Sony PlayStation 5 Pro

[iroboto]

There's less than 5% of gamers with $1600 GPUs. There is a market for higher priced consoles but its quite small. Especially now with longer SDLCs, and marginal improvements in GPUs. You dont get a 2x improvement in visual fidelity(which is the most important thing) by having a 2x more powerful GPU. A much smarter strategy is to launch a powerful handheld at the end of a gen that can run the games of that current gen and cross gen titles of the next. So a $500 PS5 pro and then in 2027 launch a $500 handheld then in 2028 launch a new gen with cross gen titles that can run in decent form on the last gen console and the relatively new handheld. People are more likely to pay for a handheld device actually.

Yea it's becoming a more attractive area I feel for IHVs. You've got this smaller chip now that runs on lower power and is capable of running ps4 gen based games or at least close to and it will last a long time because it's not chasing the latest and greatest.

 

[eastmen]

from my POV the TAM for a 4090 is quite large owing to:
a) High End performance gamers
b) Machine Learning AI industry
c) Cryptocurrency
d) Content Creation / Video encoding / Video Streaming / Video Game Streaming / Live Streaming

I think anyone would tell you that the 4090 excels at all of these, and if you are doing work in categories b to d, its hard to find a better card for it. There's actual reasons to own a 4090 outside of just pure gaming, whereas you don't even have a calculator on a console today. Quite frankly the price point is probably pretty off putting for gamers, but the industry work, that's probably a price point they are willing to pay to get the job done faster. I'm pretty sure the DF team can add some insight here on how much faster a 4090 encodes.

Sure there are other reasons to buy a 4090 but a lot of people buy them for just games. Same with the 4080 .

Also not to sure if c is really still a thing. The majority of cryptos worth mining are gone.


The ps5 is $400 and the xsx is $500. I certainly think a $700-800 machine can exist esp if it provides large improvements in performance which it likely would. Yes it would be a smaller amount vs a $500 console but that can be said about any price point.

 

[eastmen]

There's less than 5% of gamers with $1600 GPUs. There is a market for higher priced consoles but its quite small. Especially now with longer SDLCs, and marginal improvements in GPUs. You dont get a 2x improvement in visual fidelity(which is the most important thing) by having a 2x more powerful GPU. A much smarter strategy is to launch a powerful handheld at the end of a gen that can run the games of that current gen and cross gen titles of the next. So a $500 PS5 pro and then in 2027 launch a $500 handheld then in 2028 launch a new gen with cross gen titles that can run in decent form on the last gen console and the relatively new handheld. People are more likely to pay for a handheld device actually.

Like I said if done properly the additional money can offer a sizable increase in performance. There are people out there who would gladly spend an extra $200-300 if it means getting performance on their favorite games. And issue with launching a 2027 handheld is that it will not be powerful enough to play ps6 games. So you get the issue where you are stuck on last generation games. It would make more sense to launch a ps5 handheld now and not at the end of the generation.

And those people will then look at what PC they can get for $700, 800 or even $1000, see the much larger library on PC and potential for 60fps+ and buy a PC instead.

A console is still a box you connect to your tv and games just work. A pc is not that .

Yea it's becoming a more attractive area I feel for IHVs. You've got this smaller chip now that runs on lower power and is capable of running ps4 gen based games or at least close to and it will last a long time because it's not chasing the latest and greatest.

I don't think a ps4 handheld would be very popular.

 

[davis.anthony]

A console is still a box you connect to your tv and games just work. A pc is not that .

That's funny, my PC is just a box that on my occasion has just been plugged in to my TV and games just worked.

 

[iroboto]

Okay let’s stay on topic. I’m sorry for the de-rail. Let’s stay on 5Pro hardware. Thank you.

 

[Nesh]

If a more expensive console doesn't bring sizeable enough sales and risks dividing the brand and software development then it's not worth it.

We don't know the price of PS5 Pro, and so far it doesn't seem like a huge step up from the base model.

