WTF... This better be fake, I mean this is OFF the scale!!!

http://www.americanprogress.org/site/pp.asp?c=biJRJ8OVF&b=42125
My God, that better be fake... there's a washington post link, I can't get in can anyone tell me what's in it.

http://abcnews.go.com/sections/nightline/DailyNews/pnac_030310.html
This is not true, is it?

http://antiwar.com/sperry/?articleid=2209
Holy S#*T, that better not be real... yeah this site's got it's reasons... But the info presented is quite shocking...

PS Yeah, the first is a fun read even if fake, quite outrageous.
ediii

NOTE: LOTS OF NEW INFO HAS BEEN ADDED TO MY VARIOUS POSTS IN THIS THREAD, SOME OF IT WAS ADDED AFTER THE REPLIES PRESENT IN THIS THREAD!!!!
 
Supposedly it is also in the Washington Post, that is why I asked someone to look in the link...


Here's the person who could be the owner of the papers...
New deputy
Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld has quietly added another official to the Pentagon public affairs office. He is Eric Ruff, a former government and industry public relations specialist who was once a newspaper reporter.
Mr. Ruff, currently a public affairs specialist working for Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz, is likely to become the principal deputy assistant defense secretary for public affairs, the key deputy to Assistant Defense Secretary-designee Larry Di Rita.
Many Pentagon news reporters, however, are unfamiliar with the new spokesman.
Mr. Ruff was transplanted to the Pentagon from the Interior Department, where he was director of communications.
He also worked on Capitol Hill, where he was an aide to Sen. Kay Bailey Hutchison, Texas Republican, and before that, he was an aide to Sen. John W. Warner, Virginia Republican.
Mr. Ruff also worked in the first Bush administration at public affairs jobs in the Agriculture and Commerce departments.
As a news reporter, Mr. Ruff covered the Hill for Congressional Quarterly and before that, he worked for the Donrey Media Group.
He cut his newspaper reporting teeth in the 1970s and was the first to report the influx of Vietnamese refugees to Fort Chafee, Ark., in 1975 for the Southwest Times Record."
 
Actuallly, didn't realize the Washington Post registration was free, should've checked up first.

The most outrageous thing, IMO, is:
There's an underlined notation "DR" in the margin and a quotation, apparently from DR, perhaps Rumsfeld, to "Stay inside the line -- we dont need 2 ruff [or puff] this at all. we need 2b careful as hell about it. This thing will go away soon and what will keep it alive will be one of us going over the line."

It's also in the Washington Post article, or are you saying the Washington Post added it?
 
zidane1strife said:
Actuallly, didn't realize the Washington Post registration was free, should've checked up first.

The most outrageous thing, IMO, is:
There's an underlined notation "DR" in the margin and a quotation, apparently from DR, perhaps Rumsfeld, to "Stay inside the line -- we dont need 2 ruff [or puff] this at all. we need 2b careful as hell about it. This thing will go away soon and what will keep it alive will be one of us going over the line."

It's also in the Washington Post article, or are you saying the Washington Post added it?
No.

I guess I don't see the outrageousness of the statement, though.
 
I guess I don't see the outrageousness of the statement, though.

Well, if this was really what was being said behind curtains on the other side, then it pretty much means clarke is most likely correct, for starters...
 
zidane1strife said:
I guess I don't see the outrageousness of the statement, though.

Well, if this was really what was being said behind curtains on the other side, then it pretty much means clarke is most likely correct, for starters...
Thats a strange conclusion to draw.

Assuming its true, why would deciding not to be too vocal fighting Clarke's accusations mean they are true? As evidenced, when Condi went on the offensive rebutting all Clarke's accusations and policy disagreements, all it did was feed the story, not answer questions.

So please, share with us how this is some veiled mea culpa.
 
You're not making a lick of sense.

1) A note about political strategizing on how to deal with the Clarke story
2) The rehashed PNAC crapola
3) Condi worked with somebody on the panel

And that means that what Clarke says is true?
 
It's vaguely related info, it's just diverse and shocking info:

Bush's memo having "hijacking", "Al- Qaeda", etc, and remaining hidden, if true, would show a high level of incompetence/ serious oversight/ ridiculous blunder being hidden, but I don't know about these things...

