F-Zero GC possibly using bumpmapping at 60fps.

It's a possibility, albeit I'd say slim chance.

If so, and if the framerate stays around 60fps constantly, then GameCube can do more than I thought..
 
Probably not bm. It would'nt surprise me if it were bm at 60fps..remember Rogue Leader? I think it's some damn good textures from AV. Remember SMB and SMB2's Monkey Target? It looked like bm but was not. Sega has some damn good texture artists I'll say that.
 
Has no one here seen Star Fox Adventures?

Lots of SFA pics

This game had bumpmapping all over the place in its interiors and ran at 60fps all the time, in these interirors. If its not bumpmapping then what is it?
 
SFA is a little like Rogue leader in regards to framerate. It's mostly 30-60 with occasional below 30 framerates. And yes both appear to have a lot of bump-mapping.

I don't see why GC couldn't do 60 fps with bumpmapping. Flipper is definitely fast enough. It's when there's too much T&L that the framerate may suffer. The Kothlis level in Rogue leader is probably a good exemple of that.
 
SFA doesn't use a whole lot of bump mapping and RL is mostly fillrate limited - not to mention horribly unoptimized.
 
SFA mostly ran at 30 fps as far as I could tell. It did use some interesting effects, but I say that they didn't use bumpmapping enough.
 
Kothlis level

http://cubemedia.ign.com/media/previews/image/rogueleader/rogueleadgc61.JPG

That part of the game slows down pretty badly. Look at the water. coincidence?

What makes you think the game is "horribly unoptimized"? I'd say that it could've been optimized more but considering the kind of graphics it produces, I'm sure there was a fair amount of optimisation.

I could be wrong about the bumpmapping in SFA. It seems to be pretty much everywhere to me.
 
What makes you think the game is "horribly unoptimized"?
Click to expand...

Probably due to the fact that the game was created in only 9 months. Its very suprising that they even got this game out in 9 months considering how technically impressive it is. I really can't see how they had much of a chance to optimise it.
 
Real DOT3 BM in my opinion, looks exactly the same as the track's surface of Quantum RedShift (Xbox)
 
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I don't think SFA has any bumpmapped surfaces other than the walls of the caverns where the staff upgrades are located.
It's difficult to tell but the track looks bumpmapped to me.
 
If you don't include the "hub" world (which has no bumpmapping) SFA ran at 60 fps 90% of the time. The only significant slowdown occured in that main area for whatever reason. I'm pretty good at detecting slowdown; I noticed 4 less-than-one-second stutters in the "perfectly smooth" Metroid Prime, for instance. SFA's framerate is much more consistent than RL which could slow down at any time.

As for where there was bumpmapping...check out the first, fifth, eighth and 15th pics. That's not bumpmapping? The wall behind Fox in the first pic reacts to realtime light; for instance shooting your staff by it. Is there another method (other than modelling with polygons) to achieve that effect?
 
I think you're right. I always think of the main area of SFA when I try to remember the framerate and it's probably the only area where it's inconsistent. I don't remember seeing any framerate problems in the rest of the game. As for bump-mapping, the two areas where I clearly remember seeing some was the shop in thorntail hollow and krazoa temple. From what I can see it's basically wall to wall bump-mapping.
 
the thing is,

who's really gonna notice bump mapping when you're flying a super fast *thing* at 60fps?!?! apart from the geeks who pause the game to analyse every aspect of the graphics....... :rolleyes: :rolleyes: we're not talking about a game like GT3 which, even though it is at a perfect 60fps, is *slow* compared to futuristic racers........ :rolleyes:

is anyone gonna notice the difference from very high quality texture mapping and bump mapping in something that stays in the screen for less than a 10th of a second?!?! :rolleyes:

the only area i can think of i if they put it on the cars... but i wouldn't call that *extensive use of bump mapping...*
 
london-boy said:
the thing is,

who's really gonna notice bump mapping when you're flying a super fast *thing* at 60fps?!?! apart from the geeks who pause the game to analyse every aspect of the graphics....... :rolleyes: :rolleyes: we're not talking about a game like GT3 which, even though it is at a perfect 60fps, is *slow* compared to futuristic racers........ :rolleyes:

is anyone gonna notice the difference from very high quality texture mapping and bump mapping in something that stays in the screen for less than a 10th of a second?!?! :rolleyes:

the only area i can think of i if they put it on the cars... but i wouldn't call that *extensive use of bump mapping...*
Click to expand...

Heh, F-Zero X looked like total crap via that very reasoning, if it's 60fps and blazing at 800kmh then detail should be irrelevant. But go to any review site and all of them proclaim the game looks horrific, and a couple of GameFAQs user reviews (morons, TBH) said they couldn't play the game cos it looked so bad.

Actually the game had VERY nice specular highlights on the vehicles, and that was pretty much its only graphical 'feature'... but I believe it must have used HOS of some kind (probably bezier curves) cos the tracks are just SO ROUNDED...
 
I loved F Zero X for the N64. I also loved Wipeout Fusion for PS2 (to bad it bombed). If anyone can return F Zero back to being the king of futuracers it's AV.

As far as SFA, I really did'nt notice any bumpmapping. But yes the framerate stuttered in areas. Overall it was fine except for new areas causing hitches just before you entered them. One other note about SFA is the fur. Do you guys remember the early days of the GCN even before Rare first released shots of Fox' fur? Everyone (even Korval) said that the GCN would not be able to do fur in realtime. And it was agreed that it would only be fur in cutscenes ( I wish I'd saved some of those threads to show you.) Then Rare proved everyone wrong. I still look at SFA and the fur on the animals and think wow, this is a frist gen game (N64 turned GCN game at that). Not that SFA is a graphical masterpiece but it's a nice achievement nonetheless. So for it to be at or near 60fps speaks pretty well for what the GCN is capable of with some talented artists and coders.
 
Plasmatics:

> As for where there was bumpmapping...check out the first, fifth, eighth
> and 15th pics. That's not bumpmapping?

We've already has this discussion but I'll repeat one of my posts from an older thread:

"There is no bump mapping in pic 1 and 3. Not having played the game it's harder to tell with pic 2 and 4 but I'm actually leaning towards it being good texturing. If you look at pic 4 you can see the highlights on the walls change place. On the left side the highlight is placed on the bottom of the stones and on the right side it is placed on top. That would be the natural result if the texture is just repeated all the way round.

The fact that there's doubt speaks volumes of Rare talent for texture creation."

SFA really isn't the best example of bump mapping on the Cube.


Anyway... F-Zero will kick ass.
 
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