Wrapper question

[Secessionist]

Is it technically possible to make a DX9->10.1 wrapper that would allow a DX 9 game that uses deferred rendering to run in DX10.1 so it could run with driver-forced MSAA?

Sorry for the noobish question.

 

[ShaidarHaran]

What game?

 

[Secessionist]

Thanks for answering. Any DX9 game that uses deferred rendering.

 

[ShaidarHaran]

Any DX9 game? That's quite a monumental task. This sounds like something best done at the application or driver level, since it varies from application to application. I'm not sure you could feasibly make a DX9->DX10.1 wrapper for your purposes. Perhaps someone else that knows more will come along with a better answer, though.

 

[Secessionist]

Could it be done at the driver level on a per-game basis?

 

[AlNom]

You might as well just be using super sampling...

 

[Secessionist]

Supersampling doesn't do geometry.

Does anyone know the answer to my previous question?

Thanks:smile:

 

[ShaidarHaran]

A driver can override an application's inherent lack of AA, provided the driver is aware of the application and has been updated with code to do just that.

 

[Novum]

Is it technically possible to make a DX9->10.1 wrapper that would allow a DX 9 game that uses deferred rendering to run in DX10.1 so it could run with driver-forced MSAA?

That doesn't make any sense. You can't force AA on Direct3D 10/11 applications at all, except for those that have special driver profiles.

You might as well just be using super sampling...

That doesn't help with deferred shading either.

 

[Secessionist]

Thanks, ShaidarHaran. Why don't nvidia/ati force DX10.1 for DX9 apps?

 

[Novum]

Thanks, ShaidarHaran. Why don't nvidia/ati force DX10.1 for DX9 apps?

D3D10.1 is an entire different API than D3D9, it's not just a single switch you put into your drivers to make something like that work.

Games need special code to do AA with deferred shading under D3D10/10.1/11. If there is no such code, then the driver must know exactly what the application is doing and insert it in the right spots.

 

[Secessionist]

That doesn't make any sense. You can't force AA on Direct3D 10/11 Applications at all

So, to conclude, there is no theoretically possible way to force MSAA in a DX9 game that uses deferred shading?

I wouldn't be surprised if that's the case, but I figured I'd ask anyway.

 

[Novum]

So, to conclude, there is no theoretically possible way to force MSAA in a DX9 game that uses deferred shading?

No, there isn't. Not in the general case.

Even if the game is using D3D10.1/11 it's nothing you get for free. As I said you need a special downsampling logic to do it.

 

[Secessionist]

Is it likely nvidia will implement an edge-detect mode through their drivers?

 

[Secessionist]

Thanks, Novum.

 

[Novum]

Is it likely nvidia will implement an edge-detect mode through their drivers?

I don't think so. All these features don't work for the new Direct3D versions and the percentage of D3D9 apps will slowly decrease.

So if NVIDIA isn't providing it in the drivers for the D3D11 generation of GPUs chances are slim that they will introduce it in the future, because it gets more and more insignificant.

But ATI has released a paper about edge detect downsampling and developers are free to implement it into their game engines. That way it will work on all GPUs.

 

[Davros]

my theory no!
wrappers usually translate inferior hardware to superior hardware or at best similar hardware (or api)
eg: voodoo2(glide) to gf4200(d3d 8.1)
in this case the hardware (gf4200ti) has all the functions that the v2 had and the api has all the functions of the older api you would never be able to do it the other way round eg: dx8.1 to glide

 

[tb]

Is it technically possible to make a DX9->10.1 wrapper that would allow a DX 9 game that uses deferred rendering to run in DX10.1 so it could run with driver-forced MSAA?

Sorry for the noobish question.

Technically, yes, no problem, just a lot of work.
Rendering the game at a higher resolution and then do propper downsampling (aka. SuperSampling) would be much easier and it would solve all visual AA problems.

Thomas

 

[Colourless]

It'd probably be significantly easier to make a DX9 interceptor/wrapper that just fixes the game so App driven MSAA works.

 

[Secessionist]

Technically, yes, no problem, just a lot of work.
Rendering the game at a higher resolution and then do propper downsampling (aka. SuperSampling) would be much easier and it would solve all visual AA problems.

Thomas

Supersampling doesn't do edging very well.