*rename* Real-time Lighting Solutions (Enlighten, Lightmass, LPVs etc)
- Thread starter D3B
- Start date
I'll just... drop this link here:
http://www.slideshare.net/DICEStudio/siggraph10-arrrealtime-radiosityarchitecture
Bit of a walkthrough on its integration with Frostbite 2. If you have a slideshare account, the pptx has additional notes.
http://www.slideshare.net/DICEStudio/siggraph10-arrrealtime-radiosityarchitecture
Bit of a walkthrough on its integration with Frostbite 2. If you have a slideshare account, the pptx has additional notes.
L. Scofield
Veteran
Dynamic GI in Battlefield 3? Cool.
Well, what is food for thought is that BF3 uses Enlighten from Geomerics. From the SIGGRAPH2010 presentation:
edit: CPU for indirect lighting, GPU for direct lighting.
So I expect heavy, heavy CPU utilization not just from the destruction and physics, but the lighting... Would be interesting to see what differences result when you consider that the PS3 has the 6 SPEs versus three hyperthreaded Xenon Cores for number crunching.
edit: CPU for indirect lighting, GPU for direct lighting.
Last edited by a moderator:
(((interference)))
Veteran
Isn't Enlighten what Gears 3 is using? Is it some kind of precalculated GI technique, so not like Crysis 2's realtime GI? Sorry, I haven't being paying attention
But whatever they're using here looks fantastic - lighting is even better than C2, incredibly photorealistic for real time footage.
But whatever they're using here looks fantastic - lighting is even better than C2, incredibly photorealistic for real time footage.
Enlighten is a [strike]baked[/strike]real-time radiosity solution from Geomerics. There's some more info about its relevance to current gen in the Siggraph link on the previous page. There should be a thread somewhere about Enlighten as well. UE3 is now using Epic's internally developed Lightmass solution, which is a baked solution as well.
(((interference)))
Veteran
Yea, I downloaded those two, will read them when I'm less tired .
But any reason the Geomerics website says it's real time? Is it just real time on the workstations used to create the environments (ie so you don't have to send them off for hours of offline rendering).
What's the disadvantages versus Crysis 2s realtime GI system? BF3 will have more destructability than C2 so the disadvantages of a baked GI would be more noticeable there, correct?
From what I have understood it requires some pre-processing for the scene, but after that you can move lights around freely.
Here's a presentation on Enlighment from Dice.
Video from the presentation.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8730SR1POk
Some random Enlighten videos.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFHxluXS3KM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLZU-JC6Hqc&feature=related
I wonder if they will have dynamic day/night cycle in the game..
Last edited by a moderator:
I think Crytek also mentioned it in their presentation, but said they decided against it because it didn't work for dynamic scenes (or something along those lines).
(((interference)))
Veteran
From what I have understood it requires some pre-processing for the scene, but after that you can move lights around freely.
Here's a presentation on Enlighment from Dice.
Video from the presentation.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8730SR1POk
Some random Enlighten videos.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFHxluXS3KM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLZU-JC6Hqc&feature=related
I wonder if they will have dynamic day/night cycle in the game..
Thanks, will have a read/look.
If it didn't work for dynamic scenes then why is DICE using it when BF3 has so much destructability?
I'm going to have to kick myself for over-generalizing the "precomputation as bake".
There's quite a bit more to it, and the presentations are already a summary of it, so re-summarizing here would be a bit of a folly for me. Maybe we should get Graham back in here to explain in his words.
L. Scofield
Veteran
From the leak, C2's GI only works for the sunlight, not regular point lights/spotlights, so it's much more limited.
Geomerics still uses precomputed "light maps", however instead of baking in the actual diffuse lighting emitted from a surface (which is what you normally store in a light map) they store visibility data (I believe they use wavelets for this) that is used to accelerate their radiosity calculations performed at runtime. So the light sources themselves can be dynamic, but the geometry is still assumed to be static. Obviously the frostbite guys have found ways to work around that limitation enough to make their destructible geometry work.
Crytek's solution is completely realtime and doesn't require a precomputation step, which obviously brings with it some limitations.
(((interference)))
Veteran
L. Scofield
Veteran
I don't know why Crysis 2 has so much pop up but it certainly isn't due to the GI:
http://www.crytek.com/cryengine/presentations
I'm quite sure that he meant popin in actual GI, which is visible on Cryteks own videos, due to moving sources of secondary light. (1:07 and 3:50 onward.)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OdtWRVHt00k
(((interference)))
Veteran
No actually he's right, I meant just pop in in general, I thought it might be due to the GPU/shading cost of their GI system meaning less resources to render objects, unless it's running on the CPU?
I had a read of their GDC presentation and watched the videos, very smart - makes Crytechs GI solution seem overengineered when you can get the same (or possibly better, since C2s GI only works on sunlight) lighting quality while using what must be far less resources.
And I was mistaken, Lightmass isn't really Epics version of the tech - it seems to be a sort of improved baked GI tech, not realtime and dynamic like Enlighten or C2s tech.
Last edited by a moderator:
Geomerics Enlighten is looking fabulous in Battlefield 3. good work Graham and friends!
(also isn't it great that we have such cutting edge technoartists present on this board, like Graham at Geomerics and T.B. progressing MLAA. In a small sense, B3D is at the fore-front of developments )
(also isn't it great that we have such cutting edge technoartists present on this board, like Graham at Geomerics and T.B. progressing MLAA. In a small sense, B3D is at the fore-front of developments
)Well the big thing for Crytek is that they always want completely dynamic/realtime solutions with no lengthy preprocessing steps. Part of that is to accommodate their game design (completely knocking over buildings, etc.), and part of that is to enable rapid iteration for their designers and artists (and licensees, I suppose). The Geomerics solution produces much higher quality results (IMO), but still has precomputation as well as a few of the other drawbacks that come with lightmapping (memory usage, compression, UV's, etc.). Plus it runs on the CPU, which complicates things and probably makes it more difficult to integrate into existing tech. So really, like anything else, it's just a different set of trade-offs.
Indeed, Lightmass is just their in-house GI lightmap baker (I believe it uses photon mapping).
Similar threads