2) The rehashed PNAC crapola

I'd like to know more about this, I've heard about it, and I've not had time to fully investigate. Could you elaborate?

As for
Condi worked with somebody on the pane
the info from the last site indicates that he's heavily involved with the white house, and the comission is most likely rigged, with several examples to support such a statement.

Now, again if any of these are remotely real it would be shocking, if all were true, it would be "OFF the scale".
ed

Here are some other links which hopefully are fake too...

http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=04/03/31/1616221
http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2004/03/26/translator/index_np.html

http://www.usdoj.gov/opa/pr/2002/October/02_ag_605.htm

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2001/07/26/national/main303601.shtml
Edmonds is offended by the Bush White House claim that it lacked foreknowledge of the kind of attacks made by
al-Qaida on 9/11. "Especially after reading National Security Advisor Condoleezza Rice where she said, we had no specific information whatsoever of domestic threat or that they might use airplanes. That's an outrageous lie. And documents can prove it's a lie."


Here is one last quote, this last one is from a source which I'm not certain how reliable it is:
Edmonds said "My translations of the pre 9-11 intercepts included (terrorist) money laundering, detailed and date specific information enough to alert the American people, and other issues dating back to 1999 which I won't go into right now."

Incredibly, Edmonds said "The senate Judiciary Committee, and the 911 Commission have heard me testify for lengthy periods of time time (3 hours) about very specific plots, dates, airplanes used as weopons, and specific idividuals and activities."

Holy guacamole, there must not be any truth in any of these....
 
zidane1strife said:
Here is one last quote, this last one is from a source which I'm not certain how reliable it is:
Edmonds said "My translations of the pre 9-11 intercepts included (terrorist) money laundering, detailed and date specific information enough to alert the American people, and other issues dating back to 1999 which I won't go into right now."

Incredibly, Edmonds said "The senate Judiciary Committee, and the 911 Commission have heard me testify for lengthy periods of time time (3 hours) about very specific plots, dates, airplanes used as weopons, and specific idividuals and activities."

Not reliable. Two years ago Sibel Deniz Edmonds, the ex-translator in question, made these claims about problems in the translation department - that it was basically FUBAR'ed.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/10/25/60minutes/main526954.shtml

Edmonds claims that she was recruited by a fellow Turk who was working for Milliyetci Istihbarat Teshkilati (Turkish CIA) named Can (pronounced "Jan" or "Chan") Dickerson. She turned down the offer, or maybe it wasn't enough money, so she went public and Dickerson fled the country. All of which proved the point I've been making for around a half decade that Turkey has been spying on America.

Now, sadly, I was probably wrong. Edmonds seems more like a publicity whore than anything else. Her two stories have little in common with each other - is the translation bureau the problem or is the appointed leadership the problem?

EDIT:Fixed URL and quote block
 
Now, sadly, I was probably wrong. Edmonds seems more like a publicity whore than anything else. Her two stories have little in common with each other - is the translation bureau the problem or is the appointed leadership the problem?

Good point. Now, what I'd like to know is what was involved in the DoJ gag order, I mean one would assume it is just things pertaining to infiltration of the FBI, but she's claiming the info related to 9-11 translations falls under the gag. She can claim that in public, but has she claimed that in the 9-11 investigation. Has she spoken under oath or no, I'd like to know, cause if she said this under oath she'd be up for criminal punishment if lying.
 
Edmonds first story in early 2002 was even more exotic - according to her they throw a party to celebrate the terrorist attacks in the translation office. Another fact to keep in mind is that she was only hired to translate previously untranslated documents, not review them - by definition she would not have seen intelligence that was already in English pre-9/11, which she is now implying she saw by her charges against Rice et al. You can't ignore that which you cannot read.
 
Edmonds first story in early 2002 was even more exotic - according to her they throw a party to celebrate the terrorist attacks in the translation office. Another fact to keep in mind is that she was only hired to translate previously untranslated documents, not review them - by definition she would not have seen intelligence that was already in English pre-9/11, which she is now implying she saw by her charges against Rice et al. You can't ignore that which you cannot read.

