Latest UK Console Figures

[CaptainHowdy]

vince,

Johnny, you says "Poor Nintendo", but do you ever wonder where the XBox would be if they weren't packing in 2 or 4 or whatever many games (with another controller too somewhere, no?!?) they are now at that price?

...and game cubes are coming with 10 games in that area. Yet, there' still not much of an increase in sales.

the packages with 10 games are at a greater price, they are giving them away, and there are no flagship titles involved, just old crap that sells for $10 anyways. so they are actually paying more getting the bundle(and only one store has it, its not an official deal)

 

[Qroach]

I also thought the xbox bundle was only avaible at certain stores and it too was not official.

 

[DVFtaxman]

GameCube Console with
Rocky
WWE Wrestlemania X8
Zoo Cube
Extreme G3
Driven
Plus GameCube Ultimate Pack:
X Racer Wheel
Powergrip Controller
4Mb Memory Card

.....FOR £199 SOUNDS LIKE A PRETTY GOOD AND COMPARABLE DEAL TO ME.

 

[CaptainHowdy]

GameCube Console with
Rocky
WWE Wrestlemania X8
Zoo Cube
Extreme G3
Driven
Plus GameCube Ultimate Pack:
X Racer Wheel
Powergrip Controller
4Mb Memory Card

.....FOR £199 SOUNDS LIKE A PRETTY GOOD AND COMPARABLE DEAL TO ME.

than you obviously havent played any of those games.. rocky and extreme G3 are the only ones I couldnt see throwing away, compared to a system with Sega GT, Halo, Splinter Cell, seriously, even I say no competition, I am not excusing Nintendo, its thier own fault, they have been giving Europe the shaft on games.

 

[Johnny Awesome]

Well, it doesn't matter either way. The point is that MS is willing to do what it takes to outsell Nintendo in Europe and North America. Japan is a lost cause of course, but generally irrelevant anyway. Nearly all blockbusters are made in the west now (see the latest weekly sales charts for details).

It probably only cost MS about $10 per Xbox to include the Sega games and I have a feeling that it isn't going to affect future game purchases by those customers either. They'll still buy ten games over the life of the system, no problem.

Spending $10 to steal a Nintendo customer and get someone buying games a year earlier sounds like good business to me. Adding Splinter Cell and Halo for 50 pounds isn't bad either, since those are the customers that are going to go out and get Counterstrike, Brute Force, MechAssault, and Unreal Championship eventually.

Nintendo is the one who needs a new marketing plan. Where is Metroid Prime for the UK? That was a SERIOUS mistake this holiday.

 

[Teasy]

Quincy

I also thought the xbox bundle was only avaible at certain stores and it too was not official.

The XBox 4 games bundle with Halo and Splinter Cell is official. The games come pre-packed inside the XBox box and the box also has the pics of all four games on the front. Oh and its in all game stores.

Johnny

It probably only cost MS about $10 per Xbox to include the Sega games

How would it only cost $10 for MS to pack in 2 Sega games like JSRF and Sega GT? Do you think that Sega would let MS have those games at a loss or something?.. I doubt it. Sega will at least be charging $50 for those 2 games.

Spending $10 to steal a Nintendo customer and get someone buying games a year earlier sounds like good business to me.

Those 4 games will be costing MS more like $150 per console in paying Sega, Ubi Soft and lost profits from potential Halo buyers who now don't need to buy the game.

Don't get my wrong, its worth it for MS if it works, but so far its not working as well as it should. Its upped the sales, but not to a level where the pack is making anywhere near as much of a difference as it should. I would have expected minimum XBox sales of 50,000 in the first week of the 4 game bundle. But until I see sales drop back down again (this week they're still rising from last week) I won't say the pack has failed as they may still keep rising.

 

[Qroach]

if you say so, but I don't reacall seeing any pictures of that box offer anywhere. I do know that JSRF and sega GT both come on a single DVD. they may do the same thing with all the games for all I know.

How would it only cost $10 for MS to pack in 2 Sega games like JSRF and Sega GT? Do you think that Sega would let MS have those games at a loss or something?.. I doubt it. Sega will at least be charging $50 for those 2 games.

How are they going to sell the games at a loss when they were already on the market for a few months? JSRF was already discontinued. I'm sure both of these titles were extremly cheap. Sega didn't even have to pay for the manufacturing of the single DVD they both come on. They just get money back.

$50? hardly. I 'd make a guess that sega is getting between 10-20$ for both games together in this deal. Publishers don't make anywhere close to $25 dollars on a console game released to the market. More like 12-15 dollars when it's new. On a discontinued product, even less.

Those 4 games will be costing MS more like $150 per console in paying Sega, Ubi Soft and lost profits from potential Halo buyers who now don't need to buy the game.

