have to get to the point where everyone who is on Game Pass upgrades to Game Pass Ultimate so that you can play the PC and Xbox titles. Instead of having to own individually a PC and a Xbox, just give them a single device that can run PC and Xbox titles.

With their OS team continually changing and modifying w10 (We see this with Surface Neo), I mean there might be a chance of a continuum type system for xbox here.

Reminds me of the Xbox 2 PC hybrid rumor from 2004.

https://www.gamesindustry.biz/artic...search-into-viability-of-xboxpc-hybrid-device
https://money.cnn.com/2004/05/26/commentary/game_over/column_gaming/index.htm

 

[PSman1700]

One thing is for sure, there's gonna be a lot of disappointment this time around too.

By the time specs land, 'specs aren't that important and it's the games/gameplay that matters'. And how 8TF equals 12.9 in the end, or something like that.

 

[cheapchips]

Reminds me of the Xbox 2 PC hybrid rumor from 2004.

https://www.gamesindustry.biz/artic...search-into-viability-of-xboxpc-hybrid-device
https://money.cnn.com/2004/05/26/commentary/game_over/column_gaming/index.htm

Xbox was pretty much greenlighted to get Windows into the living room. Seems an outdated concept these days since productivity mostly happens on laptops in the home.

After the Xbone launch, they're going to be laser focused on Scarlett as the "the best place to play". It'd be a nice value add down the line if you can run Windows on it as well, perhaps as much for the kids in bedrooms part of the market as well.

 

[PSman1700]

Xbox was pretty much greenlighted to get Windows into the living room. Seems an outdated concept these days since productivity mostly happens on laptops in the home.

After the Xbone launch, they're going to be laser focused on Scarlett as the "the best place to play". It'd be a nice value add down the line if you can run Windows on it as well, perhaps as much for the kids in bedrooms part of the market as well.

And on those laptops, mostly are running windows i guess. If MS can adopt to more markets they probably will. I wouldn't mind to be able to have windows on a scarlett machine.

 

[iroboto]

Curious reports that Xbox fans should watch The Game Awards tonight. 830 EST

Some weird hinting happening around the forums and Twitter verse. Doubt this is Scarlet related. But ok.

will see you gents in 6 hours

 

[McHuj]

I can see them announcing the date of the reveal event. I think it will come early next year.

 

[ultragpu]

Now that we know XSX is 12 Navi TF, Klee confirmed again today that he still stands by his earlier statement of PS5 being slightly more powerful. I guess the target specs of those consoles never changed at least, so that pretty much makes that 12.9 TF PS5 a reality now. This is insanity tho , who would've thought next gen consoles are 12-13 Navi TF monsters, so can't wait to see those big Navi chips going about under the hood. And the Ram, bandwidth, Raytracing bullshit, last not the least, the SSD speed oh my.

 

[AbsoluteBeginner]

Now that we know XSX is 12 Navi TF, Klee confirmed again today that he still stands by his earlier statement of PS5 being slightly more powerful. I guess the target specs of those consoles never changed at least, so that pretty much makes that 12.9 TF PS5 a reality now. This is insanity tho , who would've thought next gen consoles are 12-13 Navi TF monsters, so can't wait to see those big Navi chips going about under the hood. And the Ram, bandwidth, Raytracing bullshit, last not the least, the SSD speed oh my.

I don't see why Klee is taken as a gospel here as well. He said, back in late August :

"I'm just saying compared to GCN, the RDNA architecture is much more efficient per clock, but the downside is it yields lower TF numbers.

People will inevitably look at final numbers and say "well its not THAT much better then an Xbox One X" and I'm saying that is the wrong way to look at TF numbers"

He also said following after that :

Lockhart does not exist
PS5 and Scarlett are both 10TF +
Difference between them is ~single digit in PS5's favor (One S vs One difference)
But he is not confirming if PS5 is 13TF

But if we know Series X is 12TF, then according to him PS5 HAS to be somewhere around 13TF, yet he is not confirming that.

I personally think he is fishing for publicity as ex journalist as I can see his posts on Era have brought tons of attention around web.

Tom and Brad broke Lockhart and Anaconda. They also where the first to say its cancelled (then everyone followed). Then they were the first to say "Its back on" (then everyone followed). They where also first to say 4TF and 12TF (Tom confirmed it last month on Era in his post - "Is it 4TF or 12TF?", when no body knew Lockhart was back on). They also said dev kits were only going out now, and they haven't been available.

So I am trusting they know much more about MS side then Klee does. Lets wait and see, but to me, based on everything posted, Klee doesn't deserve reputation of oracle he is ascribed to be.

