Phil Spencer Interview: Redfall Reviews, Activision Deal - Kinda Funny Xcast Ep. 137

[iroboto]

One part of his his answers to question 7 that I struggle with, and which troubles me as an Xbox owner, (unless I missed it) is this:


Is he implying that producing great games is no longer considered to be something a priority because that's not going to beat Sony?

I think he's implying that JUST building great games is not enough to turn things around. There's more to it than that which are the other priorities that he has to work on.

 

[mr magoo]

I think this is taken out of context

https://twitter.com/x/status/1654151631808745472

Phil responded to that “well said and true”
In the interview he said they want to create great games and content for Xbox users.

 

[Inuhanyou]

I think this is taken out of context

https://twitter.com/x/status/1654151631808745472

Phil responded to that “well said and true”
In the interview he said they want to create great games and content for Xbox users.

But no one said they should win the console race. He is reducing it down to a fight between console fanboys when the idea is Xbox fans in general just want more and better content from MSs big internal studios and not crap like redfall.

And it feels like people have been asking that for years and Phil has said similar things every time

 

[eastmen]

But no one said they should win the console race. He is reducing it down to a fight between console fanboys when the idea is Xbox fans in general just want more and better content from MSs big internal studios and not crap like redfall.

And it feels like people have been asking that for years and Phil has said similar things every time

It's funny because redfall i the only crap game they have released. I don't remember another microsoft developed game for the xbox that scored anywhere near it. It's also a game that was in development for 5 years , 3 years of which were before MS owned the company making it

 

[Shortbread]

One part of his his answers to question 7 that I struggle with, and which troubles me as an Xbox owner, (unless I missed it) is this:


Is he implying that producing great games is no longer considered to be something a priority because that's not going to beat Sony?

Software (good and consistent software), is king! Phil knows this, but I guess (now) their cloud/subscription gaming strategy calls for them to play underdog and to condition gamers to rethink what traditional gaming means?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1654151631808745472

So, once again, what's stopping them?

 

[Inuhanyou]

It's funny because redfall i the only crap game they have released. I don't remember another microsoft developed game for the xbox that scored anywhere near it. It's also a game that was in development for 5 years , 3 years of which were before MS owned the company making it

Yes. And more and better games from Ms internal studios. MS are justifiably frustrating people because they have not had a "big" game in more than a year and a half and then they come out with this, after already having a huge controversy over 343 in the last major release they put out. it's not rocket science what people are asking for man...

 

[iroboto]

So, once again, what's stopping them?

if I'm being honest, they would need to drop PC day 1 to have a rapid turn around in quality, give themselves a fighting chance at actually doing a workload that is doable within a set timeframe. I just don't think they are going to do that. They're committed to their path here.

 

[Scott_Arm]

...


Is he implying that producing great games is no longer considered to be something a priority because that's not going to beat Sony?

He can't be, because they're trying to buy Activision Blizzard for the games. I'm pretty sure he's aware that games matter. There's just a difference between running a healthy and competitive console business and actually "winning the console war", as in becoming the top selling console. In terms of being top seller there is more than just games. There's price, there's brand loyalty, library lock-in etc.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Software (good and consistent software), is king! Phil knows this, but I guess (now) their cloud/subscription gaming strategy calls for them to play underdog and to condition gamers to rethink what traditional gaming means?

Microsoft's messaging is adaptable. On one hand, when talking about UK CMA decision, Phil Spencer was downplaying the size of the cloud gaming market yet when you wind the clock back to when Microsoft began investing heavily in their game streaming tech, Phil Spencer was playing up the potential size of cloud gaming.

 

[iroboto]

Microsoft's message is adaptable. On one hand, when talking about UK CMA decision, Phil Spencer was downplaying the size of the cloud gaming market yet when you wind the clock back to when Microsoft began investing heavily in their game streaming tech, Phil Spencer was playing up the potential size of cloud gaming.

lol Schrodinger's cloud market.