Wow, that's a whacked out story she seems to have claimed. Anyway, from what I read, she says that "supposedly" some of the doc.s were sent back to be retranslated, because the agents thought there had to be more info in there, due to the events that transpired. Supposedly stuff marked non-pertinent/important in the translated doc.s, was filled with tons of info.

ed

Found what's supposedly her press release about the case, from about 2 years ago.... not sure..

Press release from attorneys for Sibel Edmonds
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
For additional information contact: Stephen M. Kohn, David K. Colapinto, or Kris Kolesnik, (202) 342-1902

STATEMENT OF THE ATTORNEYS FOR FBI WHISTLEBLOWER SIBEL EDMONDS
Washington, D.C., June 19, 2002. The following statement was released today by Stephen M. Kohn, David K. Colapinto and Michael D. Kohn, the attorneys representing FBI whistleblower Sibel Edmonds.

"We represent Sibel Edmonds, who is a former translator for the FBI. Prior to her illegal termination, our client reported to FBI management, the FBI Office of Professional Responsibility and DOJ Inspector General that there were serious lapses in the FBI translations unit that is assigned to handle September 11th-related counter-terrorism investigations, there were major breaches in the FBI security program, and that there was other serious national security related misconduct. "This serious FBI misconduct has the potential of undermining its current anti-terrorist efforts and directly threatens national security in the aftermath of September 11th.

"In addition, after being notified of these serious matters by our client in early 2002, FBI senior management failed to take corrective action. Instead the FBI engaged in severe retaliation against our client as part of a cover-up of these serious problems. Among the critical concerns reported by our client are the following:

• FBI employees have on numerous occasions inaccurately translated intelligence information which threatens ongoing investigations related to post-September 11th counter-terrorist investigations and ongoing law enforcement investigations. This is the result of both willful misconduct and incompetence.

• The FBI granted a top-secret security clearance to at least one individual who has had direct association with the target of an ongoing law enforcement investigation.

• The FBI failed to investigate credible allegations of breaches in the FBI security program and that one of its own employees had improper contact with a target of an ongoing law enforcement investigation and whose information was being translated by the very employee who was suspected of having these improper contacts.

• The FBI's failure to take corrective action in response to our client's serious and valid allegations of security breaches has resulted in threats being carried out to the personal safety and security of our client and her family.

"Since our client reported these allegations to the FBI earlier this year the FBI has engaged in an ongoing unethical and illegal cover-up. Only after being pressured by the Senate Judiciary Committee has the FBI apparently finally admitted that our client's major whistleblower concerns have been confirmed. "However, in January and February of this year, when our client first disclosed these major security problems, the FBI failed to properly investigate our client's allegations. She was instructed by high level FBI management not to purse any complaints, and threatened with retaliation if she continued to report wrongdoing.

"When our client persisted in raising her allegations through the chain of command she was subjected to a retaliatory security investigation which resulted in her passing a lie-detector test in early March.

"Shortly after her management learned that our client continued to raise her concerns up the chain of command, (including filing reports with FBI OPR as well as to Dale Watson, FBI Executive Assistant Director for Counter-Terrorism/Counter-Intelligence and James T. Caruso, Deputy Executive Director for Counter-Terrorism/Counter-Intelligence), our client’s employment was terminated on March 22, 2002.

"The front-line of the war on terrorism has been directly undermined by the FBI's failures to act on our client's reports. The FBI failed to promptly correct these problems and instead waged war against its own whistleblower. This is unforgiveable in the post-9/11 world."

Some other shocking vaguely related info, which I would like to be verified:
http://www.fortune.com/fortune/articles/0,15114,410237,00.html
Members of fortune, should be able to look at it.
Amerada Hess, oil company which had a venture with Saudi Arabia’s Delta Oil to pump oil in Azerbaijan...
 
Here's something else I just realized. According to the story there were three Turkish translators in that particular department - Edmonds, Dickerson, and someone else unidentified - but both women were actually Muslims from Turkey (with their American husbands' surnames). I wonder why the FBI has never really made an effort to recruit American-born speakers of Mid-Eastern languages, instead seemingly focusing on immigrants. I know off the top of my head at least 30 fluent speakers of Turkish, 20 of Arabic, and 15 of Farsi (Persian), most loyal Fox News viewers :LOL: . You would not have these issues of dual loyalty with them.
 
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