Your Jedi example highlights the problem in the idea. Even in Empire Strikes Back Luke was pulling feats of agility impossible for humans. Why would I want to play ordinary humans with ordinary human limitations? It's fine for a very limited segment of games, but 'realism' is not that high on the scale of things I care about in videogames.
Introducing Wii MotionPlus, Nintendo improves Wiimote
- Thread starter patsu
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Heh.
This is where we have differed before, and where we differ still.
In my view, the ability to build actual kinetic skill is one of the most promising aspects of motion recognition. Not as important as accessibility in the greater scheme of things, but the aspect that hold the most attraction for me personally as an enabler of game mechanics I value.
There is sports for that
.Anyway one of the things that videogames brings is (or used to be) easy acess anyone could have minimum skill in just a few minutes (even in larger tuturials it just take 10-15 minutes, unless it is a RTS), this way it would passs hours before many persons could have minimum skills.
There are more problems than the controler ability to recg motion, the medium (TV) will not be an advantage or no force resistance from or "foes" comes to mind. You still can add a lot of "special movements" that make more damage and such, like in fighting games, but by doing counter-life like movements.
A game like tennis is probably the best candidate to have both kinds of controls, easy to market with the reasons you list, but frustation free. I really hope that at least some games try it.
Frankly, I don't see why this would be any harder than what the Wii already uses, which is arguably the easiest to get into of any interface available. 80 year olds have no problem whatsoever with bowling, tennis and so on. Increased precision won't change that, only give the game designer sharper tools to work with.There is sports for that
Anyway one of the things that videogames brings is (or used to be) easy acess anyone could have minimum skill in just a few minutes (even in larger tuturials it just take 10-15 minutes, unless it is a RTS), this way it would passs hours before many persons could have minimum skills.
And yes, the idea is to move towards sports in terms of control. Sports are easy to get into, yet the offers depth that engages potentially for a lifetime. Add to that the ability of computers to generate virtual worlds of storylines and challenges, and you have a pretty compelling package.
This is true, but the same is true if you play via keyboard and mouse or a gamepad. Only your input in that case isn't anywhere close to being life like in any way.
Again, (Obonicus, take note) not all games are suited to motion mapping, and not all actions in all games. This is not a problem, just as games on PCs aren't ASWD+mouselook for all possible actions in all possible games. Again, this is no change relative to the current state of the art. Good control, regardless of how it is used is generally better than sloppy control. But it is critical with some genres of games, and enables new games that would be frustrating or impossible without it.
Tennis, bowling, golf, table-tennis, fly-fishing, base-ball, whipping, sword/mace/axe/dagger fighting are all obvious targets. And better control would be a huge improvement in all shooters, where the current Wii-mote is arguably better than a game-pad but clearly less effective than a mouse. (I haven't kept track, does anyone use the Wii-fit pad for surfing, snowboarding or skateboarding games? Otherwise it's the same idea. A, use a method of input which can mimic the real mechanic. B, higher precision enables better in game control and skill building.)
I think the major advantage of wii motionplus is probably that it won't be as much hard work to get a game to control as intuitively as some of the wii-sports games do. It will just be less work to map certain motions and get a certain precision and response, and that alone is probably worth it. Then add the increased range of motions you can get, and the increased depth of gaming because of the better precision, and it's a big win.
The question of course remains whether or not this can offset the split user-base. Considering how well it sold, a Wii-sports game can carry the add-on by itself in principle. But with games like wii-sports it's not just about the one controller - people have at least two, and all the controllers will have to be updated, so it will be interesting to see how that's handled.
The question of course remains whether or not this can offset the split user-base. Considering how well it sold, a Wii-sports game can carry the add-on by itself in principle. But with games like wii-sports it's not just about the one controller - people have at least two, and all the controllers will have to be updated, so it will be interesting to see how that's handled.
I have a feeling the add-on will be bundled with several games. They can be sure Wii Sports 2 will be a huge hit and everyone will at least have one. More than any other system, I think the Wii owners are more likely to have more than one controller, so bundling the add-on with some other games will probably encourage people to buy those games. And it is supposed to be fairly cheap. I also expect update controllers at some point with the add-on built in.
My only worry is that there will be low availability of these things because of the huge demand.