 

[goonergaz]

I don't see why Klee is taken as a gospel here as well. He said, back in late August :



He also said following after that :

Lockhart does not exist
PS5 and Scarlett are both 10TF +
Difference between them is ~single digit in PS5's favor (One S vs One difference)
But he is not confirming if PS5 is 13TF

But if we know Series X is 12TF, then according to him PS5 HAS to be somewhere around 13TF, yet he is not confirming that.

I personally think he is fishing for publicity as ex journalist as I can see his posts on Era have brought tons of attention around web.

Tom and Brad broke Lockhart and Anaconda. They also where the first to say its cancelled (then everyone followed). Then they were the first to say "Its back on" (then everyone followed). They where also first to say 4TF and 12TF (Tom confirmed it last month on Era in his post - "Is it 4TF or 12TF?", when no body knew Lockhart was back on). They also said dev kits were only going out now, and they haven't been available.

So I am trusting they know much more about MS side then Klee does. Lets wait and see, but to me, based on everything posted, Klee doesn't deserve reputation of oracle he is ascribed to be.

In his defence it doesn't sound great saying "our NextGen console is a whole whopping twice the power of last gen".

 

[AbsoluteBeginner]

In his defence it doesn't sound great saying "our NextGen console is a whole whopping twice the power of last gen".

Well, in forum he posted people expected 8-9TF max at that time. This is why he said "don't judge by TF number". I am 100% sure if he said 12-13TF Navi 2 people would go batshit insane there.

 

[goonergaz]

Well, in forum he posted people expected 8-9TF max at that time. This is why he said "don't judge by TF number". I am 100% sure if he said 12-13TF Navi 2 people would go batshit insane there.

I'm still unsure over the whole TF number...I know Klee says (and others) it's Navi, but I can't help but think Phil would have said a bigger 'more powerful than' number if he had the chance...I mean, it's not like it would be hard - especially if he used the original XBO as a baseline, he could have easily said '10 times more powerful than last gen' - ' never have we seen such a big leap between generations' etc

 

[ultragpu]

I don't see why Klee is taken as a gospel here as well. He said, back in late August :



He also said following after that :

Lockhart does not exist
PS5 and Scarlett are both 10TF +
Difference between them is ~single digit in PS5's favor (One S vs One difference)
But he is not confirming if PS5 is 13TF

But if we know Series X is 12TF, then according to him PS5 HAS to be somewhere around 13TF, yet he is not confirming that.

I personally think he is fishing for publicity as ex journalist as I can see his posts on Era have brought tons of attention around web.

Tom and Brad broke Lockhart and Anaconda. They also where the first to say its cancelled (then everyone followed). Then they were the first to say "Its back on" (then everyone followed). They where also first to say 4TF and 12TF (Tom confirmed it last month on Era in his post - "Is it 4TF or 12TF?", when no body knew Lockhart was back on). They also said dev kits were only going out now, and they haven't been available.

So I am trusting they know much more about MS side then Klee does. Lets wait and see, but to me, based on everything posted, Klee doesn't deserve reputation of oracle he is ascribed to be.

Klee didn't outright spell out 13 TF for PS5 is the same reason why he didn't outright confirm 12 TF for XSX all these time before the show. He knew XSX is that number all along hence reconfirming nothing has changed so far. But what's pretty obvious to me is how easy we can deduce PS5's figure or roughly along that ballpark now knowing all the clues. He did say SX is a little bit above 12 TF so even if PS5 isn't 10% stronger, a 6-7% would still nets ~13 TF. If we're debating whether PS5 is pinpoint sharp 13 TF then it's pointless as long as we know it's around that figure.

 

[AbsoluteBeginner]

Klee didn't outright spell out 13 TF for PS5 is the same reason why he didn't outright confirm 12 TF for XSX all these time before the show. He knew XSX is that number all along hence reconfirming nothing has changed so far. But what's pretty obvious to me is how easy we can deduce PS5's figure or roughly along that ballpark now knowing all the clues. He did say SX is a little bit above 12 TF so even if PS5 isn't 10% stronger, a 6-7% would still nets ~13 TF. If we're debating whether PS5 is pinpoint sharp 13 TF then it's pointless as long as we know it's around that figure.

Please note that nothing he said can be traced or confirmed as breaking story. Therefore, I don't understand how you came to the conclusion what he wanted to say and didn't (as far as 12TF or 13TF goes).

Fact of the matter is, 3 months back he said "don't be surprised by TF number, it doesn't indicate performance as Navi yields worse TF then GCN". Now, that CANNOT be true if consoles are 12-13TF, because these numbers are completely unexpected. They outperform ANYTHING AMD has by wide, wide margin. And, thats ALOT of FLOPS.

