New Steam survey results

[eastmen]

That's not my point

I do use WinRAR a coupe of times a day, and I'm happy it's faster in those situations. but my other applications Firefox (64-bit is a crime) Photoshop (slower when you're not memory limited) and general office applications either just don't show any improvement or tend to be limited by them being 32-bit in a 64-bit environment.
I want 32-bit to die yesterday but there are enough apps/games that simply don't benefit from a 64-bit environment and because of that offer no benefits for users to switch from "ye olde" to something a bit more commonplace in todays CPU architecture.

The point is that there are plenty that do benfit from 64bit os's and there are more every day and every day there are less that don't.

 

[neliz]

The point is that there are plenty that do benfit from 64bit os's and there are more every day and every day there are less that don't.

The adoption rate is really really slow. And most common used applications (web browsers) either have no support (FF's last 64-bit update was from March) or actually prevent you from operating without issues (IE-64 bit and it's incompatible plug-ins.)

Now again, I want 32-bit to die right away but the industry doesn't seem to agree. churning out 25-year old code like there's no tomorrow but I get the feeling that transitioning to 64-bit is not a priority anywhere.

 

[eastmen]

The adoption rate is really really slow. And most common used applications (web browsers) either have no support (FF's last 64-bit update was from March) or actually prevent you from operating without issues (IE-64 bit and it's incompatible plug-ins.)

Now again, I want 32-bit to die right away but the industry doesn't seem to agree. churning out 25-year old code like there's no tomorrow but I get the feeling that transitioning to 64-bit is not a priority anywhere.

IE 64bit works just fine for me . Once in a blue moon i need to load up the 32bit verison. But you see hwo that works. 64bit os's don't stop 32 bit programs from running.

 

[itsmydamnation]

try going to youtube on 64bit IE

apart from 7zip i dont think i have any native 64bit apps installed


then again im off to play dos box ( ufo enemy unknown)

 

[eastmen]

try going to youtube on 64bit IE

apart from 7zip i dont think i have any native 64bit apps installed


then again im off to play dos box ( ufo enemy unknown)

My point is that 32bit IE works for that . Moving to 64bit OS doesn't stop you from using the 32bit apps when you need too.

 

[Lightman]

I've jumped to Windows XP x64 straight after it was released and never looked back. At first my TV Card didn't work, but then the driver appeared and all was OK.
Vista x64 was a small improvement, but moving to Win7 x64 is completely painless. Everything I want to use with my PC has 64 bit drivers from the go. I think Win 7 will be the tipping point.
If only more vendors would take example from HP and ship their laptops/desktops with preinstalled Windows 32/64 for user to choose! (and even noob user will take 64bit because it's higher number )

 

[neliz]

If only more vendors would take example from HP and ship their laptops/desktops with preinstalled Windows 32/64 for user to choose! (and even noob user will take 64bit because it's higher number )

HP makes sure the 64 bit versions are lower on the list, English 32 bit is on top, then other 32 bit languages and below that comes 64 bit. in a 5 language system, that's not really an easy choice.

 

[Richard]

For now at least, an(nother) incentive to move to 64-bit. It's not clear if these rates are proportional to the total userbase (kind of useless) or if they measure resistance to all attacks. No linked attributed source in the article. :ugg:

Also notice the fact, mentioned in passing, that the Windows 7 64-bit is the "dominant" version of the new OS as of yet.

 

[swaaye]

The only reason I can see it making sense to get Win 7 32-bit is for NTVDM and Win16 support..... Obviously there is some funky business reason for its existence. I imagine that MS is (rightfully) scared to death of screwing with backwards compatibility because that is definitely part of their key to success.

It's too bad they couldn't have done something similar to the Win3.x -> Win95 switch. And just switched the OS to 64-bit.

Windows 9x is not all that much a 32-bit OS (and this was a cause for some really ugly issues). One can actually run some Win32 apps in Win 3.x with the Win32s addition. You need to go to NT to have a purely 32-bit OS and the mass market didn't do that until XP.

 

[Richard]

The only reason I can see it making sense to get Win 7 32-bit is for NTVDM and Win16 support..... Obviously there is some funky business reason for its existence. I imagine that MS is (rightfully) scared to death of screwing with backwards compatibility because that is definitely part of their key to success.

