The Great Framerate Non-Debate

24fps in movies also depends in the operating range of your eyes that depend on ambient light, vitamin A and so on... rhodopsin slowers light integration time on the retina but any source of bright light destroys rhodopsin. IIRC Mesoptic range needs 10min darkness. So arrive early in the theather and look away from any light source to build rhodopsin. Then let the cinema "magic" take you away.

Obs. The yellowish seasoning in cinema popcorn helps vitamin A levels.
 
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The Last of Us 30hz mode is broken; the amount of motion blur is the same as the 60hz version; so 30hz comes of as really stuttery in comparison. Even the PS3 version appears more fluid. So that game should not be taken as a benchmark or test wether people prefer 30 or 60, IMO
 
Shifty Geezer said:
Suggests basically just duplicating frames then, so not a fair comparison.
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That sounds like a reasonable explanation.

It's a missed chance because I was really open to the comparison.

Dead Space 1 I compared before; it was ultimately better at 30hz because the animations were hard-coded in 30hz I guess; everything looked stuttery at 60hz.
Also the weapons muzzle flashes were in 30hz. Firing the pulse rifle felt really weird.
So DS1 was not a fair comparison either; were the animations keyframed/motionblended and were the muzzle flashes 'unlocked' (sorry for not supplying a better term); I would have probably played it at 60hz.
 
For comparisons you could pick modern PC games and restrict framerate with Dxtory. Then again, as a PC gamer that didn't start playing just last gen, the dichotomy between framerate and higher quality graphics has always been obvious to me.

Cjail said:
Etymologically or philosophically speaking?
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Perception wise.
 
Of course it is easy for everyone to see the difference, did a blind test with my gf.

The real question is...does it add to the experience. E.g. In a game like TLoU?

E.g. Joel has quite the swaying aim anyway...he is not meant to be a sniper skilled shooter...so does 60Hz precision gameplay add in this case?

We also don't have a fair comparison wrt the visual impact...as 30Hz is not really with improved pixel quality.

But the pure clarity this increased space-time resolution offers really is impressive....should an increase in spatial resolution always come with increased temporal resolution as otherwise the benefit is only while not moving? What about the other way around...low spatial resolution but high temporal resolution (the 600p@60Hz CODs of last gen come to mind)?

Is there a known balance between spatial and temporal resolution?
 
L. Scofield said:
Perception wise.
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Then etymologically.
Anyway, to answer your question, probably only to blind people 30fps and 60fs are the same ;)

Billy Idol said:
The real question is...does it add to the experience. E.g. In a game like TLoU?

E.g. Joel has quite the swaying aim anyway...he is not meant to be a sniper skilled shooter...so does 60Hz precision gameplay add in this case?
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What do you mean with "60hz precision gameplay"?
Input lag is reduce at 60fps but AFAIK 60fps don't make controls more precise/accurate.
AFAIK dead-zone in the controller don't change at 30fps or 60fps.

Correct me if I am wrong of course.
 
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maybe he mean more pricise/acurate due to less lag?

on PC, i prefer playing alll low to get 60+ fps in Multiplayer. This is due to aiming become easy to do and much precise.

about TLOU. I do think 60 fps will make the gunplay easer, more fun, more accurate. because in PS3, i play TLOU interchangably between normal (for action level) and +TV Smooth motion. I cant aim at all with smooth motion enabled, the lag is unbearable.
 
DS4 has less/reduced dead-zones compared to DS3 so I think the benefits in therms of precision in TLOU come from that not from the higher frame-rate.
 
Cjail said:
Then etymologically
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Etymology is the study of the origins of words.

AFAIK 60fps don't make controls more precise/accurate.
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It can definitely. Try a low framerate game. There's not enough temporal resolution to track at speed making it difficult to adjust aim and be accurate. Switch to a 60 fps shooter and it's easier to follow and preempt targets.
 
Shifty Geezer said:
Etymology is the study of the origins of words.
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I know.
Sorry but what's wrong with asking if a word is used in its etymological sense or not?

It can definitely. Try a low framerate game. There's not enough temporal resolution to track at speed making it difficult to adjust aim and be accurate. Switch to a 60 fps shooter and it's easier to follow and preempt targets.
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Ok that seeing a target better allows to aim better but isn't the precision of the controls determined by the dead-zones and not by frame-rate?
 
L. Scofield said:
Back when PC game developers actually pushed the systems it was pretty common for PC gamers to set everything to max even if that meant running the game at 20fps or less (the exception being multiplayer games).The whole 1080p/60fps only happened due to the demise of high-end PC developers.
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They still exist in the modding scene :p
 
Cjail said:
I know.
Sorry but what's wrong with asking if a word is used in its etymological sense or not?
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What would it even mean to "use a word in its etymological sense"? You mean like, use it in the way its origins were used? I'm confused.

Ok that seeing a target better allows to aim better but isn't the precision of the controls determined by the dead-zones and not by frame-rate?
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It's hardly exclusive. If you can control more precisely because a higher framerate offers better object track and motion feedback, then isn't it reasonable to say that the framerate contributed to increased control precision?

Dead zones will of course also be a factor in the precision of a game's controls. But there are many factors, from the design* of the input device, to the way input data is polled and applied to the game's functional logic, to how the game responds with feedback.

*And manufacturing. I'm looking at you, Microsoft. 360 controller faceplate manufacturing was a joke, slow turn all over the place.
 
HTupolev said:
What would it even mean to "use a word in its etymological sense"? You mean like, use it in the way its origins were used? I'm confused.
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I didn't mean to be so obscure, probably in English this expression is not as common as in my mother tongue.
Anyway I simply wanted to know if he was using the word aesthetic in its true, original, sense.

I am sorry anyway.
 
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