The reality of cloud gaming for CMA.
The potential of cloud gaming for shareholders

 

[eastmen]

Yes. And more and better games from Ms internal studios. MS are justifiably frustrating people because they have not had a "big" game in more than a year and a half and then they come out with this, after already having a huge controversy over 343 in the last major release they put out. it's not rocket science what people are asking for man...

Hi-Fi rush was an amazing game that was well reviewed , well received and did really well in all engagement metrics. Minecraft legends just hit and was about a 70 metacritic , You had Age of empires 2 at the start of the year, Grounded in sept , Pentiment in Nov . Dunno if we count As Dusk Falls since its technically a third party game funded by MS .

MS has games ranging in all sizes and most importantly all diffrent types of games not just one genre. This year we still have ARA releasing , Age of empires 4 , Forza and Starfield that we know of. Redfall is just a single game

 

[Shifty Geezer]

It's funny because redfall i the only crap game they have released. I don't remember another microsoft developed game for the xbox that scored anywhere near it. It's also a game that was in development for 5 years , 3 years of which were before MS owned the company making it

Yes, and previous years MS has won Metacritic's Publisher of the Year for their highest average. But last year they didn't even feature because they didn't release enough games! Their ability to sustain the quality output from their studios doesn't appear to match the other players in this business. Maybe their cadence just isn't well balanced and it's a case of some years of bounty, some years of sparsity?

 

[eastmen]

Yes, and previous years MS has won Metacritic's Publisher of the Year for their highest average. But last year they didn't even feature because they didn't release enough games! Their ability to sustain the quality output from their studios doesn't appear to match the other players in this business. Maybe their cadence just isn't well balanced and it's a case of some years of bounty, some years of sparsity?

That is largely because they didn't have enough studios

Mojang was 2014 and then in 2018 they purchased Ninja Theory , Undead Labs , Compulsion games.

Ninja Theory released Hellblade in 2017 right before the purchase and then bleeding Edge in 2020 and are currently working on Hellblade 2 which should be getting close to launch , likely 2024

Undead Labs released state of decay 2 in 2018 right before their purchase and are working on state of decay 3. It was roughly 5 years between Decay 1 and 2 so part 3 should also be in the final stretch taking that into account.

Compulsion released we happy few also in 2018 and contract was in 2013 like undead labs they are likely getting close to finishing whatever product they are working on now.

Playground of course released Forza horizon 4 in 2018 and 5 in 2021 and are working on Fable and likely a new horizon. Horizon is likely 2024/5 based on their previous games.


After that they purchased Inxile and obsidian also later in 2018.

Inexile released Bards tale 4 before purchase and then in 2020 wasteland remastared and wasteland 3 and a vr game. Likely 2024/25 will bring games from them


Obsidian is kind of a power house and was a great get for MS. They released Pillars 2 the yar they were purchased then outworlds the next year. Grounded and Pentiment came out last year. Avowed was announced in 2020 I believe and Outerworlds 2 was announced. They will hopefully both be ready in 2024-2026 .


Double fine was 2019 and that year they reeleased rad and then 2021 they did psychonauts 2. In 2016 and 2017 they released a bunch of remasters so we might see even more games from them as they focus on new titles and a single platform. I am guessing 2025 is the earliest we see the next game.


Then that leads to Zenimax in late 2020.


So MS has a bunch of games and typically they do release a bunch of titles each year. The issue is they don't have enough to consistently delay games that need more work and unlike other companies they can just depend on third party ecxlusives taking care of misses


I'd wager without ABK they would need another 10-15 studios to keep a consistent enough release schedule of 1-2 sizable exclusives a quarter with 1-2 more smaller games

 

[stu11]

That is largely because they didn't have enough studios
Mojang was 2014 and then in 2018 they purchased Ninja Theory , Undead Labs , Compulsion games.
Ninja Theory released Hellblade in 2017 right before the purchase and then bleeding Edge in 2020 and are currently working on Hellblade 2 which should be getting close to launch , likely 2024
Undead Labs released state of decay 2 in 2018 right before their purchase and are working on state of decay 3. It was roughly 5 years between Decay 1 and 2 so part 3 should also be in the final stretch taking that into account.
Compulsion released we happy few also in 2018 and contract was in 2013 like undead labs they are likely getting close to finishing whatever product they are working on now.
Playground of course released Forza horizon 4 in 2018 and 5 in 2021 and are working on Fable and likely a new horizon. Horizon is likely 2024/5 based on their previous games.