Except people who 'get into it' don't care one jot for control, because Wii Tennis et al bear almost no relation to the motion controls! What WiiMotion may provide is what we were hoping for from the tech in the first place - an accurate reading of the user's input, rather than a vague signal that the Wiimote has moved and an almost random response from the game. Unless you think Wii Tennis is the pinnacle of motion response and there's no way it can be improved
Thing is if you go the realistic route then you have one big problem, is that many times the basic skills need for starting a game will take hours before are gained.
Sure that shouldnt stop shuch games from being made, but they may have a user base much inferior to Wii Sports like games.
There isa diference beween good control and real life like control, even in no absolute control the Wii remote does have a big advantage, that is intuitivness of the controls.
I really hope that such games will exist, but it surely is a bigger risk for devs.
Except people who 'get into it' don't care one jot for control, because Wii Tennis et al bear almost no relation to the motion controls! What WiiMotion may provide is what we were hoping for from the tech in the first place - an accurate reading of the user's input, rather than a vague signal that the Wiimote has moved and an almost random response from the game. Unless you think Wii Tennis is the pinnacle of motion response and there's no way it can be improved
Hmm, I'm not sure if you're doing Wii Tennis justice there ... It's a pretty good implementation given the limits of the hardware, and it seems to have by far the most depth of the Sports range. The backhand vs forehand system works great, you can really affect the angle you hit the ball with, the smashes are dependent on how you hold the wii-mote too, not just a cheap timing hack. It has a fair bit of depth I didn't expect from it, and I enjoy that game ... one of the few experiences that I wish we got a PS3 equivalent for.
You can hit a backhand by swinging a forehand! A group of us gave Wii a go when it first came out. Some loved it, the girls especially, and they were content to wave their arms about and see results. Some didn't, including one friend who isn't a gamer beyond a bit of Driver, Tekken and CON, who turned away from the screen and wiggled the Wiimote back and forth and still managed to return almost every shot. WiiSports was very good at what it did, but it failed to introduce the motion control that a lot were wanting or expecting, and that can be addressed noe with MotionPlus.
Not really? Though maybe by accident? It's one of the first things you need to master if you want to be good at this game, is to do a proper backhand/forehand ... interesting how we see this completely differently.
I for one was pretty impressed that you can perform shots like slices pretty accurately in Wii Sports. I've had a few misreads where it thinks I've swung when I haven't, but in general I'd rate the accuracy of the control pretty highly.
Besides, MotionPlus increases the accuracy of the measurements, but it's the conversion of those measurements across time into the appropriate action on screen which is where the challenge lies for the software. Exactly which set of motions indicates a slice vs a dropshot?
Besides, MotionPlus increases the accuracy of the measurements, but it's the conversion of those measurements across time into the appropriate action on screen which is where the challenge lies for the software. Exactly which set of motions indicates a slice vs a dropshot?
If enough Motion Plus addons are sold it won't be a problem, as you could use two main controllers instead of the nunchuck. But I can't see a boxing game using Motion Plus coming out until that happens, unless they release it with two motion plus addons included..
There are already games based on a similar idea, albeit with different weapons. Have you played Quake by any chance? There are clans and everything, and winning depends only on skill.
Wii Tennis does indeed allow you a lot of control...however, the fact that it will also respond to mere shakes is a strength rather than a weakness.
But it did not do what I wanted it to do. And Wii Boxing was far worse. My early complaints on first experiencing WIi mixed with a lot of other folks, way back when. Wiiu may well offer a great experience for some, but for many with a degree of expectation from the motion control, it fell far short of what was expected. Just the same as PS3's motion controls have been basically ignored.Eurogamer agrees with me on Wii Tennis apparently:
I'd like to see a 'proper' motion control game, though in that my experience of Wii's library is very limited and i don't know what other games may already be out.
Wii boxing definitely controlled very poorly. You had to learn exactly how to throw the punches and the movements didn't really feel natural. But, the game was still very fun and surprisingly very challenging once you got your rating into the pro and the computer started laying beatings on you with big combos.
thatdude90210
Regular
IGN posted a preview of Tiger Woods PGA tour 10. They have some videos too. From everything they are saying, Motion+ with the right game looks to be a winner.
Here's a juicy quote:
Here's a juicy quote:
Nice! My Wii might actually get some play-time after gathering dust since Mario Galaxy.
It's been a nice (if a tad expensive) usb charger for my SIXAXIS though
It's been a nice (if a tad expensive) usb charger for my SIXAXIS though