The LAST R600 Rumours & Speculation Thread
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1/4 means essentially 1/4. Bus aside, 1/4 the shaders, 1/4 the ROPs, etc. Rv530, for example, is roughly 1/4 of R580, as Rv515 was 1/4 R520.. RV560 is 1/2, and RV570 is 3/4. I expect this trend to continue in almost the same release schedule that occurred last year (hopefully with less delays since the first low-end parts will already be on the new process, unlike RV560/RV570). The difference between this and last gen is I don't think they will change the architecture with R680, therefore RV610/Rv630 will just be different fractions of R600. Like I said, I think 1/8 and 1/4. Yes, I could very well be wrong. The point is, I do not think RV630 is their 1/2'ed part, I believe that is coming later. Maybe it's R670 (which I think is 3/4 and 256-bit or higher bus), maybe it's RV660 as I believe it is...I dunno. When that happens I expect your 256-bit to exist along with 1/2 the bandwidth.
Now the question remains how 1/4 a R600 would compare to a 1/2 G80 (with a 128-bit not 192-bit bus).
Sadly, I DO believe ATi will end up giving nvidia a free ride until their performance mainstream parts arrive if R6xx's architecture in general is not more efficient than GF8's, and RV630 seems in my mind, inferior at first glance to 8600. There are of course variables though, like could a 65nm part such as Rv630 clock higher to make up lost ground on raw specs? It's possible. Personally though, I have higher expectations for 8600 than I do Rv630. I don't expect it to be another x600 or x1600, but lower-end than 8600 at the same price just the same. Of course, I expect RV660 to replace it's price point and for it to crush the 8600, but that is a hypothesis that has quite a few months to go before we get the answer. In essence, I expect ATi to do more of the same of what they did last go-round, only this time the later mid-range parts to have a 256-bit bus, and for their architecture to compete better in general...but still late.
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All the information so far has put R6xx on 65nm.
http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/showthread.php?t=29612
http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/showthread.php?t=37803
An exact half R600 on 65nm would be ~140mm². (R600 ~434mm² based on the leaked die shot)
http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/showthread.php?t=29612
http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/showthread.php?t=37803
An exact half R600 on 65nm would be ~140mm². (R600 ~434mm² based on the leaked die shot)
icecold1983
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x800 pro was clearly faster than every card from the previous gen, so was the 6800 gt
same for the lesser x1800 model and the 2nd 7800 model
icecold1983
Banned
that was the top of the line card, i dont recall ati releasing a lower 9700 card till MUCH later.
Hmmm I still haven't come around to considering $400 as "mainstream". To me that's still G73/RV530 class chips around ~$200. I don't think you should define mainstream based on the number of SKU's above it but rather based on what the "mainstream" demographic purchasees 
Anything above that falls into the performance/high-end segment IMO.
Anything above that falls into the performance/high-end segment IMO.
MSRP != street prices
They typically do at launch, which is what you were talking about --at launch.
Also that their review was delayed due to availability. :smile:
On the other hand, just noticed that the highest RV630 sucks 128 watts. With that power consumption it better be 1/2 R600 if it's truly 65nm...
Well the NV40 is most certainly a very "good" example compared to NV30
I was talking about a true new generation that comes along with fundamental changes also from the software side, something along the line GF2 Ultra vs. GF3. What changes did the X800 bring with it exactly compared to R300, other than doubling the amount of units?
icecold1983
Banned
Well the NV40 is most certainly a very "good" example compared to NV30
I was talking about a true new generation that comes along with fundamental changes also from the software side, something along the line GF2 Ultra vs. GF3. What changes did the X800 bring with it exactly compared to R300, other than doubling the amount of units?
does that rly matter? performance and time between release is far more relevant imo. no need to get an attitude about it tho lol
RV560/570 and so far performance parts from both IHVs have the buswidth of the high end GPUs, since they're slated directly from there. Those appear only when manufacturing processes mature as much and yields are nearly optimal so that they can end up selling such a board at around $250 or less. I've no idea what the performance RV6x0 will look like in the future, but I don't expect to see any of it earlier than close to the end of this year either.
If G86 has significantly higher fillrates (which isn't unlikely, unless RV630 clocks way above R600 frequencies), the scale might weigh again into NV's corner temporarily. Not my initial point either.
Look at what you guys are suggesting....128bits are "fine" for midrange, 256bits are being speculated for the performance segment later on (which by the way makes up the largest portion of all segments these days) and we need that much bandwidth for the high end GPUs?
I wouldn't ask any silly questions if the product line would look something like that:
High end: 512bit
Performance: 512bit (cut back from high end SKUs)
Midrange: 256bit
Budget: 128bit
In such a case I'd think that the overall need for more bandwidth has truly grown and the distances between each segment look way more balanced.
Where do you see any kind of attitude anyway? Just because I'm not giving you much more room to downplay any point I'm trying to make and you're running out of arguments it doesn't mean that I have an attitude or am getting personal or hostile in the end.
icecold1983
Banned
im not even arguing, but the fact is in the past 2nd from high end parts have almost always been clearly faster than the previous top of the line.
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