After that they purchased Inxile and obsidian also later in 2018.
Inexile released Bards tale 4 before purchase and then in 2020 wasteland remastared and wasteland 3 and a vr game. Likely 2024/25 will bring games from them
Obsidian is kind of a power house and was a great get for MS. They released Pillars 2 the yar they were purchased then outworlds the next year. Grounded and Pentiment came out last year. Avowed was announced in 2020 I believe and Outerworlds 2 was announced. They will hopefully both be ready in 2024-2026 .

Double fine was 2019 and that year they reeleased rad and then 2021 they did psychonauts 2. In 2016 and 2017 they released a bunch of remasters so we might see even more games from them as they focus on new titles and a single platform. I am guessing 2025 is the earliest we see the next game.


Then that leads to Zenimax in late 2020.


So MS has a bunch of games and typically they do release a bunch of titles each year. The issue is they don't have enough to consistently delay games that need more work and unlike other companies they can just depend on third party ecxlusives taking care of misses


I'd wager without ABK they would need another 10-15 studios to keep a consistent enough release schedule of 1-2 sizable exclusives a quarter with 1-2 more smaller games

Yes I'm sure you think that they do need another 10 to 15 studios, especially seeing as all of their other in house studios have either lost half of their staff or had 5 years of work dumped so that they are starting again or they've cancelled 2 projects so that they can do another Gears of War game. What MS need to do is manage the studios that they have already better, not add a bunch more to them. The after that they need to not take the "quick and lazy option" by buying up huge publishers and build it the hard way like Sony and Nintendo have.

Quote : "Nintendo and Sony both went the long way around; Nintendo built its first-party studio system almost entirely in-house, while Sony has done so by partnering closely with third-party developers and then acquiring them once the working relationship was already well-established. Neither of those is as fast as buying a big publisher, but they don't have to be slow, either – and with good leadership and strategic direction, you can end up with not only a robust studio system, but with an incredibly valuable stable of original IP."


Hmm "good leadership and strategic direction" what a disruptive concept for Microsoft. Might be a winner!

 

[Inuhanyou]

MS cant escape fundamental problems just by buying publishers.

 

[mr magoo]

Xbox hasn't 'given up' on the console war — they already stopped taking part

War, what is it good for? Absolutely nothing.

www.windowscentral.com

Good article and summarized pretty well what Phil said. Clarification over some drama that is going on twitter and other social medias and explain how Microsoft strategy differs from Sony and Nintendo.

 

[eastmen]

MS cant escape fundamental problems just by buying publishers.

Which are what ?

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Good article and summarized pretty well what Phil said. Clarification over some drama that is going on twitter and other social medias and explain how Microsoft strategy differs from Sony and Nintendo.

It puts some things Phil Spencer said in a different light, but I'm not sure it really helps do anything than set out how Microsoft really did this to themselves. This makes Microsoft trying to present themselves as an underdog whilst also being the third most profitable company in the world, a difficult pill to swallow.

Some people haven't appreciated Phil's honesty here and see it as admitting defeat, but Spencer is just laying out the reality of Microsoft's place in the gaming industry right now. Most gamers are already committed to a platform of their choice and have invested in this. Playstation has been the dominant console since its release in 1994, and since the doomed Xbox One generation, its lead is insurmountable. Spencer is describing how Xbox's focus needs to be on other avenues to compete and ultimately grow.

As I posted above, referring back to my post in 2019, backwards compatibility was always going to be a feature that works to anchor users to their digital libraries on particular platforms. And Microsoft have made backwards compatibility with previous consoles a much bigger deal than Sony and they have consistently done it better than Sony. I've played a bunch of 360 games on my Series X, I can only pay Sony to stream PS3 games to my PS5 and for me it's not a great experience.

