AMD's "Istanbul" 6-core Opteron reviews
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Despite my earlier skepticism, I am interested in Thuban for its potential @ encoding media. I may just end up replacing one of my Core 2 Duo systems with an AMD X6 if the price is right and the media encoding performance is there.
Yes, there is 890FX coming the same day as Phenoms X6.
Here in UK end of last week you could buy Asus Crosshair IV based on 890FX, but obviously AMD's ninjas took care of that early bird quickly
I'm looking forward to this upgrade as I will be jumping from 790FX/SB600 DDR2 platform to 890FX/SB850 DDR3 one. Also my good old Phenom 940BE finally will have new home at my brothers gaming rig because prettier 1090T (I hope available in UK next week) is going to power my gaming and media encoding fun
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Thanks Lightman. X6 seems to be on retails hand already. My buddy who is in the business offered me X6, I think it was the 3.2 GHz version. The price is about the same as i7 930, which is not too bad if the performance is there but he only have the 890GX mobo currently. Can't wait for proper reviews, but those early impressions look promising.
I think the only really exciting aspect of these CPUs is that AMD copied Turbo Boost so we'll get some single threaded app boosts hopefully. But there's no way I'd replace a quad from the past year or two with one of these chips.
I want to see Intel's next "tock" and just what Bulldozer ends up being.
I want to see Intel's next "tock" and just what Bulldozer ends up being.
What I wonder is will the AM3 socket take whatever CPU amd releases after this?
I need to get another CPU and motherboard as I gave away my old HTPC, but I don't want to break the bank. At the same time I would not mind something faster than my X3 phenom 720BE or whatever stupid name it has. I think it is something like that.
I am tempted to get a cheapo AMD processor for the HTPC that I can put in my current setup and buy a new motherboard and ram for my current processor. Or I suppose I should just splurge and get an i7 of some kind since single threaded performance is probably the most important to me. I can't code for crap so all my programs I need to run are single threaded and take forever to finish (like 5 hours run time).
I need to get another CPU and motherboard as I gave away my old HTPC, but I don't want to break the bank. At the same time I would not mind something faster than my X3 phenom 720BE or whatever stupid name it has. I think it is something like that.
I am tempted to get a cheapo AMD processor for the HTPC that I can put in my current setup and buy a new motherboard and ram for my current processor. Or I suppose I should just splurge and get an i7 of some kind since single threaded performance is probably the most important to me. I can't code for crap so all my programs I need to run are single threaded and take forever to finish (like 5 hours run time).
Too bad the EX gets outperformed by a dual Gulftown like there's no tomorrow.
Keep in mind that for 1 (ONE) EX you're going against 2 Gulftowns or 2-4 Magnys (depending on cost of the EX and Magnys).
If performance is king I'd definitely choose the latter 2. Nehalem EX is just here for the nice RAS features in case people don't want RISC/IA-64 by large.
Blazkowicz
Legend
with that "Black Edition" processor, i.e. unlocked, remember that you can just up the CPU multiplier in the BIOS to get higher single-thread performance, without needing good ram and a good motherboard.
else look at the i5 650 for your stuff, it will be awesome (but overpriced)
I did have it sped up a bit 2.8GHz-->3.2 GHz, but there were a few stability issues so I lowered the speed. However I don't think they are CPU related so I might turn up the multiplier again. When you are running at 100% CPU for hours on end though you don't want a crash at hour 4.5/5
After looking more at what Intel has done with their chipsets though I do not feel inclined to go that route. (in otherwords I am annoyed with Intel now after trying to see how much a mobo for i7 would be compared to a $35 AM3 mobo).Blazkowicz
Legend
eek, a $35 mobo has a crappy weak power stage, and the phenom aren't a low power offering. low end full ATX mobos are MUCH better (with nforce 720d or amd 770), though perhaps on the crappy side of bits in some ways.
I can't overclock 1% of fsb (used to do 25%, then 20%, before trying bad sticks of ram). but I am 100% stable. I wish I had a BE CPU such as the X2 550. At least there's undervolting left to me, to better use the CPU.
I can't overclock 1% of fsb (used to do 25%, then 20%, before trying bad sticks of ram). but I am 100% stable. I wish I had a BE CPU such as the X2 550. At least there's undervolting left to me, to better use the CPU.