Once again, that's a pretty unrealistic price Teasy. All MS has to do is wave the manufacturing costs in favour of including the game with the console, and right there the publisher is saving roughly 12 dollars per copy (box, manual, and discs). They probably worked out a deal where they (sega/Ubisoft) make 10-12 bucks per game. Not to mention how many people would want a sequel for the exposure the title has gotten. They wouldn't do this deal if it didn't benefit them in some way.

Halo is a moot point, since it sold over 2 million copies and has long made it's development costs back. Now all you want to do before releasing the sequel is to make sure every xbox owner has a copy of the game. Then the sequel will sell to an even bigger base of users that has played the title.

 

[Vince]

However 10 games is a bit much and even 5 games is a deal you can't refuse. how can anyone refuse 10 games?

Well, appearently 100,000 people did - which is my point. Johnney says, "Whatever it takes". So, cut a 1 year old console down to 1/2 it's price, pack in 4 games... what next?

Granted, they had a moderate sales spike attached to the pack-in, but it's a short-term stimulus, what happens when sales return to the base level - only at lower costs and with 4 games? Pack in 8 games? 16? Give the console away for free?

I think the other comments, including GC pack-in, have been explained better than I could

 

[aneep]

Australia

article dated Nov 6 2002, Australian IT

Lifetime sales now total 555,163 for the PS2, 126,111 for the Xbox and 46,145 for the GameCube. The PS2 launched in November 2000, while the Xbox and GameCube launched in March and May this year respectively.

article dated 6/12/2002, PC World

But despite recent figures, Burnham said PlayStation 2 still maintains a strong installed base in the local market. Currently, there are 139,208 Xbox consoles in use in Australia, and 569,398 PlayStation 2 consoles.

Xbox is still outselling GC there and PS2 still outsold both, have been like that since time immemorial (Planet Xbox usually carries week to week AU hw sales)

Germany
i remember reading that Xbox has now outsold GC in Germany from a trade mag there (MCV Germany), will poke around google for info

UK
if i remember correctly i saw a total sales figure for UK sometime ago, but i can't remember from where

but weekly sales seems to follow the same trend as Australia, ps2 leads by a huge margin usually, xbox second (usually close to double the figure for GC), and GC last, GBA if included will be 2nd after ps2 usually
weekly figures from CVG

Europe
i remember reading a Gamespot interview recently with some Xbox official that states that Xbox has now outsold GC in Europe (not in the main body of the interview, but in the introdution by Gamespot)
unfortunately since i'm not a member of GS complete, cannot dig back the article

Japan
xbox usually accounts for less than 2% total sales for console market there (figures from Media Create)
pattern, PS2~ 30k-70k, GC ~30k, Xbox~2k

all in all, i think worldwide GC will still lead Xbox by ~1-2 mil solely on the lack of strength in the Japanese market for the Xbox, but then again i see MS is promoting more in other regions than Japan anyway, perhaps they will focus on Japan in the next gen (Hirohisa Ohura already talk about Xbox 2 being alot smaller than Xbox for one thing, he's now working with the main Xbox team in US instead of leading the MS KK in Japan)

Xbox in the new regions (HK, TW, SG, and soon KR) has also gained a good amount of press with MS launching locally there (with cheaper games then the rest of the world to promote oroginal games over pirated games)

PS2 is the real star here IMO, pushing huge huge numbers in every region, but both Xbox and GC could still end up with a sizeable userbase to be profitable

-aneep-

 

[wazoo]

$50? hardly. I 'd make a guess that sega is getting between 10-20$ for both games together in this deal. Publishers don't make anywhere close to $25 dollars on a console game released to the market. More like 12-15 dollars when it's new. On a discontinued product, even less.

Those 4 games will be costing MS more like $150 per console in paying Sega, Ubi Soft and lost profits from potential Halo buyers who now don't need to buy the game.

Once again, that's a pretty unrealistic price Teasy. All MS has to do is wave the manufacturing costs in favour of including the game with the console, and right there the publisher is saving roughly 12 dollars per copy (box, manual, and discs). They probably worked out a deal where they (sega/Ubisoft) make 10-12 bucks per game. Not to mention how many people would want a sequel for the exposure the title has gotten. They wouldn't do this deal if it didn't benefit them in some way.

The day, the bundle was annouced, analysts downgraded Sega stocks and the stock value went down, not exactly the nice picture you imply.

 

[CaptainHowdy]

True, Worldwide number count as of now
according to Businessweek

PS2 47,000,000
GCN 10,000,000
Xbox 8.2,000,000

 

[wazoo]

True, Worldwide number count as of now
according to Businessweek

PS2 47,000,000
GCN 10,000,000
Xbox 8.2,000,000

They must be shipped numbers. I do not see how the GC or the xbox (not sure about the ps2) can be at this level.

 

[Qroach]

wazoo,

The day, the bundle was annouced, analysts downgraded Sega stocks and the stock value went down, not exactly the nice picture you imply.

I seriously doubt analysts decided to downgrade sega when they found out about the bundle. They were more than likely downgraded them for "other" performance reasons before that occured. Not exactly the ugly picture you imply.

