Anandtech dashes cpus from ps3 and xbox360

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X-AleX said:
This is totally false.

X360 will have the GPU performance edge for about an year, thus delivering the best visuals for that time. Then PC will gain back that crown.

Interesting opinion, perhaps you can offer some facts to support?

My data, from conversations with both NVIDIA and ATI, makes it clear that SLI and CrossFire implementations will soundly outperform the Xenos GPU. Now don't get me wrong, Xenos GPU is a very good design but it was built to achive good performance at low-cost, which makes it very good for a console. The PC, on the other hand, will go for highest performance, cost-no-object GPU and then decide to put 2 of them in the PC for extra good measure. :D

Expecting XBOX 360 to offer better visuals than a high-end PC will leave you dissapointed.
 
in 2012- intel and amd will use cell's architecture , cell is the future :LOL

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How cares with GP performance, only with gaming performance.

I really doubt that Sony/MS would go with such bad CPU if they can buy cheaper one to Intel or AMD, and specialy after invested so much mony that is no sence.
 
Acert93 said:
And as for the statement that the XeCPU only has 2x the performance, that surely is BS. Why? Because the 360 is going to emulate Xbox games. Xbox games are not natively multithreaded. It is hardly believable that a 3 cores that supposedly running together perform at 2x a single core in real world performance could emulate the single core processor.
.

Excellent point!

If you follow the XBOX mod community, in order to emulate an XBOX or PS2 on a current PC would require much much more power than simply twice a 733 Celeron.

It simply can't be true.

If it's only twice as powerful there's no way it can emulate the XBOX.
 
I dont know about you guys but Im getting all warm and fuzzy seeing certain PS3 and X360 b3d contingents come together to defend the common good.

So what am I doing here then?.. :D

Expecting XBOX 360 to offer better visuals than a high-end PC will leave you dissapointed.

On the contrary, expecting better visuals from high end PC's will leave you disapointed (in the first couple of years of next gen anyway).

Your right that high end PC's will have more powerful hardware obviously. But as I said earlier that doesn't equal better looking games, PC games are made for mid to low end PC's.
 
Teasy i disagree.

We have so much coming to the pcs that its not even funny . 3 gpus , dual gpus , ppus , dual core chips , more ram . I don't think the diffrence will be seen for awhile .

We have great engines like unreal 3 and what not coming , valve is working on a new engine , carmack is working on a new engine . While the consoles will be stuck on dx 9 , the gpus will be passing that up and in the interm will have crazy supped up dx 9 engines as the pc has had capable cards for 4 years or so now
 
We have great engines like unreal 3 and what not coming , valve is working on a new engine , carmack is working on a new engine . While the consoles will be stuck on dx 9 , the gpus will be passing that up and in the interm will have crazy supped up dx 9 engines as the pc has had capable cards for 4 years or so now

Haha, you're funny! Consoles stuck on DX9? Wanna tell us what these PC visuals are going to be and how we can't do them on consoles?

We have so much coming to the pcs that its not even funny . 3 gpus , dual gpus , ppus , dual core chips , more ram . I don't think the diffrence will be seen for awhile .

Yes it is... More RAM? PC's have had the option for adding more RAM since there' have BEEN PC's.. That's nothing new... Multiple GPUs? Nothing new. Dual core? Just 2 CPUs on a single die. PC's have had the option for multiple CPUs for years (and for the most part can offer better performance that dual-core (expecially for instance in AMD64 hardware)).


Anyways, IMO the Anandtech article is pretty much rubbish and the reason why PC hardware sites should avoid doing technical analysis of console hardware...
 
jvd, I said high end PC's will be more powerful, so there's nothing to disagree with there. But as I said PC games are made for mid to low end PC's and only scale up in a limited way on higher end PC's.

There have always been big new engines coming out yet PC's vs consoles have always followed the same pattern. A new generation of consoles come out and produce games that are superior to anything on the PC visually. Within a couple of years PC games catch up and then surpass the console games. In the last couple of years of the generation PC games look a lot better and then new consoles are released and the cycle repeats. I don't see any reason for this to change.
 
jvd, I said high end PC's will be more powerful, so there's nothing to disagree with there. But as I said PC games are made for mid to low and PC's and only scale up in a limited way on higher end PC's.
except we are at a point where the consoles have the same features as 3 or 4 year old video cards with advancments . The xenos and rsx only have sm3.0 and hdr over that of hte 9700pro , which is coming on almost 4 years now . At the high end we have sli g70s and cross fire r420s soon r520s .

So the feature set is already quickly becoming the minimum standard . We are right now in the phase where the majority of the games require dx 8 or higher cards and most likely by the end of the year it will shift to dx 9 .

These are the same feature sets the consoles have .
 
xbdestroya said:
Psssh! C'mon, I gave it a couple of pages ago. It's 134mm^2.

(and that's with 2 megs of cache)
so the x360 cpu is less than a 134mm 2 ? that is going to be one cheap cpu . Do you know how many transitors that is ?
 
except we are at a point where the consoles have the same features as 3 or 4 year old video cards with advancments . The xenos and rsx only have sm3.0 and hdr over that of hte 9700pro , which is coming on almost 4 years now . At the high end we have sli g70s and cross fire r420s soon r520s .

The features don't matter if it takes a whole generation actually see the feature being used in earnest.

So the feature set is already quickly becoming the minimum standard . We are right now in the phase where the majority of the games require dx 8 or higher cards and most likely by the end of the year it will shift to dx 9.