Well, in terms of pure performance, I wouldn't be surprised that a dual Gulftown (twelve cores, twenty four threads) would generally outperform a single EX (8 cores, sixteen threads) in a workload that's heavily multithreaded. I might be able to buy that a quad Magny could also win against EX also..
But when you talk about multicore platforms, you're talking about seriously expensive motherboards (and perhaps FB-DIMMs too.) And on the Intel side of the fence, you're talking about Xeon-branded processors which add even more. Where do you find a quad-capable Magny-compatible motherboard? And what's the cost on that? Are there Gulftown Xeons out yet? What are the prices on those?
I'm not convinced that you're going to win a price vs perf argument when you go in the multi-physical-CPU conversation -- even with the added performance that they will invariably bring along.
But when you talk about multicore platforms, you're talking about seriously expensive motherboards (and perhaps FB-DIMMs too.) And on the Intel side of the fence, you're talking about Xeon-branded processors which add even more. Where do you find a quad-capable Magny-compatible motherboard? And what's the cost on that? Are there Gulftown Xeons out yet? What are the prices on those?
I'm not convinced that you're going to win a price vs perf argument when you go in the multi-physical-CPU conversation -- even with the added performance that they will invariably bring along.
Damn, perhaps I spoke too soon
So, as an addendum to my own post above and Tchock's post. I found one place selling the Xeon 7560 (Nehalem EX Octal-core 2.26Ghz) for around four thousand dollars. Yikes. You'll need the board that can do LGA 1567, which I cannot find immediate pricing for. Figure it won't be cheap
The six-core, twelve thread Xeon 5820 (2.26Ghz) you can get for around $400 each, and you can get DP motherboards for around $300.
The octal-core Magnycors (2.0Ghz) you can find for $300 each, and you can get quad processor boards for about $800.
Looks like the sweetspot (considering only processor hardware and motherboard) will probably be Gulftown at this point in time.
So, as an addendum to my own post above and Tchock's post. I found one place selling the Xeon 7560 (Nehalem EX Octal-core 2.26Ghz) for around four thousand dollars. Yikes. You'll need the board that can do LGA 1567, which I cannot find immediate pricing for. Figure it won't be cheap
The six-core, twelve thread Xeon 5820 (2.26Ghz) you can get for around $400 each, and you can get DP motherboards for around $300.
The octal-core Magnycors (2.0Ghz) you can find for $300 each, and you can get quad processor boards for about $800.
Looks like the sweetspot (considering only processor hardware and motherboard) will probably be Gulftown at this point in time.
I am not saying I will get a $35 board. I am saying the low end of AM3 is cheap. The low end of x58 is Frickin expensive. I can get a great AM3 board for about 100. That is what happens thanks to AMDs woeful inability to compete with intel i7 chips and no 3rd party intel chipsets. Intel can charge whatever they want for the boards for their fast chips and enthusiasts pay through the nose.
BTW I did turn mine back up to 3.2Ghz and it is fine. It was a AHCI issue before from swapping after windows was installed. Given the above sentiments though it is unlikely I will go the intel route.
There's only one scenario in which Westmere EP ("Gulftown Xeon") beats Nehalem EX, and that's at the two socket level. Westmere EP processors aren't available in configurations greater than two sockets so Nehalem EX gets an automatic win when you scale beyond 2 sockets. Keep in mind I'm not talking at all about the cost of any of the platforms in question, just the performance. If we take cost into account then clearly Westmere EP and Magny Cours are better solutions than Nehalem EX.
Blazkowicz
Legend
maybe Power 7 kicks its ass, if cost becomes negligible.
it's clearly meant for "minicomputers", or high end enterprise server, however you call them. Who knows, at $4000 per CPU, maybe it's cheaper than IBM, and it's dwarfed by the software that runs on it (Oracle or similar).
it's clearly meant for "minicomputers", or high end enterprise server, however you call them. Who knows, at $4000 per CPU, maybe it's cheaper than IBM, and it's dwarfed by the software that runs on it (Oracle or similar).
Yawn. That's not a convincing argument for a lot of workloads.
