epicstruggle said:
I wonder which came first, the israelis rocketing terrorists, or palestinians suicide bombing cafes/buses/...
That comparison is biased and wrong on so many levels. Actually, what REALLY came first was the eviction of tens of thousands of palestinians in post-WWII to create the state of Israel to begin with. That was a theft of land and property on a scale that has rarely been seen since.
That it was all done for a good purpose doesn't change the fact the land selected to become Israel was already populated, and it all hence for all intents and purposes was stolen.
Also, Israelis don't rocket TERRORISTS. They rocket a house, or apartement, or car or such that they believe houses one or more terrorists. Problem is, they don't always hit the target, and quite often also hit innocents, including children! Israel has an army, they have special forces troops, they have the intelligence to locate these targets to begin with, so why they instead send rockets blindly towards the target is a rather frightening question to answer.
The answer is, of course, that the Israeli value their soldiers, whose JOB it is to fight, higher than the lives of Palestinian innocents, including children whom have nothing to do with terrorism. Is that right, you think? Don't dodge aside and respond with some lame BS like "THEY started it!", etc. Just answer the question straight up.
The circle of violence started with the palestinians, you cant bomb terrorists until they actually become terrorists.
Where the violence against civilians ACTUALLY STARTED is not only impossible to determine now, after this much blood it's not really relevant any longer. It goes on because the other side did something that now needs to be avenged, and neither side even bothers to deny that.
What's certain though is it did NOT start at the Palestinian side just because you want it to be that way.
The world needs to unite against palestinian terrorist.
What about the Israeli state terrorism then? The rocketing/airbombing of civilians; the collective punishments including locking down entire cities in curfew for days at a time; the destruction of homes of people unrelated to acts of terrorism; the answering of thrown stones with live rounds from automatic weapons; continuous theft of more land to build illegal settlements or build walls turning whole regions into Apartheid "homelands" or simply to extend Israeli agriculture space, etc etc etc etc?
Once that stops, you can move forward towards peace. Theres no other way.
Problem is, with that line of reasoning it will NEVER stop because the blame for this situation does not solely reside on just one side. There are human beings with pride and anger on BOTH sides, one side is just a bit more desperate than the other, hence the suicide bombers.
If Israel did not oppress the Palestinians like they do now, shitting on them on a daily basis and chaining them down in deepest poverty and despair, you can be sure the majority of suicides would stop, because if you got something to live for you don't WANT to die. When you got NO future however, and someone can provide you the means of taking some from the other side with you, blowing yourself up will start to sound like a pretty damn tempting proposition.
Your really dreaming if you think the israelis will just keep taking suicide bombings.
...And we can ALL see how effective their current "eye for an eye" strategy of violence in return for violence is...
Jesus, don't you realize this is just maintaining status quo; continued killing on BOTH sides?
With many nations supporting the wrong side, you actually encourage them to suicide bomb.
Actually, making sure the Israeli stay in power as the master race, THAT is a very good recipie for more suicide bombings...
The Israeli needs to continue to strike back at terrorists and their organizations, but they need to strike at the terrorists ONLY, not at the terrorists' innocent greater families, their neighbors; the people in the apartement nextdoor or across the street, the man with three children who drove by in the car just as the missile hit, etc.
Israelis need to stop harassing and delaying Palestinians at border checkpoints, even to the point of critical patients in ambulances actually dying on the way to hospital or pregnant mothers miscarrying. They also need to stop ruining the lives and economy of the Palestinian people by for example erecting roads and walls cutting off villages from their farmlands and orchards and locking people in so they can't get to their jobs. Etc. Doing THAT is how you create terrorists, Epic!
It's not enough to just cut back a little on the harassment like they sometimes do, open the borders for a little while etc. The economy in the Palestinian territories is BEYOND rotten, and it's contrary to popular opinion amongst conservatives not just the fault of the corrupt old. fat terrorist Yassir Arafat (you might just as well apply those adjectives to Sharon too btw). It all needs to STOP. Arafat needs to go, but he'll be dead soon anyway. Also... The illegal settlements on occupied land needs to be abandoned. ALL of them, not just the ones the Israeli government calls illegal. The illegal Apartheid wall needs to go. The occupied territories needs proper infrastructure; water, sewage, power. HOUSES. Etc, etc.
There's so many reasons the current situation exists, but at this stage it's not enough to fix just one or two of them; a major effort MUST be done or it'll just continue the same way; creating misery for both, but mostly on one side.
The Israelis can't afford this either, the loss of goodwill abroad and spiralling military costs is hurting their economy too much.
It might well be just one person's fault when two fight, but it is NOT just one PEOPLE's fault when two fight, and since Israel is the stronger of the two they need to show more responsibility and restraint. Currently, they're not really showing any.
"I am constantly surprised by how much I hear racism talked about and how little I actually see it," -Dinesh D'Souza
Suppose that depends on where one's looking...
