Dave Baumann: Will ATI still go for the Xbox2 contract...

[CeiserSöze]

Ah... but that still doesn't address the issue of what will happen if the specs for the next gpu from Nintendo/MS are extremely similar? Even if they are using seperate teams and each team wouldn't share information which each other, wouldn't the one(MS or Nintendo) with the ArtX team likely to end up with a better gpu?? Wouldn't that still be some sort of conflict of interest?

Yes, that could be a problem.
Still I think that Nintendo's requirements differ quite a bit from Microsoft's: Nintendo wants something cheap (but with the best possible price/performance-ratio so they'll still be able to compete on a technical level - e.g. a Flipper-like design with eDRAM) while Microsoft wants something as fast as possible regardless of its price (the "NV2A-approach"). So maybe conflicts of interest can easily be avoided because of the different requirements posed by the two companies.

 

[RaolinDarksbane]

Kinda makes you really think that MS is likely to completely dominate the console market if they are willing to lose even more money before they can start breaking even with XBOX1 huh?

 

[CeiserSöze]

Kinda makes you really think that MS is likely to completely dominate the console market if they are willing to lose even more money before they can start breaking even with XBOX1 huh?

It's the only option Microsoft has in this case (and the company's strenght - no one has more money to waste... pardon: invest than MS). If they weren't willing to lose such ridiculous ammounts of money (ok, it's only pocket money for MS) they wouldn't stand a chance against the established competitors in this market.

 

[Jabjabs]

I personally thin that MS and Nintendo will both go with the same chip however at diffrent clock rates and RAM speeds + diffrent software enviroments, that would be enough to make them two diffrent machines.

 

[megadrive0088]

I disagree. I think MS will get a PC-based DX10 or DX11 VPU, one that's slightly modified for extra performance. while Nintendo gets something completely custom, built from the ground up, that's compatable with Flipper and just OpenGL 2.0, with more eDRAM this time (probably less than i would like though, like Flipper)

 

[Dural]

What would they do if the more expensive chip for MS ended up being slower?

 

[jvd]

What would they do if the more expensive chip for MS ended up being slower?

what if ms and nintendo want the exact same graphics card and the exact same cpu. What if they make the exact same system to compete against sony . I know i said this in a previous post but no one seems to answer me

 

[V3]

What would they do if the more expensive chip for MS ended up being slower?

Someone, somewhere will laugh

what if ms and nintendo want the exact same graphics card and the exact same cpu.

Then it will be cost saving for either ATI, NVIDIA, Intel or AMD. Maybe Nintendo and MS next system will be compatible with each other. With MS offering something like Q.

Than the question would be, who went third party ?

 

[jvd]

What would they do if the more expensive chip for MS ended up being slower?

Someone, somewhere will laugh

what if ms and nintendo want the exact same graphics card and the exact same cpu.

Then it will be cost saving for either ATI, NVIDIA, Intel or AMD. Maybe Nintendo and MS next system will be compatible with each other. With MS offering something like Q.

Than the question would be, who went third party ?

neither. Nintendo could make the kiddy version . Nothing big more compact mabye a dvd player with a small hardrive. ms can make the big one with a huge hardrve tivo type deal. Dvd player out of the box not really portable. Broadband built in. That type of stuff

 

[epicstruggle]

I disagree. I think MS will get a PC-based DX10 or DX11 VPU, one that's slightly modified for extra performance. while Nintendo gets something completely custom, built from the ground up, that's compatable with Flipper and just OpenGL 2.0, with more eDRAM this time (probably less than i would like though, like Flipper)

I think this is the most reasonable outcome.

later,

 

[ToxicTaZ]

X-BOX-2 = Nvidia NV40b & MS DX-10+

MS X-BOX-2 = Nvidia NV40b & MS DX-10+ (& Some MS DX-11?)

Nintendo Next System! = Ati R400 (2005) E3

 

[jvd]

Re: X-BOX-2 = Nvidia NV40b & MS DX-10+

MS X-BOX-2 = Nvidia NV40b & MS DX-10+ (& Some MS DX-11?)

Nintendo Next System! = Ati R400 (2005) E3

toxic what are you smoking . The r400 should be ready this year. Why in gods name will they use it in a console in 2005 when its already 2 years old ????? No nintendo will go with the r550 or mabye the rv500.. if the r600s aren't ready. Prob made at the .13 or .09 micron and then droped to a smaller mircon later on in the consoles life. Who knows nintendo may want to out pace everyone and use a dual ati chip. I'm not sure off the top of my head but i'm sure a dual r350 would be close to 700gflops. I'm sure that a dual r500 would break the 1tflop area.

