Toy Story versus... *spawn

Discussion in 'Console Industry' started by PeanutButterOnPickles, Apr 29, 2016.

  1. Recop

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    I think Ratchet & Clank can have a CGI look during its cinematics for a random guy.

    Obviously, someone working in Pixar will immediatly see many flaws.
     
  2. VFX_Veteran

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    For the record fellas..I was just trolling -- hence why I didn't give any specifics.. I was laughing more at the title than anything.. :)

    Carry on..
     
  3. Metal_Spirit

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    Shure! But Even if Pixar once worked with computers with less Power than the PS4, it never made animations on these circunstances. Pixar works with images rendered one by one, and not in real time. For instance, the original Toy story had frame rendering times going from 2 to 15 hours. And pixar claims rendering times stayed pretty much flat for the last 30 years, since quality was improving!

    So let's give some credit to Ratchet, shall we! It may be imperfect, but it's rendering on a frame time of 33 ms, not 15 hours! And the result is more than visually impresive.
     
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  4. Shifty Geezer

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    Putting that in perspective, 1/30 th second is ~ 1/200,000th the amount of rendering time as a two hour frame. Would people say R&C looks '200,000x worse' than CGI? I think not!
     
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  5. London-boy

    London-boy Shifty's daddy
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    Well. We now actually have this little bit of "toy story graphics in real time"... from my phone I can't see the fine details so no point comparing to the film...



    But yeah. Kingdom hearts 3 looks amazing.
     
    #65 London-boy, Jul 16, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2017
  6. Karamazov

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    even if it's not on the same level technically, at least for some parts, they really nailed the look.
     
  7. Nesh

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    In some areas I have to say that this version looks more pleasing to the eye compared to the very first Toy Story
     
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  8. Laa-Yosh

    Laa-Yosh I can has custom title?
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    It's better in some ways, but worse in others...

    Character models (and environments probably as well) are noticeably low poly, with normal maps. The first Toy Story had NURBS for most geometry, so everything was perfectly smooth.

    Lighting is a mix - it's quality isn't the best, but it seems to have some sorts of baked GI and such; whereas the original just used a LOT of hand placed lights, sort of a "painting with light" approach.

    Shaders are also complicated, there wasn't much beyond phong/blinn back in the day, but those had higher quality levels compared to what's achievable in real time. The game engine on the other hand seems to have some softer shading models, probably even some fake SSS to get translucent plastic.

    Can't say much about the motion blur and DOF, but PRMan was literally built to have the highest possible quality for these image elements, in order to be able to render VFX that can be seamlessly (...) inserted into live footage. No real time renderer can compete with it, even today.


    So all in all, it's still not even a tie yet, IMHO. Sure, some elements may look more pleasing, but the overall image complexity and quality is still better in Toy Story IMHO.
     
  9. Shifty Geezer

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    Though true, the engine wasn't created to get as close as possible to Toy Story. As such it doesn't represent an accurate benchmark of how close we can get. Heck, the engine doesn't even have decent AA which many other games have, so the low IQ versus Toy Story is well below what could be achieved.
     
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  10. DieH@rd

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    KH3 is made with UE4.
     
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  11. orangpelupa

    orangpelupa Elite Bug Hunter
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    KH3 lacks the "plastic look" from toy story movie. Could be the art direction tho.

    other obvious thing is the blocky models in KH3. Sora gooofy and donald kinda evade that by using blocky design, but the toy story toys are supposed to have smooth curves
     
  12. ultragpu

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    Precisely, if we're purely rendering something for the sake of being real time in a very controlled level such as The Dark Sorcerer, we would probably reach far beyond Toy Story 1 graphics. However in a game environment I still think Ratchet & Clank does a better job than KH3, if we're rendering Toy Story's segment with Insomniac's engine it's gonna be more impressive.
     
  13. tuna

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    I remember seeing polygons in Toy Story 1. I do not have the BD anymore so I can't confirm where it happened.
     
  14. zed

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    Like I said earlier in the thread I think ppl are forgetting how bad toy story 1 looked like

    Heres a quote from Mark Van de Wettering from pixar who help develop renderman used in toy story 1
     
  15. Shifty Geezer

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  16. London-boy

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    No AF. Must be PS4.
     
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  17. Nesh

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    There are some things about the way lighting and speculars look in the original that make me feel unease. Or probably its the facial animations. I am not sure. It gives me an uncanny valley vibe
     
  18. Silent_Buddha

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    Yeah, that's still miles beyond what real time games can do, although as Laa-Yosh mentioned a few things can be done better in games now, most things still can't match what was done in there.

    Unfair comparison (real time vs. hours per frame), but people still like to compare them for reasons.

    Regards,
    SB
     
  19. zed

    zed
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    They're using an extremely simple 1970s lighting model thats prolly why the lighting looks crap.
    eg check the lighting in shiftys pictures compared to todays realtime lighting model
    [​IMG]
     
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  20. Shifty Geezer

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    It's very fake. The lighting and shadowing has no GI calculations, so it's all artistically placed and thus inaccurate and nothing fits together. Missing contact shadows are a killer. Plus the shading is absent - it's just phong. Everything's various flavours of plastic.
     
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