PSP Remasters - New Sony middleware?

[Shifty Geezer]

Sony are releasing PSP Remasters, HD versions of top selling PSP titles like Monster Hunter. Most importantly (for us with an interest more in tech) the games are claimed to run on both PS3 and PSP. A single download executable running on both platforms, that scales properly on PS3 to an HD screen rather than being an image upscale, points to a brave new world.

Is this PSS in action? Or something of a PSP 'emulator' or cross-compiled API? the fact it only works on remakes points to the need of a middleware for the games, and no low-level trickery, so it can't be a plain vanilla emulator. But similarly it has to be pretty effective middleware for the PSP games to compare to their native PSP versions.

This also suggests strongly to me that next-gen, starting with NGP, will be more a case of games, not platforms, and these will run on both console and portable versions of Sony's PS platform. Downloading a game on PSN will be an entitlement to play the game on any PS device you own, and it'll be portable across them. At least, this'll be a taster of that, although releasing games that have already had success on PSP is going to impact buyers of the remakes, so it won't demonstrate the appeal of added value.

 

[Nesh]

Damn that would be nice. Thats something I wanted to see happen!!
Fingers crossed to see MGSeace Walker in there

 

[ShadowRunner]

I only see it being one-way traffic, PSP/NGP games running on PS3/4, not the other way around. Upscaling resolution (Its not clear if the remakes are anything more than that..) is much easier than downscaling res and assets which require a full port basically, not to mention the size of the game if going PS3 to PSP.

In terms of how its implemented i think middleware is overcomlicating things, id imagine it will just be seperately compiled binaries for each platform within the package that share common files like texture packs, sound files etc which make up the bulk of the package. The scaling will just be a simple update to the sdk, much like how iphone/ipad games scale.

 

[N_B]

More than an increased resolution? Some textures look noticably better:

http://i.imgur.com/Ks0Ea.gif

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I only see it being one-way traffic, PSP/NGP games running on PS3/4, not the other way around.

Yes, that was only the intention. Clearly you can't get PS3 games onto a PSP! What we are seeing here is a cross-platform engine that supports both PSP and PS3 though, that means if you target PSP as the bottom end, you'll get a 'free port' for PS3's too. Whether it is free or not, I'm not sure.

In terms of how its implemented i think middleware is overcomlicating things, id imagine it will just be seperately compiled binaries for each platform within the package that share common files like texture packs, sound files etc which make up the bulk of the package. The scaling will just be a simple update to the sdk, much like how iphone/ipad games scale.

That's in effect creating two games, just copying over assets, which is a lot of work. If Sony want a common sharing of games, like they have with Mini and the announced PSS, it makes sense to use one in these instances where games are being recreated as both PSP and PS3 titles. If instead this is a per-title port to PS3 with a common purchasing for two different redistributables, the costs are the creation of new PS3 engines for each game, which seems considerable for a PSP-grade game on an HD console. A cross-platform middleware mitigating costs would render one version 'free'. Still, it's currently the reserve of remakes, so perhaps that's the case. I guess if upcoming PSP download games are announced as having PS3 support, that'll show a common middleware.

 

[Rolf N]

I suspect it's an emulator with a few configurable tweaks. Fruits of the minis situation (playable on PS3s since sometime last year), and fruits of work already done for NGP backwards compatibility. Sony can't start emulating every PSP game now because of licensing concerns. But they can give out a working emulator, which they should have by now, to pack in with new games, at third parties' discretion, "for free". They take their platform licensing cut anyway. PS3 versions of these games are separate sales (at least the Monster Hunter title is). Nobody would lose anything in this scenario.

I don't really see increased asset resolution in the screenshots yet. There's only so many texture samples you can fit on the PSP screen, mipmapping and all. Things are bound to look a little sharper on average when rendered to a higher resolution.

I also don't see how a new middleware layer would make this a good proposition to developers. At this point in the PSP's life cycle, third parties have their engines done and ready. Switching to some other tech would be a painful incremental expense and make the whole program risky to partake in.

 

[Deleted member 13524]

Am I the only one thinking the games will look really bad on a >37" screen if all they do is pump up the resolution?
And they'll have to at least redesign the HUDs.

 

[KKRT]

Am I the only one thinking the games will look really bad on a >37" screen if all they do is pump up the resolution?
And they'll have to at least redesign the HUDs.

God of War Collection looks alright.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Am I the only one thinking the games will look really bad on a >37" screen if all they do is pump up the resolution?
And they'll have to at least redesign the HUDs.