Let's move please.

 

[rntongo]

Like I said if done properly the additional money can offer a sizable increase in performance. There are people out there who would gladly spend an extra $200-300 if it means getting performance on their favorite games.

Thats such a small amount of customers, PS4 pro sold millions of units. Sony looked at the success of the PS4 pro and said they'll repeat that. Developers want to put in extra effort on a platform that reaches millions. Games look similar on the PS5/XSX and an RTX 4090(Its not a night and day difference visually) although certainly look better/sharper on the High End PC GPU, the only major difference is the fps but visually they are not worlds apart. So it makes sense to simply make a $500 box that can sell in millions and hit higher fps than the base console. This is what Sony is aiming for. That extra sharpness from a $700-$800 machine just doesnt sell well unfortunately. People in the millions pay for a $500 box and then spend extra on software related content and services. Even better if Sony figures out a way of selling at a lower price evenually. Like $400. I think they're going to aim to hit $499 for the PS5 pro without the disc drive then drop the base PS5 slim to $399 at the end of the year.

And issue with launching a 2027 handheld is that it will not be powerful enough to play ps6 games. So you get the issue where you are stuck on last generation games. It would make more sense to launch a ps5 handheld now and not at the end of the generation.

A handheld launched in 2027 with the PS6 launching in 2028 will play PS6 games at a lower resolution upscaled 30 fps. Doesnt have to be 4K gaming. Could be 1080p or lower upscaled to 1440p at 30 fps or something a long those lines. It would be something much more powerful than the Switch 2 which is going to last for at least 5 years after launch.

 

[Sonic]

The launch of current consoles clearly gave us insight that plenty of people are willing to pay $800+ for a new console. I would consider that number to be minimum 3 million people so I do find it disingenuous to say such a device wouldn't sell in the millions. At such a high price I do believe we're limited to around 3 million users for a mid gen upgrade. To grab a suffer audience the closer they get to $500 the better. But nay. I imagine plenty will fork over $800+ for a PS5 pro when it launches and if the scalpers soak up most of the supply.

 

[babybumb]

What is the elevator pitch for a PS5 Pro? | Opinion

Sign up for the GI Daily here to get the biggest news straight to your inbox A few weeks ago, I wrote about the unusual…

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This narrative that is not as big step as 4-> 4 Pro seems to pulled from not understanding anything. Even DF debunked that.

"Pro was good beause 4k screens" Pro needed about twice the power to actually do that.. (One X). But people still bought ~10-20 million of them.

Spec Analysis: PlayStation 5 Pro - the most powerful console yet

Tech specs for PlayStation 5 Pro have leaked - Digital Foundry verifies them and delivers analysis and further information.

www.eurogamer.net

I believe that PS5 Pro should be able to deliver a far higher perceptual increase in resolution vs PS5 than the PS4 Pro did against its junior variant.,

It seeems Sony pulled amazing marketing move of lowered ecpectations and over-deliver? Because some people think this wont do anything. Well Portal shouldnt be best-selling accessory either

 

[Mitchings]

I don't think it needs a new display resolution/paradigm as the moniker like "4K" or "8K".

"AI", "Ray Tracing" and the branded upscaling solution in "PSSR" will be enough for the crowd a Pro system targets. Paired with some examples of their tangible benefits of course.

Just imagine these on the box, in ads and alluded to in official presentations/communications..

 

[rntongo]

I don't think it needs a new display resolution/paradigm as the moniker like "4K" or "8K".

"AI", "Ray Tracing" and the branded upscaling solution in "PSSR" will be enough for the crowd a Pro system targets. Paired with some examples of their tangible benefits of course.

Just imagine these on the box, in ads and alluded to in official presentations/communications..

This!! Its going to sell out. Higher FPS in a lot of titles as well. They dont need the 4K tag.

 

[Frenetic Pony]

I don't think it needs a new display resolution/paradigm as the moniker like "4K" or "8K".