So, he said its all based on target specs, but apparently back in August he was calling everyone to keep their expectation in check as far as TF goes. If he had target spec info, as evidently Tom and Brad had, he would have known 12TF-13TF number is far, far higher then anything people expected (especially after ~9TF Navi XT results where posted).

Second thing is, he was completely dead wrong on Lockhart being dead.

Now, he didn't leak 12TF. He said difference in TF's is One S vs One (~7%), but if we accept 12TF in Anaconda as valid, he MUST have meant PS5 is ~13TF, no way around it. Proelite pressed him on that yesterday and he backed out of Resetera after that, saying "people are putting words in his mouth", but thats exactly what his own math says.

So. What did this guy break? TFs? No. Lockhart/Anaconda? No. Console announcement? No.

He broke nothing. Now, he might be legit, might not be, but based on evidence above, why are we going on about "But Klee said..:"?

Tom, Brad - they where the first to report Anaconda, Lockhart. They where the first to report Lockhart "cancellation" and then Lockhart resurfacing. They where also first to confirm target specs (Tom on Resetera a month ago - "4TF or 12TF, which is it?" post) and say MS wants to surprise Sony (wasn't yesterday event surprise?).

They also said dev kits for Scarlett have been pretty much non existent for 3rd party. Now, who do I believe? Guys that broke codenames, specs, announcement, strat (lockhart/anaconda) or a guy on resetera who broke nothing and went away after proelite basically said "So PS5 is 13TF, Klee?"

 

[goonergaz]

Please note that nothing he said can be traced or confirmed as breaking story. Therefore, I don't understand how you came to the conclusion what he wanted to say and didn't (as far as 12TF or 13TF goes).

Fact of the matter is, 3 months back he said "don't be surprised by TF number, it doesn't indicate performance as Navi yields worse TF then GCN". Now, that CANNOT be true if consoles are 12-13TF, because these numbers are completely unexpected. They outperform ANYTHING AMD has by wide, wide margin. And, thats ALOT of FLOPS.

So, he said its all based on target specs, but apparently back in August he was calling everyone to keep their expectation in check as far as TF goes. If he had target spec info, as evidently Tom and Brad had, he would have known 12TF-13TF number is far, far higher then anything people expected (especially after ~9TF Navi XT results where posted).

Second thing is, he was completely dead wrong on Lockhart being dead.

Now, he didn't leak 12TF. He said difference in TF's is One S vs One (~7%), but if we accept 12TF in Anaconda as valid, he MUST have meant PS5 is ~13TF, no way around it. Proelite pressed him on that yesterday and he backed out of Resetera after that, saying "people are putting words in his mouth", but thats exactly what his own math says.

So. What did this guy break? TFs? No. Lockhart/Anaconda? No. Console announcement? No.

He broke nothing. Now, he might be legit, might not be, but based on evidence above, why are we going on about "But Klee said..:"?

Tom, Brad - they where the first to report Anaconda, Lockhart. They where the first to report Lockhart "cancellation" and then Lockhart resurfacing. They where also first to confirm target specs (Tom on Resetera a month ago - "4TF or 12TF, which is it?" post) and say MS wants to surprise Sony (wasn't yesterday event surprise?).

They also said dev kits for Scarlett have been pretty much non existent for 3rd party. Now, who do I believe? Guys that broke codenames, specs, announcement, strat (lockhart/anaconda) or a guy on resetera who broke nothing and went away after proelite basically said "So PS5 is 13TF, Klee?"

Have we had the official TF number from MS yet other than this weird '~8 times the power of base one and twice the power of X' which is actually potentially nearly 3x the power of X if 12TF Navi is correct?

 

[AbsoluteBeginner]

Have we had the official TF number from MS yet other than this weird '~8 times the power of base one and twice the power of X' which is actually potentially nearly 3x the power of X if 12TF Navi is correct?

Well, closest we got was "2 x Scorpio". Since Klee confirmed 12TF, I don't see how he couldn't confirm 13TF for PS5, since its himself that said advantage is similar to One vs One S.

 

[goonergaz]

Well, closest we got was "2 x Scorpio". Since Klee confirmed 12TF, I don't see how he couldn't confirm 13TF for PS5, since its himself that said advantage is similar to One vs One S.

There was the other post from OsirisBlack that said;

5 > 2
How's the weather?
2.1 = 5

Which I thought could mean the PS5 is 5% more powerful...that would fit in with the One to One S gap also.

BTW, I'm not saying Klee is the Oracle...I don't think the 12TF is right, I hope it's right but I just feel Phil would have said 'around 3 times the power of X'.