Wii U hardware discussion and investigation *rename

[Exophase]

a) What difference does it make how a home console like OUYA or any of its successors compares to a handheld like Vita?
b) Why be so sure that Shield 2 is going to happen in 2014, or at all for that matter?

On the other hand, the first Shield will offer greatly superior hardware. The question is how many games will really properly utilize it.

 

[Rangers]

The OUYA 2 and NVidia Shield 2 will probably crap on it next year.

i doubt that...

On the other hand, the first Shield will offer greatly superior hardware.

related to vita or wii u?

it's a tegra 4, still cannot compete with a 360.

 

[Commenter]

I'm talking about performance, not clockspeed. The damn thing can't run half the 2013 PS3/360 games. GTA5, SR4, Metro: Last Light, Crysis 3, the list goes on and on and on. The OUYA 2 and NVidia Shield 2 will probably crap on it next year.

How about doing some basic research before stating which games can and cannot run? Plus, the new game by Silicon Knights is running on CryEngine 3.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-03-04-crysis-3-was-running-on-wii-u-but-port-had-to-die

 

[Rangers]

Well Eurogamer has a new RE6 face off uploaded and I believe the gist is all console versions look the same but Wii U version has worse framerate than the other two.

So another mark on Wii U in my book...more and more I assume 160 shaders. It continues to not separate from the HD twins.

 

[Commenter]

Thing is, does it matter though? Nintendo were never going to put powerful hardware in there. Anybody who has seen the comparisons of Wii titles and PS3/360 ones will know that. The one thing the Wii sorely lacked though was shaders which meant a lot of the games looked horrible on the Wii. The Wii U fixes that problem so I don't care too much about whether 360/PS3 ports are poor (keeping in mind the development tools are probably not optimised yet and these are a first go at porting titles). Tbh I'd rather see some unique titles that make interesting use of the gamepad (is that the sound of scoffing I hear?).

 

[Grall]

Thing is, does it matter though?

Yes of course it does, because this is the wuu hardware investigation thread.

 

[Exophase]

related to vita or wii u?

Vita. I thought that's what he was talking about, otherwise the "can't run half the 2013 XBox 360/PS3 games" comment didn't make sense to me.

A 2014 OUYA 2 would probably use Tegra 4 like the Shield so it probably wouldn't beat anything Shield wouldn't.

 

[Mobius1aic]

Thing is, does it matter though? Nintendo were never going to put powerful hardware in there. Anybody who has seen the comparisons of Wii titles and PS3/360 ones will know that. The one thing the Wii sorely lacked though was shaders which meant a lot of the games looked horrible on the Wii. The Wii U fixes that problem so I don't care too much about whether 360/PS3 ports are poor (keeping in mind the development tools are probably not optimised yet and these are a first go at porting titles). Tbh I'd rather see some unique titles that make interesting use of the gamepad (is that the sound of scoffing I hear?).

The Wii U is the chance to see some mainstream titles with the original Wii's controls too. Too bad Nintendo keeps botching things up.

 

[Blazkowicz]

Vita. I thought that's what he was talking about, otherwise the "can't run half the 2013 XBox 360/PS3 games" comment didn't make sense to me.

A 2014 OUYA 2 would probably use Tegra 4 like the Shield so it probably wouldn't beat anything Shield wouldn't.

The Ouya is barely out, actually it will be launched one month from now for the general public so I don't understand too much why it would be replaced so quickly.
I think a Ouya 2 will use a Tegra 5 or even a Tegra 6.

 

[AlphaWolf]

Ouya 2 will likely have a higher tdp tolerance anyway (not being a portable) and edge it out even using the same soc.

 

[Exophase]

The Ouya is barely out, actually it will be launched one month from now for the general public so I don't understand too much why it would be replaced so quickly.
I think a Ouya 2 will use a Tegra 5 or even a Tegra 6.

OUYA themselves have said yearly upgrades:

http://www.engadget.com/2013/02/07/ouya-annual/

A 2014 OUYA would most likely not be Tegra 5. Even if Tegra 5 is available H1 2014 in time for OUYA's first upgrade I doubt they'll be able to hit a $99 price point with it. Tegra 3 isn't exactly new today.

 

[Blazkowicz]

Sorry for saying shit, then
So, Tegra 4 we go.
It used to be that when you buy a console you have two or three years of games spefically tailored for it (more if the console doesn't fail) so I'm a bit confused.