The problem with backwards compatibility is the longer they procrastinate the worse they'll be for it. I see XP mode really as a first stab at the problem and, most importantly, getting the word out to the masses about virtualisation.

As is customary to Microsoft they seem to let the business decisions overrun common sense and only give XP Mode for Win 7 Professional+ when incidentally, XP mode is in reality a simplified version of their already free Virtual PC and much more accessible to every day people who don't care (and shouldn't have to care) about the nitty-gritty details of virtualised OSs. To be sure, virtualisation is more useful and primarily targets (big) businesses but that's yet another reason why making it a common feature of Windows 7 wouldn't hit their bottomline that much anyway.

As nice as Steam numbers are, I'd love to have other sources for comparison. Steam's demographics definitely trend towards bleeding edge even though historically CS meant Steam had an unusually large percentage of legacy systems. As CS 1.x loses its place as far-and-away-the-most-popular-online-game we ought to see Steam numbers float towards the high-end so I'd like a more "mainstream" source to compare.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

It's possible Steam may still stay relatively relevant compared to the mainstream userbase as Steam hosts/sells quite a few indie casual games. Eufloria is a GREAT one I just recently tried out. It's like a calm and peaceful RTS for people that have no clue what an RTS might be.

Anyway, point being, there's a LOT of casual games on Steam that don't require much power. I don't imagine Torchlight is pushing the envelope for instance and it's quite popular apparently.

That said, I definitely wouldn't mind if there was another source for something like this. But I don't think anyone else has the ability to track such a wide spectrum of users.

Regards,
SB

 

[EduardoS]

I think the point on XP mode is the XP license, not the Virtual PC...

 

[Kaotik]

I think the point on XP mode is the XP license, not the Virtual PC...

XP mode is Virtual PC with pre-installed XP, you don't get separate licence for it (at least iirc)

 

[entity279]

XP mode is Virtual PC with pre-installed XP, you don't get separate licence for it (at least iirc)

The unexpected (for me at least) thing about it is that it only works with hw virtualization support cpus. So that leaves out my s939 X2 .

 

[neliz]

The unexpected (for me at least) thing about it is that it only works with hw virtualization support cpus. So that leaves out my s939 X2 .

That's only on the "home" line of Windows 7, if you get Business you'll won't be restricted to HW VT.

 

[entity279]

That's only on the "home" line of Windows 7, if you get Business you'll won't be restricted to HW VT.

Incorrect. I have W7 professional.

Anyway, i don't really need Xp mode - already have a virtual xp available through VMware. Just wanted to check out this w7 feature and turned out i couldn't; or at least couldn't at first attempt.

 

[FrameBuffer]

The unexpected (for me at least) thing about it is that it only works with hw virtualization support cpus. So that leaves out my s939 X2 .

Hmm weird.. I have an S939 Opteron 165 (Dual core 2x1MB) and hardware virtualization is working fine.. maybe thats one of the server chips (Opty) advantages?

 

[Richard]

It's possible Steam may still stay relatively relevant compared to the mainstream userbase as Steam hosts/sells quite a few indie casual games. <snip> Anyway, point being, there's a LOT of casual games on Steam that don't require much power. I don't imagine Torchlight is pushing the envelope for instance and it's quite popular apparently.

Good point.

I think the point on XP mode is the XP license, not the Virtual PC...

Which most users either will already have (upgrade) or wouldn't go out and buy it anyway. The hit on MS's bottomline for allowing XP Mode for all (like you said, the free XP license only for virtualised environments) would approach nil whereas the benefits/mindshare to their backwards compatibility strategy would increase. Long term vs short term business decision at play.

Hmm weird.. I have an S939 Opteron 165 (Dual core 2x1MB) and hardware virtualization is working fine.. maybe thats one of the server chips (Opty) advantages?

XP mode runs on the new version of Virtual PC which, because of certain design decisions, it's limited to VT-enabled machines (it was optional in Virtual PC 2007). You do need to have it enabled in the BIOS though and some mobo manuf don't provide the means for you to do so: that might explain the discrepancy.

 

[Davros]

Does xp mode support dx9 ?

 

[Kaotik]

Does xp mode support dx9 ?

Only CPU is virtualized, the rest are standard emulated stuff, display controller probably some emulated S3 or something (at least IIRC they used to have emulated S3s there before)