Baseless Next Generation Rumors with no Technical Merits [post E3 2019, pre GDC 2020] [XBSX, PS5]

[PSman1700]

Making next-gen console gamers lives a living hell! As they silently fap in shame to the awesomeness of my computer rigs, while slowly dying inside wondering about the premium models they could of had from the start.

It can't get worse hardware wise then the PS4/Xone was, can it? Those had low to mid hardware but they weren't bad consoles for that at all. The PS4 did a much better job then the PS3 did, we got great games already so far, and the gen isn't even done yet. Many games to come and i'm sure some next-gen games will be on PS4 too.
You can have a console for it's exclusives and the PC for anything else, killer combo.

 

[MrFox]

Console Gamers: The average consumer doesn’t care about specs…

In the same breath later,

Console Gamers: The premium models will have better specs, leaving the base model specs gimped.

………………………………………………………………………………………………..

Console Gamers: Consumers should have lots of choices.

In the same breath later,

Console Gamers: Launching an entry-level and pro-level model are bad for consumers.

………………………………………………………………………………………………..

Console Gamers: The average consumer isn’t going to pay over $399 for a game console…

In the same breath later,

Console Gamers: The premium models ($499-$699) will hinder base models sales because, the average consumer will feel confused on what to choose.

………………………………………………………………………………………………..

Console gamers in a nutshell...

It looks like a lot of cognitive dissonance that way, but it's not always the same posters with one opinion versus the other, and there are many distinct contexts from individual posters.

1. What the poster personally wish for and would buy
2. Some opinions about the best business decision to gain the most user base
3. A prediction of what the company will do based on past track record
4. An exploration of what would be the possible dual sku solutions
5. Expressing doubt about the credibility of the dual sku rumor

For example: I wish next gen had a high power sku sold at a heavy loss I'd be happy about it, and I think it's a bad business move making the division unprofitable or diverting game dev funding, and I predict they won't do that because they haven't played the loss leader for over a decade now. I can't believe the dual sku rumor because the source haven't shown enough credibility and it's an extraordinary claim. I also explored multiple solutions including low power addition, high power addition, portable sku, rolling gen, small difference vs big gap, same silicon, two silicon, etc... with very different opinions about each.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

It can't get worse hardware wise then the PS4/Xone was, can it? Those had low to mid hardware but they weren't bad consoles for that at all. The PS4 did a much better job then the PS3 did, we got great games already so far, and the gen isn't even done yet. Many games to come and i'm sure some next-gen games will be on PS4 too.
You can have a console for it's exclusives and the PC for anything else, killer combo.

The current generation consoles are certainly fantastic in terms of performance versus price and quality of software. However, it's interesting to look at the sales trends when compared to PS3/X360.

XBO has basically been slightly better than the X360 up until Kinect launched while PS4 has performed significantly better than PS3 across the board up until now. I expect XBO to trail X360 sales quite significantly from this point on especially considering the Project Scarlett announcement.

However, it's possible that they are also tailing off much faster than PS3/X360 did. This past August showed a rather dramatic and large drop off in consumer spending (at least in the US) on video game hardware and software. August has always been a slow month for console sales, which makes the drop all the more eye-opening, IMO.

Of course, any analysis of something like that is going to be complicated by the fact that both Sony and MS have announced a new console which likely comes out next year. That said, console hardware was already showing signs of slowing last year prior to the announcements.

Another interesting way to look at this is that while it might be possible that PS4-P kept some PS4 players from moving to PC and XBO-X gave people a reason to get an Xbox (IE - Xbox sales would have been significantly worse off without the XBO-X at this point in its life cycle), they didn't do much to extend the life of this generation of consoles. Although I guess XBO-X possibly preventing the Xbox platform from becoming irrelevant extended it's life somewhat.

Regards,
SB

 

[iroboto]

I think it's price led, with a skew based on performance. There's a launch price rather than a launch performance target, and the best hardware is picked for that. If an opportunity comes up for more hardware, like PS4's RAM boost, it's weighed in terms of long-term cost.

We see some examples of poor decision making in flopped consoles. Sega panicking regards Saturn's design and 3DO setting out to be the the ultimate console and hang the price. You cannot get past the maximum price people will spend for a product so that has to be your starting point for a product, and once you've done that, screwing around with the formula too much is a recipe for disaster.

Agreed. There are upper limits to what the consumer will pay and I'm sure a majority of the 'builds that aren't green lighted' are all sprinkled around a price point between 399-499. But isn't this also where we factor in subsidy if required?