 

[cybamerc]

The R400 is also being developed by ATI's east coast team which I very much doubt will be Nintendo's primary development partner (it may offer some insight if ATI doesn't get the Xbox contract).

 

[CeiserSöze]

The Nintendo-technology will likely be developed by the west coast team. These are the same people who did the Flipper and the N64 graphics chip (when they were still at SGI) and Nintendo has a very strong relation with them.

 

[London Geezer]

Re: X-BOX-2 = Nvidia NV40b & MS DX-10+

MS X-BOX-2 = Nvidia NV40b & MS DX-10+ (& Some MS DX-11?)

Nintendo Next System! = Ati R400 (2005) E3

toxic what are you smoking . The r400 should be ready this year. Why in gods name will they use it in a console in 2005 when its already 2 years old ????? No nintendo will go with the r550 or mabye the rv500.. if the r600s aren't ready. Prob made at the .13 or .09 micron and then droped to a smaller mircon later on in the consoles life. Who knows nintendo may want to out pace everyone and use a dual ati chip. I'm not sure off the top of my head but i'm sure a dual r350 would be close to 700gflops. I'm sure that a dual r500 would break the 1tflop area.

not to burst you bubble, but how much are you ready to spend on a console with not one R500, but 2.... plus everything else...... considering the R500 will be quite new at the time of release.... if they do put 2 or more GPU's then they willn ot be *the latest* GPU's..... but maybe its just me.....

 

[megadrive0088]

The Nintendo-technology will likely be developed by the west coast team. These are the same people who did the Flipper and the N64 graphics chip (when they were still at SGI) and Nintendo has a very strong relation with them.

indeed.

I'm confident that Nintendo will order a chip designed for its own needs & goals. it wont be a R500, RV500, R550, etc. it'll be a totally custom chip with some performance/features areas that surpass R5XX - the Nintendo GPU will be based on the ideas of Flipper, only extended 100x or perhaps 200x beyond Gamecube's Flipper, much like Flipper was 100x beyond N64's graphics. there is no doubt Nintendo will keep its relationship with the former SGI, turned ArtX, turned ATI engineers.

No way in hell would Nintendo use R400 or any of its derivatives. they'll be far too old for Nintendo's console which is coming in late 2005, more likely 2006. even R500 would be too old, even though Nintendo will get a highly custom chip not based on the Radeon lines as i mentioned.

if anyone is going to use duel R500s or R550s, it would be MS's XBoxNext.
they'll need that kind of power to contend with PS3.

 

[Panajev2001a]

even if they used the same GPU, the systems would be TOTALLY different...

One would use a x86 CPU with next-generation PC architecture, the other would use a PPC/SPARC/MIPS CPU ( covering all possible choices with a derivate of the PPC 970 being a likely candidate ) with custom bus architecture, custom RAM ( NEC has experience with actual e-DRAM "manufacturing" )...

 

[jvd]

Re: X-BOX-2 = Nvidia NV40b & MS DX-10+

MS X-BOX-2 = Nvidia NV40b & MS DX-10+ (& Some MS DX-11?)

Nintendo Next System! = Ati R400 (2005) E3

toxic what are you smoking . The r400 should be ready this year. Why in gods name will they use it in a console in 2005 when its already 2 years old ????? No nintendo will go with the r550 or mabye the rv500.. if the r600s aren't ready. Prob made at the .13 or .09 micron and then droped to a smaller mircon later on in the consoles life. Who knows nintendo may want to out pace everyone and use a dual ati chip. I'm not sure off the top of my head but i'm sure a dual r350 would be close to 700gflops. I'm sure that a dual r500 would break the 1tflop area.

not to burst you bubble, but how much are you ready to spend on a console with not one R500, but 2.... plus everything else...... considering the R500 will be quite new at the time of release.... if they do put 2 or more GPU's then they willn ot be *the latest* GPU's..... but maybe its just me.....

How much do you think a cell chip with 64 megs or on die ram going to cost ? Besides they will get them very chip from ati cheap as hell. If nintendo sells 5 million consoles that would mean ati sold 10million of those chips. Not bad for ati.

Also it has been said many times that the teams were split up among themselves. Where some of ati is with some or artx and vic versa .

 

[Panajev2001a]

I do not see Nintendo spending too much R&D money on their next GPU ( they will have to a bit as ATI will not give them the chip as cheap as Art-X did... ), neither do I see ATI making too much of a special price for Nintendo...

 

[jvd]

I do not see Nintendo spending too much R&D money on their next GPU ( they will have to a bit as ATI will not give them the chip as cheap as Art-X did... ), neither do I see ATI making too much of a special price for Nintendo...

well if they go with one of ati's pc chips they should get it cheap as ati would have already spent the money on r&d. Also the artx deal with nintendo is very profitable for ati...