Why 30 or 60 Frames/Second?

[pipo]

Well, you do, but that is because of stuff like motion blur.

Check: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motion_blur

Recently some fast games like racers opt for 30 FPS with effects like motion blur, where 60 FPS was considered to be the minimum by a lot of people last gen (when devs didn't have these effects available because of processing power).

 

["Nerve-Damage"]

Gears of War from what i heard is 45 fps. anyone dare to tackle?

Err, I don’t think so. 30fps is most cases, less in some (very intense battle situations).

There are hybrid solutions to VSYNC. Gears of War uses VSYNC whenever a frame takes less than 33ms to render and immediately displays the frame if it took more.

This means we VSYNC > 30 FPS (and hence clamping to 30 FPS) and don't drop down to ~20 FPS (32ms + 16ms) just because the framerate might be 29 FPS in rare cases.

In practice, this is the best of both worlds as you get VSYNC 99% of the time and don't get hitches the 1% of the time where strange things happen that cause the framerate to drop slightly. This has been working out great for us, allowing consistent high framerates with minor glitches here and there not ruining the butter smooth feel ;-)

-- Daniel, Epic Games Inc.

 

[blakjedi]

30 fps is minimum for the human eye to see movement as fluid. 60 is "double as good" if you wish, no special purpose.

not true motion picture quality is 24fps

 

[Dave Glue]

not true motion picture quality is 24fps

Oh brother...here we go again.

 

[Zaphod]

not true motion picture quality is 24fps

There is one bigass difference between film and computer graphics. Envision a 360 degree pan of a camera done in one second. One filmed and one computer rendered, both at 24FPS. The film captures all information except when the shutter closes briefly at 15, 30, 45, 60 degrees and so on. The computer, on the other hand, capture only the discrete moment at exactly the same 15, 30, 45, 60 degrees. Apples and oranges.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Plus film jutters. It's not what I'd call smooth!

 

[Simon F]

There is one bigass difference between film and computer graphics. Envision a 360 degree pan of a camera done in one second. One filmed and one computer rendered, both at 24FPS. The film captures all information except when the shutter closes briefly at 15, 30, 45, 60 degrees and so on. The computer, on the other hand, capture only the discrete moment at exactly the same 15, 30, 45, 60 degrees. Apples and oranges.

Not quite. The shutter is only open for ~50% of the frame period, and so you still have significant temporal aliasing with film. IMAX, IIRC, uses 48fps to help give a "smoother" animation.

 

[Blackraven]

What would the benefit of, lets call it dynamic FPS range or something be? If a developer could aim for 35 or 40 fps would this affect how a console game is made and developed?

Perhaps most importantly, would it make a difference at all?

I dunno.

So as perhaps we can eliminate this confusion once and for all?

I mean I've even heard many laymen say that they are not sure if their European DVDs (region-free) would work on a Sony BDP-S1 player bought in the States or questions to see if Resistance Japanese version would work on a PAL PS3 console.

It gives them (average consumers) assurance that when they buy PS3 software from a different country, it would still work on their PS3.

Which also reminds me:
Has anyone tried the PS3 using the respective SD modes?

I was wondering if RFOM (euro PAL version) would convert and display at 60 fps on an American NTSC TV.....or if Minna no Golf 5 would display at 50hz on a European PS3. Meaning......is the PS3 restricted to its own respective SD resolutions as stated by Sony official spec sheets (480 for NTSC consoles and 576 for PAL consoles). Did Sony put any blocks on it (PAL consoles can't display 480i/p while NTSC consoles can't display 576i/p)

In short, does the PS3 have any problems playing games and/or movies between the different SD resolutions (480 lines of resolution versus 576 lines of resolution)

If it is indeed capable of multi-FPS (24/50/60) regardless of the native framerate of the game, is the Nvidia RSX video card responsible for supporting a wide range of resolutions and framerates WITHOUT ANY SUCH RESTRICTIONS???

P.S.
This includes both interlaced and progressive btw.

 

[inefficient]

In short, does the PS3 have any problems playing games and/or movies between the different SD resolutions (480 lines of resolution versus 576 lines of resolution)

I know my JP PS3 does not play Pal DVDs. I know because I accidentally put one in the other day and it gave me an error message saying the disc was Pal.

 

[Gradthrawn]

In short, does the PS3 have any problems playing games and/or movies between the different SD resolutions (480 lines of resolution versus 576 lines of resolution)

If it is indeed capable of multi-FPS (24/50/60) regardless of the native framerate of the game, is the Nvidia RSX video card responsible for supporting a wide range of resolutions and framerates WITHOUT ANY SUCH RESTRICTIONS???

P.S.
This includes both interlaced and progressive btw.

Region encoded disc based movies will not play due to regional restrictions. Other content, that's not restricted by region, play just fine. BD games, downloaded games, downloaded trailers etc all play fine, from my experiences, across regions. Games work because they appear to be coded to. Resistance, for example, has both the PAL and NTSC movies encoded on the disc. I would guess it simple reads the system's setting to determine which version to play.

 

[Blackraven]

Games work because they appear to be coded to. Resistance, for example, has both the PAL and NTSC movies encoded on the disc. I would guess it simple reads the system's setting to determine which version to play.

I guess the PS3 is MULTI-FPS then? That's a relief.

Thanks a lot for the clarification.

 

[oramay]

Thank you for all the replies. I get the rough idea about it now. :smile:

 

[Blackraven]

Sorry for the three month bump......but I still can't seem to understand anything so far.

For example:
1)Guy has SD CRT in Europe (which uses PAL obviously) and a Euro PS3
2)Overseas relative sends him Ridge Racer 7 NTSC version
3)Guy tries the game on his PS3 and sees if his SDTV can display the game.

What happens next:
A) Game will refuse to play in SD mode if different framerate is detected (ie. since his RR7 copy is NTSC while his SDTV is PAL only; both TV and PS3 must use the same color system). A warning message will appear to indicate that there are framerate incompaitibilities between devices (display and PS3) and that HD modes/resolutions must be used. Otherwise, the user has to have a display device that uses the same framerate as that of the PS3 (with the color system supported by that version)

B) PS3 has support for both colour systems regardless of what version it is (both PAL and NTSC are supported and even SECAM and PAL-M if you want to put those in). The PS3 will just convert the framerates if necessary to match the supported framerates of the SD TV/display.

C) Any other answer???