These are the same feature sets the consoles have .

Funny when you see people still on DX7 level hardware but that's neither here nor there at the moment. Console gamers *buy* a new console to play next generation games do pc gamers do the same and if they do..how many flock to the ultra high end where all the new feature are useable in some way...the answer is not many. Let's be real the midrange and lowend aren't where many people go to use HDR and SM 3.0 and game at 1600x1200 but that's what pc gamers buy midrange and lowend video hardware.
 
I can certainly see your reasoning on the differences this time around jvd (though I think it ignores other consoles outside of XBox and XBox 360) but I still don't think its enough to change the usual cycle.

PC games being released this Christmas (along side 360) are being developed to work on PC's with a Radeon 8500, 1.8Ghz Athlon and 512MB of ram. So surely you agree that launch 360 games will look superior to the best PC games on release?

Maybe a year from now we could have PC games that are aimed at Radeon 9700, 768MB ram and 2.5Ghz CPU. Still not really upto 360's specification, just because 9700 has a similar-ish feature set that doesn't mean it can produce the same level of visuals as 360's GPU.
 
dcforest said:
But the high-end gaming PC's that ship in Nov/Dec will substantially outperform the XBOX 360 in terms of CPU performance, GPU performance, memory and storage capacity.

Do you really think a general purpose pc will outperform a closed box, optimized console within the same time period??

Nah.
 
The features don't matter if it takes a whole generation actually see the feature being used in earnest.
Thats what your not getting . r300 based cards are now beomcing the low end and is quickly replacing the dx 8 cards . You can get a dx 9 capable card in the 300$ pcs now . Ati has dx 9 graphics cores intergrated into thier motherboards .

The shift took along time . THe problem for the consoles is that the shift has happened and we will start to see engines taking advnatage of this in the very near future ( unreal 3 engine , beefed up source , serious , cyrtech engines ) because cards capable of this have been around for such a long time .

Funny when you see people still on DX7 level hardware but that's neither here nor there at the moment.
Which for people who are actually buying the games on the pcs those people have upgraded in the 3 or 4 years since dx 9 cards hit hte market . Sure I don't deny that there are still pcs with dx 7 , but its been long enough and the dx 9 cards have a big enough installed base to make the move . Just like we've seen tons of games designed around dx 8 with fall back paths or simply shaders turned off for dx 7

Console gamers *buy* a new console to play next generation games do pc gamers do the same and if they do..how many flock to the ultra high end where all the new feature are useable in some way...the answer is not many.
Except the r300 is capable of many of these features in games as its been shown . The only thing the r300 isn't capable of is hdr . Anything in sm3.0 can be done in sm2.0 and the r300s do g. i .

So that is the one feature that will have to be turned off , hdr .

Let's be real the midrange and lowend aren't where many people go to use HDR and SM 3.0 and game at 1600x1200 but that's what pc gamers buy midrange and lowend video hardware.
Except everything dx 9 card can do sm3.0 shaders , they just have to be unlooped or take more passes as sm2.0 shaders . The only thing they can't use is hdr . How ever you can use the interger version and it should give pretty decent hdr quality. Of course the r300 users will have to run in a lower res but those people still on those cards have been having to reduce res since the new crop of dx 9 cards came out last year and the more demanding games started coming out .

The problem is the consoles have the same feature set as 3 -4 year old video cards .While consoles of course have much more powerfull cards than these 3-4year old cards it doesn't change the fact that these cards exist and can lower thier res to keep up in the effects game . Developers will still code for these features .

Justl ook at unreal 3 engine .
 
Jvd

Your talking about dx9 cards being in low end PC's now, but the cards your talking about are basically dx9 in name along. They barely have the power to use the dx9 feature set to any real effect (Radeon 9600 ect).

How long is it going to be until we see low to mid end PC's with GPU's as powerful and feature rich as 360's GPU?
 
Teasy said:
Jvd

Your talking about dx9 cards being in low end PC's now, but the cards your talking about are basically dx9 in name along. They barely have the power to use the dx9 feature set to any real effect (Radeon 9600 ect).

How long is it going to be until we see low to mid end PC's with GPU's as powerful and feature rich as 360's GPU?
I cna play half life 2 on dx 9 path at 1027x768 with 2x fsaa on a 9600pro. This game has many sm2.0 shaders. same goes with farcry .


The r300 based cards are very good , its the nv30 cards that you'd have a point on .
 
Well I'm not sure about that jvd, my 9700 Pro doesn't run Half Life 2 totally smoothly at that resolution :) But either way Half Life 2 will be surpassed very quickly by early XBox 360 games and a 9600 Pro hardly matches up to 360's GPU..
 
Teasy said:
Well I'm not sure about that jvd, my 9700 Pro doesn't run Half Life 2 totally smoothly at that resolution :) But either way Half Life 2 will be surpassed very quickly by early XBox 360 games and a 9600 Pro hardly matches up to 360's GPU..

Oh no doubt. The option on the pc though is you can reduce the lvl of effects .

They can still design a unreal 3 game that takes advantage of the g70s and r520s and you can scale back to the r300 hardware .

I'm not saying the games wont look better on the new hardware. But the feature sets are the same . And if on the low end u have a feature set very similar to the high end its much easier to scale a game up. Its much diffrent than when the high end was dx9 and the low end was dx 7
 
the original article appears to be gone.

did he pull it or is it just me? :oops:

it links to a search page for me now even going from the front page.


it is now gone from the front page as well.
 
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