The Power of Bitboys Acceleon G40

[Nappe1]

http://www.bitboys.com/demo/g40.html

G40 running this in realtime.
there's wmv video available.

This is shown in Bitboys stand at 3gsm.


if someone thinks that some other forum is better to this, please free to move it.

 

[TEXAN]

Hey napp, IMGtec showed a racer demo for MBX at the show yesterday, I've only seen a screen of it do you know if there's a vid online?

 

[Nappe1]

Hey napp, IMGtec showed a racer demo for MBX at the show yesterday, I've only seen a screen of it do you know if there's a vid online?

I haven't come across a video about it.. I have seen the screenshot though.

 

[hey69]

wow, nice demho movie

 

[Guden Oden]

This must be the Sony GS3; it only renders blue pixels apparantly.

 

[Nappe1]

it only renders blue pixels apparantly.

Hey! what a great way to save bandwidth, because you only need B-channel of RGB, it means 2 bytes per pixel less write/read to/from framebuffer.


still, I think this is so far most impressive demo running in mobile HW 3D. is it that as technologically, is different question then.

 

[PC-Engine]

I just wish NEC would hurry up and release a cellphone using one of the Bityboys chips since they've been cranking out new phone models left and right. 8)

 

[Ailuros]

No idea what you guys are saying, but that shot looks beautiful. Need to fetch that video to get a better impression of it.

 

[Simon F]

I just wish NEC would hurry up and release a cellphone using one of the Bityboys chips since they've been cranking out new phone models left and right. 8)

I thought they already had phones using the G10, not that it gives you much in the way of texture mapping.

 

[TEXAN]

I think all of these new bitboys, falanx, nvidia goforce4800 chips are produced on 90nm.

They have to be because I've been doing a bit spec comparison and they completely blow the MBX out of the water in terms of features, such as pixel shading which mbx lacks, and 200mhz clock speeds all the while they are as energy efficient as the mbx's aswell, if not more so

If this is the case then IMG need to get a move on and develop MBX on 90nm aswell. Or else this will be another market they'll get squeezed out off aswell, what'll be painfull is that they were the first ones on the block.

 

[TEXAN]

I've done somemore research its actually on 0.13

Both use tiling
----------------------------------------------------------------------

mali55 which is equal to an MBX R-S in performance and features can do 200mhz and produced on 0.13 uses 0.4mW/Mhz and 190,000 logic gates

MBX R-S 0.13 120mhz uses 0.5mW/Mhz and 270,000 logic gates

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Mali110 which is equal to an MBX HR-S again 200Mhz & on 0.13 consumes 0.5mW/Mhz and uses 230,000 Logic gates

MBX HR-S 120Mhz 0.13 consumes 1.2mW/Mhz and 480,000

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Here are the sources

http://www.neon.co.uk/campus/articles/arm/arm_article_autumn02.htm

http://www.falanx.no/download/Mali55_Mali110_Product.pdf

 

[Simon F]

They have to be because I've been doing a bit spec comparison and they completely blow the MBX out of the water in terms of features, such as pixel shading which mbx lacks,

Yet the feature list for mali55 says:

4X / 16X Full Scene Anti-Aliasing
16 bit / 32 bit frame-buffer
Hardware Triangle Setup Unit
Flat / Gouraud Shading
Point Sampling / Bilinear / Trilinear
Texturing
Anisotropic mapping
Mip mapping
Multi Texturing
2bpp Texture Compression (FLXTC)
Dot3 Bump Mapping
Render to Texture
Stencil Buffering (4-bit)
Early Z test

I can't see anything stating shaders - not even a vertex shader.

 

[Joe DeFuria]

I can't see anything stating shaders - not even a vertex shader.

C'mon Simon...can't you read?!

Flat / Gouraud Shading

 

[darkblu]

I can't see anything stating shaders - not even a vertex shader.

C'mon Simon...can't you read?!

Flat / Gouraud Shading

that shading is a completely different one - that's the shade the IC package casts when lit by sun rays at around noon.

 

[London Geezer]

 

[Teasy]

What are the basic specs for all these mobile chips being mentioned? As in pixel pipelines, texture units, bandwidth ect?

 

[Ailuros]

I can't see anything stating shaders - not even a vertex shader.

Falanx has an optional geometry processor (VS2.0):

http://www.falanx.no/download/Mali Geometry Product Spec USL.pdf

In fact they updated their whitepapers; I knew Mali was tile based the open question was if it was a deferred renderer. It looks like it is after all:

It is also embeds
technology for improving bandwidth and memory utilization normally
plagued with deferred rendering architectures.

There are a couple of differences in terms of power consumption between the old and the new pdfs:

Mali100 (old): 0.6mW/MHz, max. 183MHz, 3.5mm2

Numbers are reported in Free Artisan.13 NAND2X2
and 80MHz implementation and full scan on all fl ip
fl ops.

Mali110 (new): 0.5mW/MHz, max. 200MHz, 3.0mm2

All numbers are reported in Free Artisan .13 NAND2X2 and 80MHz implementation and full scan on all flip flops. Numbers
does not include configurable L2 Cache.

 

[Ailuros]

I think all of these new bitboys, falanx, nvidia goforce4800 chips are produced on 90nm.

They have to be because I've been doing a bit spec comparison and they completely blow the MBX out of the water in terms of features, such as pixel shading which mbx lacks, and 200mhz clock speeds all the while they are as energy efficient as the mbx's aswell, if not more so

If this is the case then IMG need to get a move on and develop MBX on 90nm aswell. Or else this will be another market they'll get squeezed out off aswell, what'll be painfull is that they were the first ones on the block.

Apart from Bitboys G40, none of the others seem to have pixel shaders.

Mali/G34/G40 are IMO rather second generation PDA/mobile chips; as for GoForce, AR10 - despite the checkbox features on NV's site - doesn't even have apparently a real geometry processor. The core is barely capable of transformations; big deal.

IMG should be working for quite some time now on their own second generation chip; maybe they'll even call it MBX2 or something like that. When they'll present it is another story.

Simon,

A question you might be able to answer: do semiconductors ask for a future roadmap before signing a license?

 

[SiBoy]

I think all of these new bitboys, falanx, nvidia goforce4800 chips are produced on 90nm.

They have to be because I've been doing a bit spec comparison and they completely blow the MBX out of the water in terms of features, such as pixel shading which mbx lacks, and 200mhz clock speeds all the while they are as energy efficient as the mbx's aswell, if not more so

If this is the case then IMG need to get a move on and develop MBX on 90nm aswell. Or else this will be another market they'll get squeezed out off aswell, what'll be painfull is that they were the first ones on the block.

The MBX in the OMAP2420 (silicon was shown at ISSCC) was in 90nm and clocked at 200 MHz. Area is around 10mm^2.

Who in the mobile space has shown pixel shading in real silicon?

 

[Simon F]

Simon,

A question you might be able to answer: do semiconductors ask for a future roadmap before signing a license?

"Semiconductors"? I presume you aren't talking about some form of AI here.

To be honest, I've no idea. I would guess some manufacturers possibly do and maybe others don't. I only help design the technology, not sell it (although a good design can help sell itself, I guess, so perhaps that isn't strictly true).