Kinect-less XB1 fallout thread *spawn

[3dilettante]

I'm sure they can put a case together to reassure developers looking into Kinect games that this move will increase the Kinect install base rather than decrease it.

For developers that are Kinect-focused to the point that it is obligatory, that might work.
For developers that don't rely on this and have the option to go without, the market penetration of Kinect is going to become important.
If the ratio skews heavily against Kinect, then they're going to evaluate whether an larger Kinect base in absolute terms is worth catering to versus a larger fraction of Kinect-free setups.

 

[DJ12]

The real irony to all this is the PS4 camera sells like hot cakes.

 

[eastmen]

Right!, now i remember, you weren't going to buy the XB1 because it lacked mediacenter. But you won it instead: http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1803178&postcount=342
Still don´t understand you first adaptor comment though.
http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1846609&postcount=9695

You paid around 80-100 dollars for your XB1, it´s not like you invested big amounts into Kinect 2.

yea but my gf has one also (We play games together online)

I've also pumped $60 for a second controller , $40 for the remote and about another $400 on games.

Prob would have been better if I sold my system at launch, would have come out ahead instead of this.

 

[Shortbread]

The real irony to all this is the PS4 camera sells like hot cakes.

Mostly for voyeuristic needs... j/k

 

[eastmen]

I'm sure they can put a case together to reassure developers looking into Kinect games that this move will increase the Kinect install base rather than decrease it.

how would that work ? Before it was 1:1 now it will be less and the longer we move from june the more in favor it will be of an xbox one user not having Kinect.

This basicly just kills any Kinect game that was in the pipe line for next year , stuff this year might still do alright since there are 5m kinects out there but rather quickly (unless this just completely kills whats left of the one ) there will be more and more people without kinects.

MS blew it, nothing they can really do at this point to fix the mess that they are in. They keep listening to the wrong people and not their actual fans.

 

[3dilettante]

The real irony to all this is the PS4 camera sells like hot cakes.

What's the number of cameras sold relative to the total PS4 installed base?
Sony hasn't been trying to keep things 1:1.

 

[Michellstar]

The harm hasn't been done today. It was made 2 or 3 years ago. After just 6 months in the market for the most part they scrape their vision and we're left with an underpowered box for the whole gen...

 

[eastmen]

The harm hasn't been done today. It was made 2 or 3 years ago. After just 6 months in the market for the most part they scrape their vision and we're left with an underpowered box for the whole gen...

Its really funny if you look at how the faux internet outrage has worked against MS

Games DRM with 10 friend sharing - Internet exploded against MS but bent over for Valve

NASA camera in the living room - Internet exploded against MS but are buying it in droves for sony

Weaker more expensive system - Internet exploded against Ms but have bought ps3s in parity with xbox 360s over the course of the last generation.

Its really interesting what's happened. MS really can't catch a break even if some of their ideas are game changers.

 

[Dave Baumann]

For developers that are Kinect-focused to the point that it is obligatory, that might work.
For developers that don't rely on this and have the option to go without, the market penetration of Kinect is going to become important.
If the ratio skews heavily against Kinect, then they're going to evaluate whether an larger Kinect base in absolute terms is worth catering to versus a larger fraction of Kinect-free setups.

Both of these cases are considerations for an XBOX One only title.

how would that work ? Before it was 1:1 now it will be less and the longer we move from june the more in favor it will be of an xbox one user not having Kinect.

Because the logic is that the price delta right now is putting more people off and going to the competition, in the long run retarding the install base of both XBOX One and Kinect. Buy removing the price consideration now they stand to pick up additional Kinect peripheral sales down the line to some of the customers that would otherwise have gone to the competition.

I just read the ARS article and Phil basically says just this.

“This decision in the long run will give more people a Kinect sensor,” Spencer said. “Now, people can join Xbox One sooner and add Kinect at a later time.”

 

[Jwm]

The real irony to all this is the PS4 camera sells like hot cakes.

A part of me says that MS is looking at this, and a part of me thinks MS will actually make more money off some sales now. If you don't buy a bundle, you pay $399 plus in the future you want to add Kinect. So if it is $149 for example, that is greater than the early adopter bundle.

Edit: Add the quote from Phil, and I think it makes more sense. If the current bundle is a loss for MS, this allows them to move quickly towards not losing on either product.

 

[eastmen]

Both of these cases are considerations for an XBOX One only title.



Because the logic is that the price delta right now is putting more people off and going to the competition, in the long run retarding the install base of both XBOX One and Kinect. Buy removing the price consideration now they stand to pick up additional Kinect peripheral sales down the line to some of the customers that would otherwise have gone to the competition.

I just read the ARS article and Phil basically says just this.

