One of the people who got to handle/demo the controller is answering questions people have about it in a thread over at GAF:
http://forum.gaming-age.com/showthread.php?t=63993
http://forum.gaming-age.com/showthread.php?t=63993
Nintendo Revolution Controller Revealed
- Thread starter onetimeposter
- Start date
Chalnoth said:
I don't believe it will be as precise. The extra degrees of freedom of not having the mouse on a stable platform (your table) will lead to jitter. Jitter is a killer for games that accurately model shooting physics. I don't filtering is going to help. I play games where you engage with sniper rifles at extreme distances, where pixel perfect aiming is needed. Even with the mouse, I sometimes overcompensate and move 2-3 pixels too far. Auto-aim sucks. I don't like it. It's like people who prefer manual vs automatic transmission. I prefer manual.
Being able to rest my hand on top of the mouse, and use friction forces between the mouse and the table to stabilize my control helps immensely. I don't even like trackballs because of this mouse advantage. I like the ergonomics of resting my hand and making gradual movements, supported by the table.
I think there's a chance it may be more precise in some cases. I can mime the use of the controller, resting the back of my wrist on my leg, and it just feels like I get good control with a wide range of motion. Much like a mouse, there will be an area that you want the controller to be positioned at "in situ"--the idea that the best position for the mouse is dead center, allowing for movement in either direction. The new nintendo controller seems to have that as well, which you can see if you act as if your gripping the controller and rest your wrist on your leg. The interesting thing is that it's terribly awkward to point it straigtforward, but I'm hoping they've thought this through and allow for "straight" to be 20 degrees right of center, or whatever.DemoCoder said:
But on top of that, I can imagine inverting tha position such that you hold the controller from the top, resting it on the couch or the top of your leg, and you "spin" it with your fingers, or shift where it's pointing, almost like a mouse. Just a thought.
Also, BTW: some of the fastest drag cars are automatic.
.Sis
Chalnoth said:
With a mouse, left/right controls left right, but push forward/back controls aim up/down.
Sure, you could use an armrest or lap (I don't think they are as stable as mousepad on table), but you are not going to aim up/down by pushing the controller closer to the TV and backwards. Most likely, you would move your wrist up/down, and that isn't going to be as stable.
Even if you slid the controller around like a mouse on a table, it is likely that to gain any precision, you'd have to crank sensitivity down and move the controller vastly further than a mouse. I just don't believe the positional sensivity of this device will be as accurate as a high resolution optical mouse.
Try this experiment. Pick up your mouse and use your wrist (supported by table or knee) to angle it upwards and downloads. Now place it on the table and push it forward and back. When I perform this experiment, my hand is noticably jerky, left/right positioning is not preserved when moving upwards, and it overall, feels way too loose.
mckmas8808
Legend
Nightz said:
The question is this. With that accuacy and precision, is it end user as fast as someone using a mouse?
I think DC is running out of ideas of how to discredit this device, the idea, the engineering involved with it and nintendo overall.
The thing is, this device, in its current status, seems more robust than everyone though judging from the information people who tried it are saying.
On the other hand, we have to consider nintendo has probably the best track record when it comes to controllers.
The thing is, this device, in its current status, seems more robust than everyone though judging from the information people who tried it are saying.
On the other hand, we have to consider nintendo has probably the best track record when it comes to controllers.
Chalnoth said:What amazes me about his response are his statements about just how intuitive the control interface is. Man, I'm definitely going to have to buy this puppy just to check this thing out....I'm so damned curious
likewise, this will surely make me buy revo, before it the chances were like 10% that I'll buy it
I'm sorry to do this, but 12 pages of thread are a bit much even for me...
Can some charitable poster please summarise the good and the bad for the one and only LB?
Pretty please...
Can some charitable poster please summarise the good and the bad for the one and only LB?
Pretty please...
DemoCoder said:
Does it need to be as accurate as optical mouse though ?, I mean you are just playing game here not doing CAD.
All it need to be is an improvement over standard controller at something like FPS. I mean if the people on Rev controller can kick butt over people on standard controller in a competitive FPS scenario, than it should be a good improvement over standard controller for FPS.
But I think you're missing the point of the controller, Nintendo want to create new type of games that isn't possible with standard controller or mouse + keyboard. Now whether they succeed or not, I don't know.
Still though, they could have done abit more for the interface. Maybe they haven't reveal all their card just yet.
Nintendo controller has tilt sensors and a 'laser pointer' operation like a lightgun. It can be used as a tennis racket/baseball bat, gun, frying pan, and generally nterface with games as though a handheld apparatus. There's only a D-pad and A button on top of controller, and trigger underneath, so conventional games don't map directly. There's an 'expansion slot' in the back of the controller where add-ons can be attached, such as an analogue thumbstick+trigger combo.london-boy said:I'm sorry to do this, but 12 pages of thread are a bit much even for me...
Can some charitable poster please summarise the good and the bad for the one and only LB?
Pretty please...
The rest of thread is people arguing over whether it's original innovation or just Nintendo reusing old ideas, whether it offers the accuracy and ergonomics to be of use or is it an ineffective gimmick, dozens of people describing their POV with the aid of a pencil held in various positions and pressed at various points to prove/disprove how the controller moves when used hence accuracy is impossible, and a few ideas of how it'll be used.
You can reply and look like you've followed the thread closely with one of these responses...
1) I think it's innovative. Sure it's old tech but nobody but Nintendo can invent a good controller.
2) It's old hat. We've had gyros and free-motion controllers since the 80's
3) It'll be great in games like <insert genre here>
4) It won't be accurate. The end where the controller is pointing moves when you press a button. I've tried it with a pencil against a piece of paper and can't keep the point from drawing a smudge when I press down with my thumb.
5) It'll be accurate. That's what threshold and filtering algorithms are for. Andway I've tried it with a pencil and press the pencil with my thumb the end barely moves.
6) It's not intuitive. People don't want to spend years learning a new controller
7) It's absolutely intuitive. It uses basic muscle movements that we use all the time in everyday life.
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Shifty Geezer said:
Yeah i expected that.
Well, sounds very cool to me, can't wait to try one out. One question which i think has been done 92 times already, how will we play fighting games or any game that requires more than 1 button? These days i can't think of any game that uses one button, and having to plug in peripherals to get more buttons seems like a chore to me.
You won't, cos beathemups in the current form are long overdue for a reinvention.london-boy said:
Nintendo will release a "normal" controller shell to plug the default controller in to, for BC and backwards people.
You have the A the B and all the four d-pad directions plus two z-triggers on the analog pod (that comes standard). There is also the a and b button, that could probably also find a use, although they are harder to reach.
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I went air-rifle shooting once. The gun was a heavy lump of metal that pressed hard against the muscles and it was very difficult to actually keep still and shoot straight. Realism in games never goes down too well I find. If people played combat games like real soldiers they'd be getting shot up all over the place and wouldn't have convenient medipaks left from fallen enemies (dropped in one hit) to patch them back to perfect health after receiving a triple volley of Depleted Uranium through the chest!
