PS3 Controller issues

[AntShaw]

Well i don't agree, Even if Sony is saying that the drop outs are due to interference.

Bluetooth and 802.11 coexist in many applications that and don't have any issues for ex. cellphones,pda,laptops,mp3-players and so on.

From Wiki (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bluetooth#Specifications_and_Features)

Bluetooth 1.2

This version is backwards compatible with 1.1 and the major enhancements include

* Adaptive Frequency-hopping spread spectrum (AFH), which improves resistance to radio frequency interference by avoiding the use of crowded frequencies in the hopping sequence

Yes. All that you said is true, sans the statement "Well i don't agree, Even if Sony is saying that the drop outs are due to interference."

In reference to Bluetooth and 802.11 co-existing, it can and does.

In reference to Bluetooth frequency hopping, it can and does. BUT, that still doesn't take away the fact that it CAN and DOES operate within the 2.4ghz range. Whether it's Bluetooth, Router, Telephone or any other device that operates within a given frequency range, it CAN be prone to interferrance issues. This is a very simple fact. It's not sixaxis nor Sony specific. I am still a little befuddled at why you aren't following this?

With that being said, we aren't making any headway.

Plus I was just making a logical conclusion to the defined issue. Who knows if thats really the case? Cheers!

 

[xmu]

I was kinda expecting this judging from the Bluetooth experiences we've had at work (we do lots of mobile stuff) aren't all that encouraging. Sometimes I can't connect two BT devices unless they're exactly X meters apart. For example there have been occasions when I've had to hold my phone way up high and move back a few feet to get it to connect to my laptop. Doesn't matter if there are other devices in the vicinity, they just can't find each other.

Can't remember an incident where the connection had dropped suddenly though..

Now most of the time everything works just fine, but every now and then devices can't find each other.

 

[inefficient]

Hmmm, distance might have something to do with this.

The distance between my PS3 and my controler when I am holding it is never more than 1.5 meters. So maybe that is why I have never had this problem.

To the people who have had this issue, how far away are you from your PS3?

 

[Falkster]

Hmmm, distance might have something to do with this.

The distance between my PS3 and my controler when I am holding it is never more than 1.5 meters. So maybe that is why I have never had this problem.

To the people who have had this issue, how far away are you from your PS3?

I've experienced this issue around 3 or 4 times sitting roughly 2 meters from my PS3.

 

[DemoCoder]

I have played my PS3 plenty of times in 5 hour marathon sessions from over 10 feet away (my display is 9ft wide) and never had a problem. This is in a house that has a range boosted 802.11g router, plus atleast 4 neighbor networks visible, 2 notebook transmitters, and 1 bluetooth enabled PC in the same room. (my PS3 wifi is off however. And I run my WiFi all in g-only mode)

To me, this issue is like the "xbox360 manufacturing defect issue". I've gone through 3 defective xbox360s. Plenty of the same happened to other people. But most people never experience a problem. Or like all the anecdotal stories comparing cell phone carriers.

Firmware BT and WiFi has a serious effective on performance. If you've owned Linksys routers, then you know that over the years, they've had TONS of problems with dropped WiFi and interference, but those were fixed with firmware updates.

I've been at plenty of conventions which have thousands of people running WiFi, and sometimes it works great, and sometimes you can't even associate with a base station. All of it is highly variable.

I've been using a BT MS keyboard for years now, it was *extremely* reliable, never lost connection unless the battery died. On the other hand, I've had an Apple BT keyboard that drops connection like perhaps once every 10 days.

 

[Onlooker1]

I've had the issue with sixaxis, I'm not competing in clan matches, so it doesn't bother me, but will one day, with one game... it is most noticeable in an FPS, in FFXII it may have happened but I wouldn't know it!

Oddly, wifi to my laptop has degraded recently as well. I've started to wonder if it was the intro of the PS3 (wired model, not wireless) bluetooth. It is always on air, even when the red "off" light is on, otherwise, the remote or the controller couldn't wake it up.

My old sony vaio, which can only do 11mbit wireless (not G), has constant packet loss now. And my desktop (which can do G) is fine speed-wise, but sometimes goes off the air completely. Both of these problems started about the same time as I got my PS3, which sits right next to my linksys wireless router (but is wired into it).

I'm going to buy a frequency spectrum analyzer ($100 PC based dongle so not too bright) to see if I can find out where this new interference is coming from.

I somehow doubt the sixaxis bluetooth problem is wifi, though, i think it is a firmware bug. Otherwise, people with BT headsets who sat near their routers would have mentioned issues yet they do not.

 

[Rainbow Man]

Oddly, wifi to my laptop has degraded recently as well. I've started to wonder if it was the intro of the PS3 (wired model, not wireless) bluetooth. It is always on air, even when the red "off" light is on, otherwise, the remote or the controller couldn't wake it up.

It should only need to listen for input when powered "off" from what I understand. Besides as other and likely more knowledgeable people than I mentioned before BT should avoid frequency bands used by other equipment..

Both of these problems started about the same time as I got my PS3, which sits right next to my linksys wireless router (but is wired into it).

The manual for my Wii says the console should not be placed next to other transmitters. Perhaps this is true of other equipment as well.

Besides there is lots of metal shielding in consoles. Particulary if PS3 stands up it might block or otherwise screw with your antenna coverage.

Anyway if you suyspect PS3 just yank the darn power cable out of the back of that sucker and see what happens. if things change then start by moving the PS3 or access point someplace else etc.

Peace.

