KYRO enhanced T&L

IIRC guardband clipping is part of the tile binning which is done in hardware and thus for free.

K-

 

About 120$ / 106$....

/ Tompa

 

I would guess, that the drivers "fake" hardware T&L. Guard Band Clipping is then implicitly done.

Cheers
Gubbi

 

silly me! of course. sorry for the waste of forum bandwidth.

 

OK, so that should put it in competition with the following products (in the U.S. at least). Pricewatch prices:

Radeon 7500, 64 MB, TV Out, Retail: $80
GF4MX 440, 64 MB TV Out: $90
GeForce3 Ti-200, 64 MB, TV Out, $125
Radeon 8500 LE, 64 MB, TV out, $140

Will be interesting to see the benchmarks. This is a very competitive price range!

 

Joe - the converstations have been had numerous times here; US and European prices rarely come close to each other!

 

Your taking recommended prices and putting them up against actual prices, the Hercules Kyro II 4500 is still $100 recommended but on pricewatch its $50, expect the same sort of thing from the 4800.

 

Has any new Kyro part even been debuted at $50? Do you think that maybe the 4500 prices are considerably lower to make room for the 4800? Is Hercules discontinuing the 4500 and replacing it with the 4800, or are the complimentary products? (Honest questions...)

Also, nobody said anything about those prices quoted to me being recommended or expected street. No source was provided...only one set of prices for UK (Euro), and one set of prices for U.S. No further clarification was given.

That is why I gave a wide range of competing products with price points from $80 to $140. Surely, the 4800 will fit somewhere in there?

Which is specifically why I mentioned "in the U.S. at least" in my price lists.

It would help if there were some refernces given for the prices that were quoted for the 4800. Did these come from Hercules? Did they come off of some search engine? Are they just rumored?

I'm not looking to stir anything up here...just looking for facts.

 

ok sorry I just transfered the prices to US$ that came via the link mat gave, a quick search here in Sweden for the other boards are:

Radeon 7500, 64 MB, TV Out, Retail:$144
GF4MX 440, 64 MB TV Out: $151
GeForce3 Ti-200, 64 MB, TV Out, $192
Radeon 8500 LE, 64 MB, TV out, $211


...so quite a different...(these are then ofcourse with HUGE swedish tax = take off 20% and its taxfree)

// Tompa

 

KYRO II was a good copetitor for GTS/Radeon/MX400 cards. But the KYRO II SE isn't competitive anymore.

KYRO II is 14% faster (both, mem and core). But the competition in this segment gained more! Geforce4 MX has 20% more memory bandwith than a GTS as well as bandwith saving features, which makes at least a 40% increase over the GTS. Radeon 7500 has a 60% fillrate increase and a 25% bandwith increase over the original Radeon. Today, a gamer shouldn't buy anything slower than a R7500 or a GF4MX. The SE also lacks dualhead technology, which makes it even less attractive.

 

Just to brush up on my Kyro specs:

KyroII 4500: Core and Mem at 175 Mhz
KyroII 4800: Core and Mem at 200 Mhz

Is that correct?

On pricing:

I didn't notice that the Austrian prices were actually links to what I assume is a search engine? So in Austria at least, it appears the 4800 falls somewhere between the Radeon 7200 and 7500 in price. And it also falls just below the GeForce MX440 in price.

Will Beyond3D be reviewing the 4800?

 

Marco may well get one from Hercules. I'll see if David Harold is predisposed to giving me an Vivid!XS Elite to play around with once he gets back from CeBit.

 

No, Kyro II was supposed to be $150 reccomened and was actually sold at $110 AFAIR, then within a few months it dropped to $90, then quickly to $80 and so on. But I think STM realise that this chip is not a big improvement over Kyro II like Kyro II was over Kyro I and so they can't sell it for a great deal more, I certainly know these cards will not actually sell for $120, nowhwere near.

Oh ok I wasn't aware of that, I assumed you knew they were reccomened prices.[/quote]

 

Even if it sells at $100, it's still near the price of Gainward's GeForce 3 Ti200 (Or, as Gainward calls it, Ti450) which is $145. Just save up an extra $45 and grab that. 4ns memory and you can overclock it to Ti500 levels. So, why get this when you can get Ti500 level performance for only a bit more?

None that I can see.

 

Honestly...

If you buy this thing over a Ti200, you just *must* want to buy anything other than nVidia...This seems like a product without a market.

Please...don't try and suggest that it's all about the low-end, because I have no doubt that it will end up getting smoked in virtually every single aspect by the competition's low-end products (be it sales, performance, features, etc.)

Of course, the absolute kicker is the following...

http://www.voodooextreme.com/#26891

"KyroII SE w/ T&L 6:17 PM - Duane "Cp" Pemberton"

 

Typedef,

When I first heard last year about the 4800 I thought it was a stupid idea back then as today.

I'm not so sure though if your statement can be justified to it's full extend if someone takes MX420's or R7200's or lower into account. Especially when I look at the price/performance ratios of those and the "feature list" of the NV17.

Last year Fu claimed that the reason for the 4800 release would be to yield better OEM deals. While I could have seen some usefullness for that last August, I find it rather tough to believe in today's terms.

Today it rather looks to me as some kind of reminder that they're still around or something like that and hopefully (if I take Fu's old interview as accurate) it should mark a 5500 release "in a couple of months".

Still I'd like to see a 4800 properly reviewed, those ace's "overclocked K2" numbers don't seem to match up. If it's all there really is than it's even a bigger disappointment than I could have imagined.

 

What do You mean with "in a couple of months"

Does this "couple of months" start at the original release timeframe (09/01) or do they start now (03/02)

 

I would guestimate a "couple of months" after the release. Currently we have just an announcement.

Anything beyond the end of this spring would be too late. I'm really curious if VIA will be able to push the envelope as it should.

First I guess we'll have to await VIA's formal announcement in about 2 hours from now, although PR stuff doesn't tell always the real story.

 

Eek..

I had hoped you ment "a couple of months after Sept. 01"

This brings the release-date of the STG5500 near the timeframe Joe DeFuria mentioned (Sept 02).
I really hope the STG5500 is an DX8-compliant chip then, otherwise they get smoked.

 

A couple in my definition means two (2) not more.

By the way I thought spring ends in Germany around the same time as here? hehehehe