"AI", "Ray Tracing" and the branded upscaling solution in "PSSR" will be enough for the crowd a Pro system targets. Paired with some examples of their tangible benefits of course.

Just imagine these on the box, in ads and alluded to in official presentations/communications..

Yeah that looks right, I'm sure I'll listen to one or two people I know gushing about this thing in a few months. Nice job on the graphic design.

 

[QPlayer]

I bet the starting price of the PS5 pro will be $699

 

[Clukos]

I bet the starting price of the PS5 pro will be $699

Imo it will be 100 more than PS5. So $599 in US, £579 in UK etc. Same as it was for PS4 Pro. Anything more than that is too much for a console refresh.

 

[Globalisateur]

What is the elevator pitch for a PS5 Pro? | Opinion

Sign up for the GI Daily here to get the biggest news straight to your inbox A few weeks ago, I wrote about the unusual…

www.gamesindustry.biz

This narrative that is not as big step as 4-> 4 Pro seems to pulled from not understanding anything. Even DF debunked that.

"Pro was good beause 4k screens" Pro needed about twice the power to actually do that.. (One X). But people still bought ~10-20 million of them.

Spec Analysis: PlayStation 5 Pro - the most powerful console yet

Tech specs for PlayStation 5 Pro have leaked - Digital Foundry verifies them and delivers analysis and further information.

www.eurogamer.net

It seeems Sony pulled amazing marketing move of lowered ecpectations and over-deliver? Because some people think this wont do anything. Well Portal shouldnt be best-selling accessory either

Yes many PS players know exactly why this machine is for them. It's no for Xbox players (that will wait next year for a better console and will eagerly consume any content about it from now on) or PC crowd (that already play with RT and DLSS at 60fps). It's for Playstation player wanting more RT effects and something similar to DLSS on their games, with a performance similar to a 4070 on their own console. People wanting this better pre-order this as soon as possible.

Besides it's going to be the first Console (and AMD product) to pull off genuine DLSS-like AI upscaling! People should be happy because it was sorely needed. The only question is why AMD or Microsoft didn't even attempt to do that before? Why were they waiting on Sony to do the work? because PSSR like DLSS are mostly a complex software endeavour. And we need competition against Nvidia and now Intel for AI upscaling, the more the merrier.

 

[QPlayer]

Yes many PS players know exactly why this machine is for them. It's no for Xbox players (that will wait next year for a better console and will eagerly consume any content about it from now on) or PC crowd (that already play with RT and DLSS at 60fps). It's for Playstation player wanting more RT effects and something similar to DLSS on their games, with a performance similar to a 4070 on their own console. People wanting this better pre-order this as soon as possible.

Besides it's going to be the first Console (and AMD product) to pull off genuine DLSS-like AI upscaling! People should be happy because it was sorely needed. The only question is why AMD or Microsoft didn't even attempt to do that before? Why were they waiting on Sony to do the work? because PSSR like DLSS are mostly a complex software endeavour. And we need competition against Nvidia and now Intel for AI upscaling, the more the merrier.

Because Xbox will have FSR 3.1 (soon to be presented), so MS does not need new hardware.

 

[Nesh]

Because Xbox will have FSR 3.1 (soon to be presented), so MS does not need new hardware.

That won't exist on PS5 base?

 

[QPlayer]

That won't exist on PS5 base?

No, because FSR 3.1 probably uses AI with INT precision.

 

[davis.anthony]

No, because FSR 3.1 probably uses AI with INT precision.

How did Insomniac use AI/ML in Spiderman?

 

[Seanspeed]

How did Insomniac use AI/ML in Spiderman?

Where does it use AI/ML?

There were rumors that Spiderman 2 would use ChatGPT for AI conversations, but this was never verified, and I'm pretty confident that even if it were the case, they wouldn't be real-time ChatGPT conversations, simply the studio using the application to quick generate lots of simple dialogue offline, that they then put into the game after.