The outrage comes following a question asked to Spencer in the Q&A segment of the podcast, he was asked specifically if he felt that Xbox had lost focus in the console market, given the strides they have taken to improve the PC and Cloud experiences. Spencer replied, "We have a different vision you know, it's play the games you want, with the people you want, anywhere you want."

Microsoft have had a lot of different visions for Xbox and I think that has contributed to their difficulties in attracting and retaining returning customers consistently. For four out of five home console generations, Sony's strategy has been to sell a console at an affordable price relative to PC, without taking losses, and make money by licensing third party publishers whilst ensuring they have some exclusives to differentiate. The one console generation Sony decided to design something to be at the centre of the living room, the PS3 sold about 30% less than flanking PS2 or PS4 consoles.

It still boggles my mind that Microsoft watched Sony make PS3, watch them launch it costing more money, watch it struggle with performance, watch it sell about a third less units in Sony's desire to be the centre of living room entertainment, and thought.. Yeah.. that's what we should do next. <insert face palm of epic proportions.gif>

The more I've reflected on the interview, the more I genuinely wonder how long Phil Spencer is going to be Head of Xbox. You cannot simply regret games being launched in a poor state when you're in charge of that business. Phil Spencer can make sure that's not happening. Otherwise, WTF is he doing all day? It's not like he went on holiday for a long weekend and his deputy made some poor decisions.

Halo Infinite? Ok.. really unfortunate. But now Redfall. I am really anxious about Starfield, which is a game I actually do care about. I don't mind the usual mild Bethesda jank, or some nutty physics, but I worry that having delayed it once, Microsoft might just shoe-horn that out the door in some atrocious state too, because Phil Spencer can also just regret that happening.

 

[Nesh]

Which are what ?

Take their shit together and focus on actually making good games.
If you see acquisition of established multiplatform publisher/developer giants as a solution, it shows that it isn't the creation of good content that you really care about, but winning the console war.

 

[Inuhanyou]

Which are what ?

I've said it multiple times over a long time.

1. Brand rot via not marketing in many places other platforms forced themselves into through grit, and failing basic standards in many countries Xbox officially claims to already be in.

Ask any tier 3 country and they will tell you many times they can't even get basic support in their own languages let alone the treatment the English world gets, let alone any other kind of support outside of maybe being able to buy the console (although most times not even being able to do that)

The fact that priority is so skewed towards the US and the UK absolutely hurts Xboxs reach and it's not as if they simply can't do it. They sold 1.5 million consoles in Japan off of aggressive marketing and getting devs to make Japanese games on 360, yet now they claim they can't even support a single studio? When they themselves defunded and shut down a big portion of the Japanese Xbox branch years ago? Don't buy it.

2. Dev rot letting many of their own studios operate as inefficiently as possible and go through as many problems as possible.

343 is just the most vocal public issue. Rare had been languishing for many years without much to show for themselves and barely put out sea of thieves. If Japan studio had operated like that they would have been canned years before.

Where as it seems besides the coalition and turn 10, none of the devs MS has owned for decades pre buying spree even exist and anything we have seen of the devs they have bought post 2018 has been vaporware that has not been seen beyond a single trailer.

To think they would be in an even worse position without the Bethesda aqusition they just made a few years ago is mind boggling. Why has the initiative just been allowed to go on without showing literally anything to the public of note? Why has the coalition been the one forced to help other dev studios with projects when they are one of the only ones consistently putting out games?

Why haven't many of these teams been forced back on track, split up, refunded and restaffed years ago? Sony has their teams working double duty on projects separating themselves into smaller teams to churn out more content. Why isn't MS doing that?

I can only imagine what this year would look like for them if they didn't own Bethesda. And that isn't a justification for the aqusition of Bethesda but an condemnation of Xbox studios management up until that point and still today. Even with all those studios in 2018 it took buying a pub of that size to even get any content when it was content that would be on the market regardless. Just not exclusive.

Don't say MS cant fix anything I have mentioned here. They are a trillion dollar software company, worth 10 times as much as their most direct competitor in the gaming space. They make more money just existing for a few months than Sony or Nintendo do an entire year. They have the resources. The problems are within