At least I guess the Ouya 2 will run the Shield's game and vice versa but this can backfire too, I can see people holding out waiting for the Ouya 2 (when it will be a few monthes away) instead of buying an Ouya 1, leading to less adoption ; games that run on both Ouya but with framerate issues on the first one ; games that just ignore the Ouya 2's better abilities (I feel that's likely)

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Ouya's a platform-based console (and possibly a sign of the future). It's Android in a console form-factor. People holding out for Ouya 2 will be like people holding out for iPad 5,6,7 - you know an update's coming but you want the machine now. You'l; either wait and buy knowing if you wait another year you'll get an even better machine, or you buy now, pay, and sell on to help finance the replacement in a year's time.

 

[(((interference)))]

Any idea how long until something like the Ouya matches Durango on specs? 10 years?

 

[Deleted member 13524]

Any idea how long until something like the Ouya matches Durango on specs? 10 years?

Well, in the GFXbench T-Rex 1080p offscreen, Shield with Tegra 4 does 18 FPS whereas the HD7770 does about 300 FPS.
Tegra 6/Parker is supposed to be 10x faster than Tegra 4.. so let's say 180 FPS for Tegra 6, coming in 2015:

That said, I guess the next Tegra after Parker might be awfully close to the xbone. It should take 2, or at most 3 generations of Tegra/Exynos/Snapdragon after 2015's Parker to have something that is clearly more powerful than the xbone.

So we're probably a lot closer than 10 years to having an Ouya-like device that's more powerful than the xbone. I'd say 5 years, 6 years tops.

We have to keep in mind that unlike the x360 in its time, the xbone has the hardware equivalent of a PC with a mid-end CPU and a $100 dedicated graphics card. It's only natural that the mobile SoCs will be much faster at catching up this time.

Then again, at ~10nm (with the SoCs going down to about 100mm^2?) the xbone/ps4's SoC should become rather cheap to make since they won't be large anymore and the rather low clocks might result in great yields, so I think we can expect the next-gens to go down in price a lot faster than last time.
By then, the price difference between an OUYA and the xbone/ps4 may amount to be little more than the peripherals, optical drive and external RAM (assuming it doesn't become stacked over the console's SoC eventually).

 

[Rangers]

Any idea how long until something like the Ouya matches Durango on specs? 10 years?

Just scattershooting but I'd guess at least 5? Quite possible as much as 5-8 years just like this gen

Should EASILY be safe for 3...

Even on RAM, high end phones are at 2GB...going to guess going to 4, then 8, is going to be a matter of years. And current phones are 4X ahead of PS360 in RAM, but still not in GPU, so GPU may lag further.

Plus I bet old Mr Moore could come calling for mobile anytime now. For a while mobile as ahead of the Moore's curve, but that's unsustainable.

 

[TheLump]

I'm talking about performance, not clockspeed. The damn thing can't run half the 2013 PS3/360 games. GTA5, SR4, Metro: Last Light, Crysis 3, the list goes on and on and on. The OUYA 2 and NVidia Shield 2 will probably crap on it next year.

Your wording begs to differ:

lol. Maybe if you had said 1.4GHz and 600MHz...

Even then it would remain closer to Vita than any console lol .

But like I said; I was being pedantic and was responding only to what you said, not to anything else which may be inferred from what you said. This is a tech analysis thread after all.

(NB: If you're talking about "performance" then I'm not sure you should be quoting the names of games which have never been seen running on WiiU - and therefore provide no evidence one way or the other to judge the console's "performance" - to support your argument. Who's to know whether it could run those games? All signs point to it being at least capable of running them, for what its worth, just that its not financially viable for publisher's to bring them to the system given its miniscule userbase & poor sales.)

Lets not get into that though, as this is the wrong thread.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Even on RAM, high end phones are at 2GB...going to guess going to 4, then 8, is going to be a matter of years. And current phones are 4X ahead of PS360 in RAM, but still not in GPU, so GPU may lag further..

Capacity doesn't matter so much as BW, in which mobile chipsets are crippled versus consoles.

However, I've lost the train of thought in this Nintendo Wii U thread. Is the question how long until Wii U is superseded by mobile chipsets?

 

[Boxercide]

Capacity doesn't matter so much as BW, in which mobile chipsets are crippled versus consoles.

However, I've lost the train of thought in this Nintendo Wii U thread. Is the question how long until Wii U is superseded by mobile chipsets?

Going by roadmaps/goals as stated and their (IMHO surprising) ability to meet those goals as of yet, I'd say by this time of year in 2015, we'll have surpassed the triplets (PS3/360/Wuu) in mobile devices.

If I had to give odds: 100% tablets meet/exceed; 85% top shelf phones meet/exceed

 

[Shifty Geezer]

That's possibly true. BW on Wii U is pitiful. If any mobile chipsets go the eDRAM route, they are likely to surpass it.