DEV question: Could the xbox handle MP?

[archie4oz]

Cel-shaded games should be as colorful as possible.

I wholeheartedly disagree with this. The whole point of NPR is simply present the data (in this case game imagery) in a fashion that the presenter feels most suitable to convey what they're trying present.

Using a toon-shader does not inherently mean that bright, poppy colors are automatically a must. While I too prefer bright colorful games, I don't believe they're answer to every game out there, even if they rely on various NPR techniques...

 

[Blade]

Archie: I agree. Bright colors aren't necessary, but they've proven to be the norm.

Bright colors seem to be prevalent in most cel-shaded games to date.. and most of these games look great.

 

[Fafalada]

Bright colors seem to be prevalent in most cel-shaded games to date..

Most NPR games are also trying to show a similar look. It doesn't mean that some originality wouldn't work though - although I can see why stuff like Killer7 is unlikely to be attractive to quite as many people as the brighter/livelier stuff.

But considering there is plenty of animation/comic art out there that is anything BUT colorfull and still has large following, I think we'll see more varied NPR stuff make its way into games eventually too.

 

[Blade]

Faf: I was actually going to bring up Killer 7. (which has a sort of "toon" shading applied.. but not JGR-style)

I'd tend to agree you overall.

Cel-shading has only come in a few forms.. such as the anime-esque JSRF and Looney Tunes type.

Wasn't Fear Effect (on PSX) also cel-shaded in a way? That's a dark game, right?

 

[Teasy]

I just saw Zelda for the first time on a TV today. Its absolutely beautiful IMO, its like OOT but much smoother. The game is anything but bland, especially when all the effects get thrown around (fire ect).

Ozy, Metroid Prime is simply not bland, not having extremely high res textures and bump mapping does not make a game bland. Metroid Prime has wonderfully detailed environments, just admit that and don't try to support your previous, far to hasty, opinion of it now that you know better.

 

[Goldni]

Well guys what I ment by "level design" was 'cleverly' designed levels with powerups and secrets and cool objectives etc. Like how MP makes you want to keep going (just like all Zelda games). Like hey there's a ledge with a door up there.hhmmm..how do I get there? Hey there's a powerup..how'd I mess that?

I love that kind of stuff. You know, not just going through a level and bloweing things up..opening a door and blowing more things up and so on.

 

[Ozymandis]

Ozymandis:

Could you name a cel-shaded game you like the look of?

Jojo's Bizarre Adventure 2, Auto modellista, Jet Grind Radio, XIII, and Gungrave, for starters.

Of course, it's more of an artistic thing than a graphical thing. Most cel-shaded games aren't totally drawn the same; the characters stick out like a sore thumb.[/img]

 

[Ozymandis]

Ozy, Metroid Prime is simply not bland, not having extremely high res textures and bump mapping does not make a game bland. Metroid Prime has wonderfully detailed environments, just admit that and don't try to support your previous, far to hasty, opinion of it now that you know better.

It's not really bland as a whole. I'm just commenting that it doesn't really take advantage of any of the niftier texturing effects that the Gamecube can do, and so to me looks very "vanilla"...

 

[cybamerc]

Ozymandis:

> Jojo's Bizarre Adventure 2, Auto modellista, Jet Grind Radio, XIII, and
> Gungrave, for starters.

Well... now I'm confused. Auto modellista, Jet Grind Radio and XIII don't have cel-shaded backgrounds either. It must be something else that makes you hate on Zelda.... what could it be, what could it be?

 

[V3]

Well... now I'm confused. Auto modellista, Jet Grind Radio and XIII don't have cel-shaded backgrounds either. It must be something else that makes you hate on Zelda.... what could it be, what could it be?

Consider also most cartoon doesn't have cel-shaded backgrounds either.

I think he just doesn't like it, since Link looks really odd.

As for me, I hate the change to Celda, but as for Celda it self, I think I can live with it.

 

[Ozymandis]

Well... now I'm confused. Auto modellista, Jet Grind Radio and XIII don't have cel-shaded backgrounds either. It must be something else that makes you hate on Zelda.... what could it be, what could it be?

Ooops cybamerc. Looks like you need to read more closely-

Of course, it's more of an artistic thing than a graphical thing.

is what I said. Don't trip over your own feet (and biases) in your haste

I still feel the same way about those other cel-shaded games as well. But from what I see in Celda, it's more "jarring" somehow... the characters look so rich, and the backgrounds lack any kind of personality. I guess that the intent of this is to call attention to the characters, and that's cool... but in a game with character models as hideous as Celda, it really grates on me more than in a game like Jet Set Radio Future, where the models are attractive to me.

Make any sense? I've never made a secret out of my digust for the look of Celda's character design

 

[V3]

me more than in a game like Jet Set Radio Future, where the models are attractive to me.

Wow, I always thought JSR have ugly characters.

 

[cybamerc]

Ozymandis:

You said:

I guess I have a beef with cel-shaded games that don't use cel-shaded backgrounds as well as characters...

You can change your story as many times as you like but that comment still stands

 

[Ozymandis]

Ozymandis:

You said:

I guess I have a beef with cel-shaded games that don't use cel-shaded backgrounds as well as characters...

You can change your story as many times as you like but that comment still stands

It does still stand. I would prefer that cel-shaded games used both cel-shaded characters and cel-shaded, realtime-lit worlds... but some cel-shaded games still look good even without that.

On that note, I can't think of any cel-shaded games that are totally cel-shaded...

Wow, I always thought JSR have ugly characters.

*shrug*

I like them. JSRF's designs are better than the original's, I think, but even the original ones looked pretty cool to me.