AMD: Pirate Islands (R* 3** series) Speculation/Rumor Thread

Discussion in 'Architecture and Products' started by iMacmatician, Apr 10, 2014.

Tags:
  1. silent_guy

    Veteran Subscriber

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2006
    Messages:
    3,754
    Likes Received:
    1,380
    It's not that your arguments don't have some merit. But the hyperbole of questioning the world we're living simply because people like to talk about business strategy kind of devalues the whole thing.
     
  2. ninelven

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2002
    Messages:
    1,710
    Likes Received:
    131
    Well, in the real world, corporations have bills to pay such as the wages for their employees. Now, if a corporation doesn't make any money, they can not pay their employees. And a corporation without employees ceases to exist fairly quickly. Thus, if you enjoy your computer, phone, tablet, gpu, etc... you probably want these to remain viable businesses, because if they don't then the products produced will also go away. This really shouldn't be that hard to understand, but I digress...
     
  3. silent_guy

    Veteran Subscriber

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2006
    Messages:
    3,754
    Likes Received:
    1,380
    It is well known that high-end GPUs have the highest GMs. 50%+ should never be a problem, but I expect it to be higher in today's mature 28nm. At $650, AMD would have to screw up really bad if they don't get 40% margins.
     
  4. silent_guy

    Veteran Subscriber

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2006
    Messages:
    3,754
    Likes Received:
    1,380
    That's not how it works. AMD has plenty of experience with seriously large dies. Increasing the size from 440 to 600 won't magically increase the defect density.
    They're probably more concerned with packaging related yield.
     
    RecessionCone and Grall like this.
  5. Jawed

    Legend

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2004
    Messages:
    10,873
    Likes Received:
    767
    Location:
    London
    Lightman likes this.
  6. Lightman

    Veteran Subscriber

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2008
    Messages:
    1,812
    Likes Received:
    487
    Location:
    Torquay, UK
    I'm a business owner and I think most established businesses know their overheads and margins better than us bystanders. So for example if I want to sell my product for X dollars and ran through numbers several times to pick best price point(s) for it considering supply / demand estimates as well as market capacity for given product you think you know better from outside how much I should charge? I have never had a customer say to me they are not happy with my pricing because it's too cheap! This kind of thinking only applies to people not seriously interested in buying given product. Quickest way to put AMD out of business would be for them to price Radeon Fury X at $1999.99! It would give them enormous margins per board sold, but where would be the volume to support all that R&D?

    So please don't get me wrong, I'm happy to pay $650.00 for a card approximately 50% faster than my current one to support corporation which is building new and exiting technologies to help them develop even better things in the future, but market rules dictate, certain price points will generate certain volumes and businesses must find their sweet spots for best return on investment. AMD is in difficult position as it's market share and mind share are at long time low point. They will not sell well enough at nVidia price points any time soon. They have to work on their reputation first and the best way to do that is through amazing products and good market placement. Besides, AMD will have their margin wonder product in Radeon Fury X2, so they will have that price point covered, just not now.
     
    Kaarlisk likes this.
  7. Jawed

    Legend

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2004
    Messages:
    10,873
    Likes Received:
    767
    Location:
    London
  8. ninelven

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2002
    Messages:
    1,710
    Likes Received:
    131
    Given the massive number of businesses that fail every year along with AMD's ongoing woes, I'll trust reality over what anyone thinks, sorry.
     
    #2048 ninelven, Jun 17, 2015
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2015
    egoless likes this.
  9. 3dilettante

    Legend Alpha

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2003
    Messages:
    8,296
    Likes Received:
    3,626
    Location:
    Well within 3d
    The situation is rather odd with the Fury X. It's priced for a somewhat less super-niche segment, but it has certain features that seem to be consistent with more limited volumes that shouldn't tip AMD's fortunes either way.

    Does a very new integrated package with a new-but-sunsetting HBM1, closed-loop cooler with what appears to be a bespoke mounting plate, and a card that promised to ramp to a standards-defying 500W sound like a volume play?
    Maybe it's a feeler for a broader deployment of a closed-loop solution, but I don't know if Fury is what AMD is counting on to pay the bills for the better part of a decade of R&D.
     
  10. Lightman

    Veteran Subscriber

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2008
    Messages:
    1,812
    Likes Received:
    487
    Location:
    Torquay, UK
    @Jawed
    Nano looks great and should still be a lot faster than R9 290X according to Dr Lisa. I'm curious how low idle power will go on Fiji based cards as with HBM there should be significant saving even comparing to downclocked GDDR5. This card might be exactly what HTPC crowd is asking for, low power, high performance, excellent idle and hopefully good acoustics.