Or of course the monthly reversals on anything they have said for the last year and a half will just simply turn people off and sales will continue to stagnate.

When it comes to the xbox one , I can't trust anything Microsoft says anymore. The 3ds killed my excititment for the wii u and the xbox one has killed my excitement for anything else xbox one.


I'm calling it right now MS has just become sega . The xbox one is their staturn

 

[HTupolev]

Its really funny if you look at how the faux internet outrage has worked against MS

Games DRM with 10 friend sharing - Internet exploded against MS but bent over for Valve

Steam doesn't use always-online DRM.

NASA camera in the living room - Internet exploded against MS but are buying it in droves for sony

You never needed to buy the camera to buy a PS4.

Weaker more expensive system - Internet exploded against Ms but have bought ps3s in parity with xbox 360s over the course of the last generation.

The internet gave Sony plenty of crap when the PS3 was initially insanely overpriced compared with the competition.

 

[eastmen]

harmonix is super thrilled

I doubt they will develop for Kinect anymore after this .

 

[eastmen]

Steam doesn't use always-online DRM.

by default it does , you have to enable off line mode.

You never needed to buy the camera to buy a PS4.

Your not getting the point , the ps4 camera is capable of spying on you just as well as the Kinect but no one complains about it.

The internet gave Sony plenty of crap when the PS3 was initially insanely overpriced compared with the competition.

Actually the push back against sony was very slow building , it took a year for most to see the wool pulled over their eyes and then another year before people started to understand how poorly the system was designed.

 

[Cyan]

yea but my gf has one also (We play games together online)

I've also pumped $60 for a second controller , $40 for the remote and about another $400 on games.

Prob would have been better if I sold my system at launch, would have come out ahead instead of this.

I have conflicting voices in my head, too.

In one hand, I feel abandoned as an early adopter and Kinect supporter.

On the other hand, listening to people, this decision can be beneficial for me in the long run (more sales) as I bought it totally certain that it'd be my console of choice this generation.

 

[eastmen]

I have conflicting voices in my head, too.

In one hand, I feel abandoned as an early adopter and Kinect supporter.

On the other hand, listening to people, this decision can be beneficial for me in the long run (more sales) as I bought it totally certain that it'd be my console of choice this generation.

More sales equal what ?

We are already going to get all the multiplatform games that look worse than the ps4 and both platforms will look much worse than the PC

We wont be getting unique games that focus on Kinect now . so there really isn't much of a point.

If I sold at launch I would have made about $500 so that would have been nice and I could have pumped that into my pc.

At this point who knows whats next , all the interesting features are gone , what are they going to throw out from the box next ?

 

[HTupolev]

by default it does , you have to enable off line mode.

That it even has an offline mode makes it completely different from that the XB1 proposal was.

Your not getting the point , the ps4 camera is capable of spying on you just as well as the Kinect but no one complains about it.

Oh, the security issue? That feels like by far the smaller complaint about Kinect, and one which Microsoft addressed reasonably well early on (by allowing the console to work without Kinect plugged in).

 

[Dave Baumann]

harmonix is super thrilled

I doubt they will develop for Kinect anymore after this .

And the company statement:

"As avid gamers, we're excited for fans to have more choices out there. As game makers, this platform change doesn't affect our strategy – it reinforces that we must continue to focus on building innovative, compelling and well-designed motion experiences to motivate consumers to buy our games.

"We believe that tightly-crafted motion games can be great, genre-defining interactive experiences, as we've proven with the Dance Central franchise on Kinect for Xbox 360, and we're eager to prove it again with Disney Fantasia: Music Evolved this fall on both Xbox One and Xbox 360."

 

[Dave Baumann]

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2014-05-13-xbox-one-to-overtake-ps4-in-us-by-2015-says-analyst

"In effect, Microsoft has reverted to its Xbox 360 Kinect strategy and with a likely drop in interest from third-parties, Kinect for Xbox One has suddenly shifted from central to the Xbox vision to the periphery. However, later in the cycle when adoption is more mass market aligned and entertainment functionality is more heavily built out, Microsoft will be hoping that the value of Kinect will be more easily demonstrated and in demand."

 

[eastmen]

That it even has an offline mode makes it completely different from that the XB1 proposal was.


Oh, the security issue? That feels like by far the smaller complaint about Kinect, and one which Microsoft addressed reasonably well early on (by allowing the console to work without Kinect plugged in).

the one would have had a 24 hour off line mode. Its a console not a laptop or tablet , its not going to be played on the go for the majority of its install base.



Dave - That company response sounds really desperate. They also started a kickstarter for a ps4/3 game with no xbox support .

I doubt they are happy with the way this has played out. I don't think anyone is actually happy.