Teamxbox confirms that hdd will be included and free network gameplay

[function]

No in the article you can tell that at that time offically it was known that the HDD was in the spec.

But you can't tell that!

If he's confimred that a 360 might not always come with a HDD, it clearly can't be part of the basic spec as it would break compatability with every 360 game that used it when it wasn't there.

Look at everything from the leaked specs in 2004 to all the developer murmerings to the way that MS cleverly worded all their statements. They never confirmed that a HDD would be part of the basic 360 spec that every game could rely on to run. They don't appear to have done that behind the scenes and they didn't do it in public.

Even if every Xbox 360 had shipped with one at launch it still wouldn't have meant that was the case, becuase what you package up for retail and what you tell developers thay can rely on to be there are two different things.

No this will not turn into that. I know MS never meant that. And aren't you talking about the billion unit sells number?

There was a billion unit number too?

 

[function]

Are we playing the revisionist history game? Allard quite clearly (unless I'm going crazy, which is quite possible at this point) stated that an HDD was standard with every Xbox 360 system (which technically may be true, if you're into the semantics game -- Xbox 360 does have it, it's the Xbox 360 Core that doesn't).

So they decided to release and additional lower priced package sooner rather than later. No one is denying the core got released, what's revisionist about that? Read the article though:

Microsoft's forthcoming next-generation console may not always ship in a configuration with a hard drive, key Xbox executive J Allard has confirmed, with developers being warned not to rely on the component for their games.

Some units came with a HDD. Some didn't. But the basic functionality of the 360 platform and the lack of a HDD as a basic part of that platform didn't change.

 

[Johnny Awesome]

Also, if the PS3 makes a HD standard, will MS respond by tilting the premium/core more towards to the premium with the eventuality of the premium becoming the de facto standard. Half of me says "yes" but the other half thinks MS will feel "its more important to get to $149."

I think it's more important to get to $149 quicker. Casual gamers aren't going to wait 4 years until the PS3 is $149 if they can get an X360 with the same type of games a couple years from now.

 

[Bobbler]

The revisionist part comes from denying that it was stated that the HDD would be standard -- look at the E3 press conference, I believe that's where it was originally shown/implied. I can't search while at work, but I'm sure others can. That article looks like it was made after the statement about standard HDDs, so I'm not sure how that disproves anything (check the date on it -- I can't).

And that 100m number I've never heard, but I have heard the 1 billion number, which was a statement that MS wanted to reach 1 billion people with their X360... a bit silly but harmless, more or less.

Regardless, this really doesn't have much to do with the thread topic.

 

[scooby_dooby]

Like everyone said, it's been conirmed [gamasutra], drop it.

Point me to the official sony website, or spec sheet, where they confirm a 60GBB hdd and I'll drop it.

 

[Titanio]

Are we playing the revisionist history game? Allard quite clearly (unless I'm going crazy, which is quite possible at this point) stated that an HDD was standard with every Xbox 360 system

Their web site clearly said this from E3 onward too, until even shortly after they announced the dual-SKU. The whole "core pack isn't a 360" cop-out is nonsense.

 

[rounin]

Point me to the official sony website, or spec sheet, where they confirm a 60GBB hdd and I'll drop it.

No, I think you should drop it regardless since it has already been deemed unworthy of debate by someone with less bias and working common sense
.

 

[scooby_dooby]

Their web site clearly said this from E3 onward too, until even shortly after they announced the dual-SKU. The whole "core pack isn't a 360" cop-out is nonsense.

Of course it is, don't you see how anoying it is when fanb0ys try and pretend a company never said something by splitting hairs, when everyone knows what actually happened? Kinda like when people pretend Sony didn't claim PS3 was twice as powerful as 360...

Anyways, yes peter moore at E3 confirmed the HDD for all 360's, and they backed out end of story.

 

[pipo]

Anyways, yes peter moore at E3 confirmed the HDD for all 360's, and they backed out end of story.

It's just that I've read a lot of stuff, but I really don't recall that...

 

[mckmas8808]

Anyways, yes peter moore at E3 confirmed the HDD for all 360's, and they backed out end of story.

You should tell function that. He doesn't seem to believe this happened.

 

[_phil_]

Point me to the official sony website, or spec sheet, where they confirm a 60GBB hdd and I'll drop it.

if only one site can be trusted it's probably gamasutra.
But the Iquire and some other sites are way better to provide chaotic messy discutions (not to say trolling fest ).
That 's probably why we have 16585,56 times more threads based on their non-information than from sites like Gamasutra.com.

 

[pipo]

You should tell function that. He doesn't seem to believe this happened.

Look at what happened last week. 50% of the sites report Sony will ship with a HDD, the other half say they won't. Both because of the same press conference.

IMHO, Ken didn't announce they will for sure. Yet.

If I Google for an interview or press conference with Peter Moore at E3, I get _0_ (that's zero) hits with 'hard drive confirmed'. And I don't need 'interpretations' from respected sites, for reasons stated earlier. Just one quote or a press release.

Come on, prove me wrong.

 

[mckmas8808]

Look at what happened last week. 50% of the sites report Sony will ship with a HDD, the other half say they won't. Both because of the same press conference.

IMHO, Ken didn't announce they will for sure. Yet.

If I Google for an interview or press conference with Peter Moore at E3, I get _0_ hits with 'hard drive confirmed'. And I don't want 'interpretations' from respected sites. Just one quote or a press release.

Come on, prove me wrong.

Go to IGN and watch the MS E3 conference. I think that's when either Peter or Allard actually said it themselves.

 

[NavNucST3]

Go to IGN and watch the MS E3 conference. I think that's when either Peter or Allard actually said it themselves.

As has been pointed out before, the Xbox 360 DOES indeed ship with a hard drive, the Xbox 360 Core does not. It may be a semantic difference, but not enough to say they lied.

 

[Moonblade]

I'm too tired to quote everyone but here's my resume:

1. MS first said a HDD would be standard because I remember all the sony ******* complaining about it after the unexpected announcement months before launch.
When Allard said "Xbox 360 may not always have a hard drive" he meant that it was removable from the unit (and not build-in).

2. According to gamespot, MS aimed for 100 million sold Xboxes so yes, they actually said that too. I'll try to give a link of this once I find my way to the gamespot news archive.

So, now that I have thrown enough oil on the fire ...

.... why the bloody, bloody hell is Cesar posting this PS3 news on teamxbox? This is the same person who wrote an very biased article just before E3.
He's either really impressed by PS3 and a cured fundamentalist or he's working on a new 'sony's PS3 promises' article.

 

[Neeyik]

Point me to the official sony website, or spec sheet, where they confirm a 60GBB hdd and I'll drop it.

Okay. I'll ask you to drop it then - this comment goes to anyone really but it's pertinent to this particular debate. Repeated arguing about the same point, when one's stance is already well known, does not contribute to a meaningful discussion and users who repeatedly do this will receive a request to stop doing this. After that, it's a short ban to mull it over. And after that...well...