 

[CaptainHowdy]

True, Worldwide number count as of now
according to Businessweek

PS2 47,000,000
GCN 10,000,000
Xbox 8.2,000,000

They must be shipped numbers. I do not see how the GC or the xbox (not sure about the ps2) can be at this level.

yea, probally right, the last numbers were GC around 7 mil, Xbox at 5.5 mil, that was back in the summer though

 

[wazoo]

wazoo,

The day, the bundle was annouced, analysts downgraded Sega stocks and the stock value went down, not exactly the nice picture you imply.

I seriously doubt analysts decided to downgrade sega when they found out about the bundle. They were more than likely downgraded them for "other" performance reasons before that occured. Not exactly the ugly picture you imply.

of course, the sega sports failure was a big part of this downgrade, but the bundle of the yet-to-be-released sega GT (bundling a relatively old game like jsrf is no problem) was seen as a lack of confidence in its own capacity at selling games by classical retail chains.

 

[Gollum]

aneep, there's two things I'd like to note about Australia:
- First is that unlike the UK weekly sales there have Xbox almost at the same level as PS2, as in both selling ~10k units 2-3 weeks ago and both selling ~15k units the following week (I don't have the exact numbers anymore but they were pretty close with PS2 leading only by a couple hundred units). In the UK, while Xbox has pulled away from GC, PS2 is WAY ahead of both competitors, so UK and AU are two quite different scenarios.
- Second, the thing about those total numbers is that PS2 has been on sale for almost 18 months longer than both GC and Cube. considering that the lead is not exactly mind bogglingly huge, take away those 18 months of sales and I guess Xbox would be pretty closer actually...
Anyway, the rest of the world has quite a different picture for the console race (race sounds nicer than war anyway).

Other than that, I can also remember some percentages given lately for Germany, probably the same you referred to (I read them on www.gamesmarkt.de ). According to a press announcement Xbox managed to double market share in weekly sales a month or so ago. Sounds impressive at first, but only until you realize that market share prior to the Sega bundle was only barely in the double digits (I think it hovered @ ~12%), so I would expect it at ~25% now, respectable but not close to PS2 which supposedly still makes up above 60% (which leaves 10-15% for Nintendo at the moment). No word about total sales numbers, but they should see a huge lead for PS2 and GC should still be ahead of Xbox in installed base.
There is now a new deal starting today, where everyone buying the Sega bundle till christmas can get a copy of Halo for free (as long as supply lasts), so MS appears quite comitted to the European market, a feeling that I don't get at all from Nintendo lately... MS has no other choice though, they need a strong base in NA and Europe since Japan is a lost cause.

 

[Johnny Awesome]

It's all moot. Microsoft is going to spend enough money to ensure the success of Xbox. The tie-in ratios are good. They'll probably hit 7 million sold by the end of the year and 9 million by E3 2003. Then probably 13 million by end of 2003, 19 millon by the end of 2004 and 25 million by the end of 2005. That's a fine start this generation. They'll probably sell 250 million games in total. Good enough to break even.

I realize that you naysayers aren't going to shut up until Xbox hits 15 million world-wide, but I'm just giving you a leg up.

 

[BenSkywalker]

They must be shipped numbers. I do not see how the GC or the xbox (not sure about the ps2) can be at this level.

It's possible that those are shipped numbers, but I find it unlikely. Recall that we are in the middle of December and the last numbers we saw were tracking firms for October(which underreport). On a normal basis, the console market does close to 40% of its annual sales in ~six or seven weeks, the period we are in right now.

From the last numbers I saw the Cube was closing in on 3Million units in Japan and 2.5Million units in Europe. Tack on 1.1Million units for last years US sales and you are looking at them needing 3.4Million units selling through in the US to date this year to be at their figure, that certainly sounds reasonable to me. They were likely right around 2.25Million at the end of October(adjusting from NPDs numbers). Also, they had a press release a couple of weeks ago about the 12Millionth Flipper chip rolling off the lines. Having a large quantity in excess of 2Million units(this was a couple of weeks ago) in the pipe for the Cube seems unreasonable to me.

For the XBox, they are pushing near 2.5Million units in Europe based on the last numbers I have seen with another .25Million in Japan. Add 1.3Million for their launch last year in the states and they would need about 3.95Million in the US this year to be at 8Million. IIRC, the XBox was @3.4Million as of the end of October in the US, they should have already surpassed the 8Million mark by a decent margin actually.

PS2 noone seems to have a problem with, so I won't bother with breaking that down

 

[Teasy]

For the XBox, they are pushing near 2.5Million units in Europe based on the last numbers I have seen

Where have you seen full European numbers for XBox and GC?

 

[BenSkywalker]

Where have you seen full European numbers for XBox and GC?

I don't remember, Evil's maybe, perhaps GameDaily...? I check about fifteen different sites a day for news(gaming news), don't recall which site it was from. They didn't break anything down(all they stated was total numbers sold) so I didn't bother posting anything about it here.