They'll look like very clean PS2 games. Not a patch on PS3 titles, but 'good enough', especially if the price is right given the portability option. Lots of MGS fans will buy a PS2-quality MGS port of Peacewalker. They might not if it was PSP screen resolution upscaled, which would look terrible. But native rendering to 720p, and hopefully AA, will make it easy on the eye.

 

[temesgen]

They'll look like very clean PS2 games. Not a patch on PS3 titles, but 'good enough', especially if the price is right given the portability option. Lots of MGS fans will buy a PS2-quality MGS port of Peacewalker. They might not if it was PSP screen resolution upscaled, which would look terrible. But native rendering to 720p, and hopefully AA, will make it easy on the eye.

Excellent point, there are a number of games that are exclusive to the PSP which I haven't played due to not wanting to make the investment in another hardware platform. Another consideration at least for me was that back when I decided to purchase the DS I didn't have any software invested in a handheld platform however if I had 3 or 4 games on my PS3 at that time which would run on PSP perhaps I would have made the investment in a PSP rather than the DS. Regardless MGS, the Jak games and Valkyria Chronicles 2 are games I would buy if they would run on my PS3.

 

[patsu]

... and Valkyria Chronicles 2 + 3, and Monster Hunter for me !

 

[Shifty Geezer]

VC is an obvious one, although I'm not sure it'll visually port over that well versus the original. I'd love to know the mechanic behind this new range of cross platforming.

 

[patsu]

They better do this as part of the Playstation Suite effort. Both are cross platform tech anyway. Sony is spread too thin. I'm still waiting for them to roll out a proper web browser. We may actually see a first class web browser on 360 first before PS3.

 

[temesgen]

They better do this as part of the Playstation Suite effort. Both are cross platform tech anyway. Sony is spread too thin. I'm still waiting for them to roll out a proper web browser. We may actually see a first class web browser on 360 first before PS3.

Never understood why they didn't update the PS3 browser, could it be that they don't want to be responsible for the security holes and patching that goes with the browser/web searching and access? Not sure either Sony or MS want to deal with that.

 

[patsu]

Supportability is a real problem. OTOH, the web browser is becoming a signature of modern devices. Personally, I think it can enable new business models. They already have WebKit on PS3 anyway. Slapping the web browser app on top is a great user feature.

Not to mention the current browser have bugs and likely security holes too.

 

[temesgen]

Supportability is a real problem. OTOH, the web browser is becoming a signature of modern devices. Personally, I think it can enable new business models. They already have WebKit on PS3 anyway. Slapping the web browser app on top is a great user feature.

Not to mention the current browser have bugs and likely security holes too.

Agreed, prior to buying the PS3 I was really looking forward to being able to use a browser on my TV but alas what we got was a not very good and largely crippled. I always wondered why the web-browser couldn't have been an extension of the LINUX OS support and as such taken advantage of all the 3rd party efforts that are out there, in fact all the music and video stuff could have been run out of that side of things which would have made for some interesting innovation.

 

[patsu]

Because Linux doesn't run in the Game OS environment. I got one of the open source web browsers to work in PS3 Linux though. jeff_rigby has been diligently following PS3 web browser development. Although many of his posts are speculative, he did uncover some interesting development:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=402172

 

[temesgen]

Because Linux doesn't run in the Game OS environment. I got one of the open source web browsers to work in PS3 Linux though. jeff_rigby has been diligently following PS3 web browser development. Although many of his posts are speculative, he did uncover some interesting development:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=402172

True, I should have worded myself more carefully. What I was trying to say was that all of the music, photo and video stuff should have ran out of LINUX and the game OS should have been bare bones for strictly running games. In other words a dual booting machine - some positives would have been more memory available for cross platform parity in games, quicker development and improvement in features that appeal in a set top box i.e. like Boxee or any of the other HTPCs, PS3 hardware for its time was quite good it would have been nice to see where the platform could have gone and it would have saved me money on redundant hardware.

Edit: Thanks for the link interesting stuff!

 

[patsu]

Linux would be too wide open to play copy-protected media. Just like NetFlix is not available on general Android devices. They will need to do more to secure the OS. It's probably better for them to control the OS. And take their time to do a proper one for all Sony devices.

[Okay, Killzone time ! before I rush home for dinner. ^_^]

 

[temesgen]

Linux would be too wide open to play copy-protected media. Just like NetFlix is not available on general Android devices. They will need to do more to secure the OS. It's probably better for them to control the OS. And take their time to do a proper one for all Sony devices.

[Okay, Killzone time ! before I rush home for dinner. ^_^]

Fair points all around - thanks!