    @ninelven - never mind, enough off-topic
     
  11. silent_guy

    Veteran Subscriber

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2006
    Messages:
    3,754
    Likes Received:
    1,380
    Lightman,
    Nobody was proposing a $2000 price and using it as an example doesn't serve a purpose. And $1000 may be an issue indeed due to the RAM.
    But if FuryX has the meaningful performance increase (say 10+%) over a GTX 980 Ti that it should have on cases that are not memory size limited, then it wouldn't hurt them one bit to ask at least $750. I think a lot of people would be cheering about what a good deal it is compared to a Titan X.
     
    Lightman likes this.
  12. Lightman

    Veteran Subscriber

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2008
    Messages:
    1,812
    Likes Received:
    487
    Location:
    Torquay, UK
    Obviously I can only speculate here, but maybe AMD has contractual obligations to Hynix for HBM1 volumes they have to meet or more likely they are hoping to regain a bit of enthusiast mind share by making their product favourable not only on price, but also performance, build quality and overclocking headroom. It's a niche product, but at the same time it's a halo product for AMD and the more positives we enthusiasts will voice on internet about Fiji the better for AMD whole line-up. I could make a car analogy, but I digress.
     
    #2052 Lightman, Jun 17, 2015
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2015
  13. Grall

    Grall Invisible Member
    Legend

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2002
    Messages:
    10,801
    Likes Received:
    2,174
    Location:
    La-la land
    What crowd? We're talking about a comparative handful of people, sum total, across the entire globe, who buy these fantasy land-priced video cards.

    You're complaining that the card isn't as expensive as it could have been? I don't get you.
     
  14. Lightman

    Veteran Subscriber

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2008
    Messages:
    1,812
    Likes Received:
    487
    Location:
    Torquay, UK
    I understand your point and certainly there are people who would buy at that price without thinking twice, but in case nVidia reacted and AMD had to cut prices 2 weeks after launch ... we've already been there and know how many happy customers this created.
    It comes down to risk and reward. I'm happy with $650 as this is less than I expected and I will be buying this card if performance is not too far off what leaks shown. I was ready to pay up to $749 but that is my personal maximum I can justify spending on a GPU knowing there will be better one next year. I'm not super rich and there certainly are wealthier people than me who could afford higher price points. What holds Fiji top end pricing big time in my opinion is HBM1 limit of 4GB as it rules this card from most of semi-professional and professional tasks. That's where Titan X 12GB makes it easier for designers and engineers or scientists to justify expense. I know a lot of my friends in academic circles upgraded their computers with newest GPU's for research purposes (founded by government) because they needed to work with bigger data sets. AMD Fury X would not fly past commission deciding on giving grants with this argument because they already have at least 4GB cards in their research systems!
     
  15. pjbliverpool

    pjbliverpool B3D Scallywag
    Legend

    Joined:
    May 8, 2005
    Messages:
    7,614
    Likes Received:
    768
    Location:
    Guess...
    WCCFTech are reporting 50c and 32db for the FuryX. If so thats extremely impressive, especially if its faster than Titan X.
     
  16. UniversalTruth

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2010
    Messages:
    1,747
    Likes Received:
    22
    The truth is that a hell more people would be cheering about what a great deal it is, when the price is set as it is at 650$.

    The truth is that the lower the price the more tempting and popular the deal will be.

    There is no need for AMD in their sensitive condition to overdo things in the wrong directions and spoil the success.
    Making something expensive is not the way to go. Especially not in these times when it will become even harder to more people to afford this.
     
  17. xDxD

    Regular

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2010
    Messages:
    412
    Likes Received:
    1
    Impressive with an AIO cooler? I don't think so...
     
  18. SimBy

    Regular Newcomer

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2008
    Messages:
    506
    Likes Received:
    142
    It's impressive in a sense that 980Ti reference cooler is a jet engine. They are priced the same so comparison is valid.
     
    Arty likes this.
  19. pharma

    Veteran Regular

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2004
    Messages:
    3,348
    Likes Received:
    1,970
    It's basically an apples-to-oranges comparison, but that advantage may be necessary to remain competitive....
     
  20. pharma

    Veteran Regular

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2004
    Messages:
    3,348
    Likes Received:
    1,970
Loading...

Share This Page

  • About Us

    Beyond3D has been around for over a decade and prides itself on being the best place on the web for in-depth, technically-driven discussion and analysis of 3D graphics hardware. If you love pixels and transistors, you've come to the right place!

    Beyond3D is proudly published by GPU Tools Ltd.
Loading...