It's probably easier to you know, get two+ units of Westmere/Magny servers and run the software in separate instances. Sure, you *can* get even more EX servers, but it'll be lovely looking at how this war of attrition plays out when the costs go into the 5/6-digits.
The factoring in of cost makes it possible to scale multiple workloads to multiple systems giving more performance for still less $. Considering AMD's 2P/4P strategy and slot-in Bulldozer (along with no visible upgrade for LGA 1366 after Westmere) which we have no/"some" idea in performance wrt Nehalem EX, I'm pretty sure they're getting the design wins for anything that does not need RAS or does not have Westmere fit the criteria (or is just too expensive).
As for server purchases it should go like this regarding performance/cost:
16-Magny, 12-Westmere, 32-Magny (only ~1000USD more than 16-Mg disregarding more RAM), 2x12-Westmere, 2x32-Magny, (here is where 16-Beckton comes in at cost).
If the app doesn't scale, remove everything and leave Westmere.
Blazkowicz
Legend
Yawn. That's not a convincing argument for a lot of workloads.
It's probably easier to you know, get two+ units of Westmere/Magny servers and run the software in separate instances. Sure, you *can* get even more EX servers, but it'll be lovely looking at how this war of attrition plays out when the costs go into the 5/6-digits.
Unless it's cheaper to not split your database, thanks to a bigger SMP machine with a single adressable memory pool?
but sure, it's useless for the common mortal or companies like google.
it's amazing that IBM PC compatibles have come so far. I'm picturing out getting a 8-way nehalem EX, then booting MS-DOS 5.0 instead of that boring Unix/Windows stuff to play good old Arkanoid and Doom 2 on it
Yawn. That's not a convincing argument for a lot of workloads.
It's probably easier to you know, get two+ units of Westmere/Magny servers and run the software in separate instances. Sure, you *can* get even more EX servers, but it'll be lovely looking at how this war of attrition plays out when the costs go into the 5/6-digits.
The factoring in of cost makes it possible to scale multiple workloads to multiple systems giving more performance for still less $. Considering AMD's 2P/4P strategy and slot-in Bulldozer (along with no visible upgrade for LGA 1366 after Westmere) which we have no/"some" idea in performance wrt Nehalem EX, I'm pretty sure they're getting the design wins for anything that does not need RAS or does not have Westmere fit the criteria (or is just too expensive).
As for server purchases it should go like this regarding performance/cost:
16-Magny, 12-Westmere, 32-Magny (only ~1000USD more than 16-Mg disregarding more RAM), 2x12-Westmere, 2x32-Magny, (here is where 16-Beckton comes in at cost).
If the app doesn't scale, remove everything and leave Westmere.
Is the number of workloads relevant? I wouldn't think workloads in the server market would be extremely diverse...
hoom
Veteran
So Thuban reviews are out now, haven't read any yet (lost a HDD & been out getting a new 2TB Caviar Green) but some are:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/3674/amds-sixcore-phenom-ii-x6-1090t-1055t-reviewed
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/phenom-ii-x6-1090t.html
http://www.guru3d.com/article/phenom-ii-x6-1055t-1090t-review/
http://www.legitreviews.com/article/1289/1/
http://www.hexus.net/content/item.php?item=24332
http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/cpus/2010/04/27/amd-phenom-ii-x6-1090t-black-edition/1
Die pic from Anandtech
Seems to be nearly identical to Istanbul die
I'd thought they might have tidied up the large scale layout a bit given the extra time.
But then, higher clocks, reduced power draw, turbo & price matter. Aesthetics of die layout won't affect whether people buy this.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/3674/amds-sixcore-phenom-ii-x6-1090t-1055t-reviewed
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/phenom-ii-x6-1090t.html
http://www.guru3d.com/article/phenom-ii-x6-1055t-1090t-review/
http://www.legitreviews.com/article/1289/1/
http://www.hexus.net/content/item.php?item=24332
http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/cpus/2010/04/27/amd-phenom-ii-x6-1090t-black-edition/1
Die pic from Anandtech
Seems to be nearly identical to Istanbul die
I'd thought they might have tidied up the large scale layout a bit given the extra time.
But then, higher clocks, reduced power draw, turbo & price matter. Aesthetics of die layout won't affect whether people buy this.
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