Why should consoles start from USD299?
- Thread starter gongo
- Start date
I am not suggesting two versions of the same game mind you. There would always be one version which will have to either be pushing the weak SKU to the max with some extra performance on the more powerful or push the most powerful to the limit and be severely compromise for the weak..
Forward compatibility doesnt solve the issue where the consumer would probably be waiting for prices to go down to purchase the double GPU model for the best experience.
It doesnt also solve the extra hassle of trying figure out what to scale and optimize for two SKU's. In addition it doesnt solve the problem where the developer would be reluctant to push both SKU's to their very limits as that would need double effort and trying to figure out two hardware.
When you have a single closed box you have a given hardware with a set of limitations and very unique characteristics. Games like Uncharted or GoW 3 were made possible due to understanding the hardware inside and out. Two SKU's, one more powerful than the other would mean trying to make out the limitations and characteristics for each and make that game be able to scale on each SKU's capabilities and limitations. I dont think developers would like that unless they just develop a game that simply performs well on both with some standard improvements between the two.
If the developer does chose to push the console to the limits, one SKU might be able to do stuff impossible on the other and the developer will have to design a game either with double effort or omit some ideas altogether due to limitations of the weaker model.
There wont be a cost effective solution and a single vision of what the developer that wants to aim high would do.
You are basically bringing some of the PC issues to the consoles because there is not a standard hardware.
I didnt imply a standard and a premium released at different periods. I for example as a consumer who is not willing to shove $599 but dont want a single GPU PS4, will wait for the double GPU model to go down. Its like the cheaper model does not exist for me even though both are available.
Having two GPU's to simply get better framerates and resolution sounds like a waste of silicon to me as a double GPU can open much more possibilities than just higher framerates and resolution and Sony would be basically restraining devs from exploiting the hardware in different ways
Agree. But I couldn't think of better way how to cater for both mainstream and hardcore. Better idea?
I don't know that the consoles are seen as toys anymore as millions of people are using them for content delivery, so they just need the appearance of providing value in comparison to current products. $399 is a familiar price point, they could probably raise that some ($449) provided they also increase the apparent value to consumers. Move/Kinect included, additional services etc. 1080P or 3D isn't the carrot that will entice a higher price point.
It would be no different to the iPhone market or similar. With a suitably abstracted software layer, support for tiered platforms would work. Those with the old, outdated technology would buy the new, improved one and pass the old one on to someone else, expanding the market. It's certainly doable, but SKU management becomes an issue. How do you know how many of each SKU to make, etc.? It may be better to have a single console but roll out updates every couple of years or so.That would be insane
That would have worked only under the assumption that it would be a good business model. Which it is not. It adds an extra hassle to game development
They have a device like that, they call it a PC. Many people moved to consoles to avoid upgrades.
$600 is way too high of a launch price. It's out of the majority of people's budgets and even if you do have the money it is hard to justify the expense when you could wait a couple years and get it when the price is lower. Then the other guiy's console tht was launched at $400 has sold much better and is getting more games and shit when I am ready to buy the $600 system when it hits #400 the other sytem is now at $300 and wham I get more value. Early adopters sure will pay absurd prices but trust me when I say once the early adopters have bought the system then it's up to market forces to drive the sales of the system. When it's sitting on such a high price tag consumers will be very reluctant to purchase them.
Sony is especially retarded in this aspect. They were arrogant enough to believe they would continue to dominate this generation with the PS3 and wanted to pack every last feature in (which is a good thing overall) but did it at the cost of the system, which thanks to Blu-ray and CELL, hard drive it drove the price to make it up. Such a massive investment up front was pretty bad. How much money are they making off the PS3 right now?
The playing field changed this generation, the needs and wants of gamers changed. The Wii while selling a lot was a gimmick, and I think the true success this generation lies in the adoption of online services like PSN and Xbox Live, especially Live. But that's getting off topic, unless one considers the price of online services to be part of the price of the console.
I can't blame the console makers for wanting to produce something cheaper from the get go and making money right off the bat. If both consoles are good at tessellation then that could be a huge signifying difference in graphics from day one. We may be underwhelmed at first, but shit given the way things improve generation upon generation even in the current consoles I can't wait. But no, not at $600.
Sony is especially retarded in this aspect. They were arrogant enough to believe they would continue to dominate this generation with the PS3 and wanted to pack every last feature in (which is a good thing overall) but did it at the cost of the system, which thanks to Blu-ray and CELL, hard drive it drove the price to make it up. Such a massive investment up front was pretty bad. How much money are they making off the PS3 right now?
The playing field changed this generation, the needs and wants of gamers changed. The Wii while selling a lot was a gimmick, and I think the true success this generation lies in the adoption of online services like PSN and Xbox Live, especially Live. But that's getting off topic, unless one considers the price of online services to be part of the price of the console.
