What Xbox and PS2 uses the most polygons/sec

Okay, then. Never played them myself, so 30 fps was just a safer bet (there are many times more 30 fps games than 60 fps games on current-gen consoles, after all).

In any case, that pretty much puts those games at close to double Sentinel's figures.

 

Agggrr, not this topic again. this has been discussed so many times in the past, and it usually ends with ERP telling people what they don't want to believe...

 

I think people are missing the real question. Which system can push the most voxels.

Seriously I think in terms of raw non-fancy poly's the ps2 and xbox are close(ie. Im sure situations can be found for both to win) Once advanced rendering features are added the xbox pulls ahead significantly. In terms of voxels the ps2 wins.

Btw. 2002 called and they want their thread back.

 

Actually, the question being asked in this thread is WHICH GAME on each console uses the most polygons. It's not apparent from the thread title, but the initial post makes it more clear.

 

But he does it SO WELL!

Seriously, tho... He really does. Ya can't argue with ERP, he's got his shi^h^h tuff together.

 

I did a search for "ERP" +"What I don't want to believe" and got zero hits. Can someone summarize?

.Sis

 

Fair enough.

Im going to pull two guesses

ps2. Katamari Damacy

xbox. Unreal championship 2

 

Someone needs to tell Dave that the search feature appears to be really busted -- it doesn't index words less than 3 chars (PS2, GC, ATI, etc) and worse, doesn't appear to have indexed all the posts.

Anyway.

On xbox vs PS2:

http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/showpost.php?p=504702&postcount=61

 

http://www.conceptics.ch/knowledgeb...=1&PHPSESSID=398f4ff4c7006d50d6e0b8da0f1cf251

Hardtuning, PS2, performance, maximize performance, GDC Europe, Performance Analyzer


Ok, so just to finish up I’ll show you again the scan from the very first slide. This is a title which achieves a lot of stuff I’ve talked about today. Notably, for most of the time it’s drawing stuff it’s churning out 10 to 20 million polys. That’s no a random benchmark, that’s physically what the GS starts drawing and like I said during the PA description, it doesn’t count zero-area stuff.
Also, the CPU usage is up at about 50% or more, which is more than double what an average title might see, and better than most good titles by a decent margin. It’s also getting dual-issue for about 80% of the time during the critical processing phases (about half a frames worth).
So good performance is possible, and not only that, but this title was written without the aid of the PA, only using the built in performance counters and a lot of skill. It’s also not perfect and I fully expect to see this developers next title beating this performance on every level. Hopefully you guys can do the same.

.
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http://www.gamasutra.com/gdce/2001/green/green_03.shtml

Speed is all about the Bus.
This has been said many times before, but it bears repeating. The theoretical speed limits of the GS are pretty much attainable, but only by paying attention to the bus speed. The GS can kick one triangle every clock tick (using tri-strips) at 150MHz. This gives us a theoretical upper limit of:

150 million verts per second = 2.5 million verts / frame at 60Hz

Given that each of these polygons will be flat shaded the result isn’t very interesting. We will need to factor in a perspective transform, clipping and lighting which are done on the VUs, which run at 300MHz. The PS2 FAQ says these operations can take 15 – 20 cycles per vertex typically, giving us a throughput of:

5 million verts / 20 cycles per vertex
= 250,000 verts per frame
= 15 million verts per second
5 million verts / 15 cycles per vertex
= 333,000 verts per frame
= 20 million verts per second

Notice the difference here. Just by removing five cycles per vertex we get a huge increase in output. This is the reason we need different renderers for every situation – each renderer can shave off precious cycles-per-vertex by doing only the work necessary.

This is also the reason we have two VUs – often VU1 is often described as the “rendering†VU and VU0 as the “everything else†renderer, but this is not necessarily so. Both can be transforming vertices but only one can be feeding the GIF, and this explains the Memory FIFO you can set up: one VU is feeding the GS while the other is filling the FIFO. It also explains why we have two rendering contexts in the GS, one for each of the two input streams.

 

Ok to summarize what I recall ERP saying...

If I remember right, ERP said that xbox can beat PS2 in performance in just about every area except particles. Or was it non opague over draw?

 

Sony's extensive sampling with the Performance Analyzer a while back found the maximum sustained on PS2 was 7.5M-tri/sec:

http://www.technology.scee.net/sceesite/files/presentations/PSP/HowFarHaveWeGot.pdf

 

That is drawn polygons... ( The number actually transformed and lit is more likely to be in the 10-15 million range )

 

Right, visible geometry, the only kind that matter in the end.

 

I believe Rebel Strike surpassed RS2.(besides, I thought bump mapping was the new in thing, not lots of polys)

Maybe other games have too?

BTW, Jak may push lots of polys, but it also has much simpler textures and effects than most games.

 

No it didn't. "Most games" on PS2 had textures that were on par or worse with those in the Jak games.
Really, technically the Jak2-3 engine should be seen as a miracle, considering the things it does and the platform it's running on.

 

jak3 had alot of polys displayed at a time. though l.o.d is plentyful it is still able to display them with bump maps, particle systems, physics systems, and everything else. i dont think jak3 is such a simple game. transformers displays 60 guys on the screen plus its environments and your guy on the screen at once. granted it slows at times, i dont think the engine was optimised.

 

the reason the two games had bad textures was because of how many characters displayed at a time. and they weren't regular characters, the engine randomly picked pieces then put them togather so once in a black moon you would find the same characters walking around.