 

[DemoCoder]

It's possible someone in the neighorhood has a hub that's even deliberately or accidentally denial-of-servicing 2.4Ghz bands. I had a neighbor whose 802.11b hub was doing that to me, to the point that all my WiFi hubs were invisible to my house. I located him with a signal tracker, and asked him to unplug his hub, and voila, most of the neighhborhood networks appeared again. I helped him upgrade his firmware and the problem went away. Older version of linksys WRT hubs had issues IIRC.

I myself became a spammer when I fucked around with open firmwares on my Linksys. Some of these firmwares fuck with transmission power way past FCC limits, and also try to own the transmission channels by altering the backoff (just like some 'web accelerators' mess with the TCP congestion control algorithm and pre-ACK, saturating shared bandwidth). Here in the Bay Area, tons of geeks like to play with jammers and scanners as well, DOSing WiFi, BT, as well as trying to hack.

 

[Arwin]

Both of these problems started about the same time as I got my PS3, which sits right next to my linksys wireless router (but is wired into it).

That is never a good idea. I had my access point nexzt to my cable modem, which isn't even wireless, and the access point just plainly didn't work. Then I moved them just 20-30cm apart from each other et voila! No more problems.

 

[AntShaw]

It's possible someone in the neighorhood has a hub that's even deliberately or accidentally denial-of-servicing 2.4Ghz bands. I had a neighbor whose 802.11b hub was doing that to me, to the point that all my WiFi hubs were invisible to my house. I located him with a signal tracker, and asked him to unplug his hub, and voila, most of the neighhborhood networks appeared again. I helped him upgrade his firmware and the problem went away. Older version of linksys WRT hubs had issues IIRC.

I myself became a spammer when I fucked around with open firmwares on my Linksys. Some of these firmwares fuck with transmission power way past FCC limits, and also try to own the transmission channels by altering the backoff (just like some 'web accelerators' mess with the TCP congestion control algorithm and pre-ACK, saturating shared bandwidth). Here in the Bay Area, tons of geeks like to play with jammers and scanners as well, DOSing WiFi, BT, as well as trying to hack.

Good story. Immediatley made me think about another product that was very
susceptible to outside interferrance...

Apple AirPort Base Station.

All models. I used to work for Apple, and the sheer amount of issues that were resolved by removing other 2.4ghz out of raneg was staggering. When you tell someone to unplug their cordless phone, and have to explain that in most cases it WILL resolve your issue. And it did.

People would never want to believe it was other devices that was preventing them from connecting. Interferrance is a big gray area, and really the only way to test is to eliminate other devices, or to take said device out of said environment.

On that note...I have had the problem twice with my controller, and both times my take is the battery was getting low. Could be just a coincidence.

I am curious as to how wide spread this is, and if it's really a 'issue.' Like most times, we only hear from people that are having any issues, and not from people that are not. I guess only time will tell?

 

[DemoCoder]

Definately... not all 802.11 and BlueTooth chipsets are created equal. It's not like ethernet which is very mature, there is tons of variation in 802.11 both from the radio standpoint as well as from the firmware, that's why it's premature to claim the issue is unfixable and fundamentally in the nature of BlueTooth. One reason why this reasoning fails is that although Sony implements the standard BT 2.0+EDR spec, they do have a closed system: They make the controllers, and they make the receiver, so they can implement customizations to the firmware and lowest level network layers that aren't legitimate for general purpose BT devices. This may disadvantage using your mobile phone's BT headset, but Sony can just say "you must buy a Sony Headset"

In the same way they LinkSys, D-Link, et al make non-standard "SpeedBoost" wifi products, that work at higher speeds, as long as you buy both the hub and PC-Cards from the same vendor.

I remain undecided and unwilling to conclude the issue is unresolvable, especially since it doesn't happen to everyone.

 

[AntShaw]

I remain undecided and unwilling to conclude the issue is unresolvable, especially since it doesn't happen to everyone.

I will agree with that.

It's a little to early in the game.

 

[MechanizedDeath]

I am still convinced this is due to the plethora of cheap 2.4GHz phones (transmitters on those things have a range rivalling routers) and some cheapo routers polluting the band in some areas. Some people never see a problem, some people have nonstop headaches. The problem with RF interference is that no matter how hard you try to buy quality products within compliance, you're still succeptible to someone near you with a non-compliant transmitter. I'm not certain it's the cause, but this has been a long-running problem with BT and other 2.4GHz devices. I say start with the biggest polluters (most powerful transmitters) and I think that's cordless phones. PEACE.

 

[Colourless]

XBox 360 Controllers also use 2.4 GHz, but don't seem to be suffering like these BlueTooth based consoles are. Of course the protocol used by the 360 is kind of unknown so it may more reliable, or it does have problems but people either aren't noticing or aren't jumping up and down about them.

 

[ERP]

XBox 360 Controllers also use 2.4 GHz, but don't seem to be suffering like these BlueTooth based consoles are. Of course the protocol used by the 360 is kind of unknown so it may more reliable, or it does have problems but people either aren't noticing or aren't jumping up and down about them.

I was told recently by someone who claimed to know that MS didn't use bluetooth for a reason and it wasn't just so they could rape the consumer on wireless periferals....

 

[habbe]

I was told recently by someone who claimed to know that MS didn't use bluetooth for a reason and it wasn't just so they could rape the consumer on wireless periferals....

Bluetooth is developed by Ericsson (swedish telecom company) and probebly comes with some kind of licensfee.

My xbox controller drops out when my battery is low, it started when i had 2 out of 3 in battery meter and dropped several times and with new batteries it has never happened again.

Bluetooth seems to include tech to handle interference (of course to a limit). It could be the software implementation of the bluetoothstack in ps3 (there are a lot of bad stacks out there for windows) or it could simply be that BT isn't a suitible technology for this kind of application (wich i find hard to belive).