I can't blame the console makers for wanting to produce something cheaper from the get go and making money right off the bat. If both consoles are good at tessellation then that could be a huge signifying difference in graphics from day one. We may be underwhelmed at first, but shit given the way things improve generation upon generation even in the current consoles I can't wait. But no, not at $600.
Err...no...PCs are not CLOSED platforms as there are a gazillion different configurations...
iPads are CLOSED platforms and tens of millions of people upgraded from 1 to 2 and soon to 3...
A CLOSED console shouldn't have the same problems as OPEN PCs..
The Wii which is bascially a GC 1.5 didn't have any problems selling huge numbers. Now if Nintendo released every 2 years with double the performance instead of say every 4-5 they wouldn't have declining sales like the Wii is now.
Last edited by a moderator:
...or US$399...if you will, why is that some benchmark to buy into..? Frustrating me to see many forum'ers kept claiming..next gen wont be a great leap...Sony won't want to lose money...Nintendo success with cheap Wii/DS paves the way it is meant to be....this is so restrictive....i want my consoles US$599....big box...250W TDP...big exhaust...big graphics...big computational... like so many people won't mind paying US$600+ for the latest phones...tablets...or even more with data plan...US$800++ and the phone will be worthless in 2 years.....you telling me the 4G radio is that expensive...? the processors these mobile devices are using..happens afaik in the past we refer to them as budget chips...the celerons and durons and atoms of the batch....
When...if...though unlikely..that Sony announce PS4, to again ...strike at US$599....you know those "pro" game sites will start making jokes about its price tag...Sony is doom! ..bloggers...forum'ers...will go viral about US$5-9-9 gifs and all...spreading the doom! ..this is so sad when you think about next gen...
599 was a one off due to blu ray imo.
399 i think is where you need to be, a 299 core sku is likely and/or desirable as well. 299/399 I see no problem with at all, 7+ years after 360 launched +inflation marches on. Hell there are 399 360+Kinect+HDD SKU's on sale right now!
I could even see 399/499, or 399 with no 299 SKU, 299 seems a little cheap for a next gen console at this point, even a no hard drive SKU.
Alternatively a valid strategy might be a less powerful (but presumably still punchy) box for 299 (only, no higher priced SKU). Build millions so there's availability (no launch shortage here) and bury the competition by getting a huge lead fast. (Personally, I dont think this is a good strategy, for example I doubt any console maker can get 10m+ boxes ready for launch quarter no matter how modest the tech).
I dont think 599 was the problem with PS3, I think lack of punch (aka, unmistakable graphical dominance) to back up 599 was, as always. But that's another thread.
Personally I dont buy the doom and gloom about how weak the next consoles will be, and I dont think there are any credible rumors about it either. Heck, again, I just mentioned a 399 360 SKU right now, and MS is supposed to be so worried about next gen price? Yeah right. So MS think they can only succeed with a next gen console that starts off cheaper than their current successful console already is? Please. I feel like a lot of people somehow want the next gen consoles to suck for some reason. I do believe they will be more modest but not weak.
Yeah but consoles arent like iPhones and tablets unless you want to design a completely different console product with a completely different environment and experience altogether that wont compete like for like with competition. It wont sell based on the convenience of the typical console. I doubt it will even produce the same type of quality consoles are known for. It will import many inconveniences of the PC world and unlike iPhones and iPads, consoles arent multifunctional portable devices were gaming is the main feature and people want to play the best games on
No, because you don't control the hardware of the PC. Controlling the hardware of a console, like iOS, you can avoid most of the compatibility issues, and security issues of the PC etc. As a closed box it'd be a painless experience just like iPad - buy one and it works, and then buy the next one and it still works while you pass the old one on. If you're already courting a platform that works on portables, PC, and consoles like Live games and XNA, then it's an easy transition to make.
It's still pushing upgrades in a much shorter schedule. The ipad has managed a second generation. When they hit 5 we'll see what the user base looks like. iOS has already disenfranchised most of the first gens and it's not been out for 5 years. I'd find a PC much more palatable than what iOS has managed.
Good point.
However most of what people do with an ipad is already possible on ipad1 and will not make a difference (aside from smoother interface) with ipad4, 5 , or 6.
It will be interesting to see how the marketplace reacts to the new pads in the coming years but I'm willing to bet the phenomenon will cool dramatically.
Cheaper alternatives will exist, and there's the option of buying the "old" ipads which suffice for browsing the web and reading a book which don't need the uber $500 new pad5.
______________
I agree with the OP that $299 doesn't need to be the entry point (I'm expecting $399 myself) but things may change if MS/Sony adopt a more rapid upgrade cycle.
TheChefO said:
You cannot play new games on a ipad1
Hence the wording "most".
People don't buy the ipad with the intent of it being an oversized psp.
They buy the pad to read a book or browse the net and then find out what else they can do with it...