 

[iroboto]

Another interesting way to look at this is that while it might be possible that PS4-P kept some PS4 players from moving to PC and XBO-X gave people a reason to get an Xbox (IE - Xbox sales would have been significantly worse off without the XBO-X at this point in its life cycle), they didn't do much to extend the life of this generation of consoles. Although I guess XBO-X possibly preventing the Xbox platform from becoming irrelevant extended it's life somewhat.

If there was no xbox one x. I'm not sure if I'd be a very happy xbox customer right now. So the mid-ten refresh did change things, but perhaps evidently all it did was support the axiom that the consoles launched significantly too weak to last 6-7 years.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

If there was no xbox one x. I'm not sure if I'd be a very happy xbox customer right now. So the mid-ten refresh did change things, but perhaps evidently all it did was support the axiom that the consoles launched significantly too weak to last 6-7 years.

And that's only going to get more and more common for the foreseeable future for consoles unless there's some kind of paradigm shift in how computing chips are manufactured. After a while all the low hanging fruit (like molasses slow storage medium speeds) will be addressed. CPU cores are finally using top of the line architectures now, so by the time 6 or so years go by, we'll be lucky to see a 25-50% increase in CPU speed unlike the move from Jaguar to Zen cores.

We're basically in a downward spiral of diminishing returns WRT to computing devices unless something drastically changes.

Regards,
SB

 

[wco81]

Cerny gave interview with Wired about the PS5.

https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2019...-coming-in-2020-reveals-new-hardware-details/

Key takeaways:

- Hardware ray tracing
- haptics controller designed like the dual shock
- launch before holidays 2020
- 100 GB optical disc format, NOT UHD Blu Ray. Unclear if that means the drive won't be compatible with UHD BD movies.
- fast load with SSD. Spiderman went from 19 seconds loading on PS4 to 1 second on a prototype with SSD.

I'm sure it will do well enough but with MS launching at the same time, price becomes important as well as games lineup.

These seem all like incremental improvements on the same paradigm. You can't blame Sony for sticking with what was wildly successful on the PS4. But you have to wonder if the paradigm of asset-heavy games on fastest hardware they can produce for $400 or 500 will continue to work, now with games subscription services and more gaming being done on mobile or handheld devices every year.

 

[Globalisateur]

Cerny gave interview with Wired about the PS5.

https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2019...-coming-in-2020-reveals-new-hardware-details/

Key takeaways:

- Hardware ray tracing
- haptics controller designed like the dual shock
- launch before holidays 2020
- 100 GB optical disc format, NOT UHD Blu Ray. Unclear if that means the drive won't be compatible with UHD BD movies.
- fast load with SSD. Spiderman went from 19 seconds loading on PS4 to 1 second on a prototype with SSD.

I'm sure it will do well enough but with MS launching at the same time, price becomes important as well as games lineup.

These seem all like incremental improvements on the same paradigm. You can't blame Sony for sticking with what was wildly successful on the PS4. But you have to wonder if the paradigm of asset-heavy games on fastest hardware they can produce for $400 or 500 will continue to work, now with games subscription services and more gaming being done on mobile or handheld devices every year.

Better read the source instead of a bad copy, here Playstation Twitter:

PlayStation 5 launches holiday 2020

Wired:

Either way, physical games for the PS5 will use 100-GB optical disks, inserted into an optical drive that doubles as a 4K Blu-ray player.

 

[BRiT]

But is it a 4K UHD Blu-Ray player?

 

[wco81]

Well I was speculating on UHD Blu Ray movies. Since they cheapened out and didn't provide UHD Blu Ray playback with the PS4 Pro, you have to wonder if they will continue with the PS5.

Before holiday could be late as November. I would guess they would want product on the shelves before BF at least.

 

[temesgen]

Well I was speculating on UHD Blu Ray movies. Since they cheapened out and didn't provide UHD Blu Ray playback with the PS4 Pro, you have to wonder if they will continue with the PS5.

Before holiday could be late as November. I would guess they would want product on the shelves before BF at least.

They could easily make buyers purchase a license to read UHD disk, the drive off the shelf will likely use a proprietary format for gaming.

 

[cheapchips]

They could easily make buyers purchase a license to read UHD disk, the drive off the shelf will likely use a proprietary format for gaming.

Xbox essentially does this. You have to download the Blu-ray & dvd players. It's free, but everyone not downloading them is saving MS licencing costs.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Xbox essentially does this. You have to download the Blu-ray & dvd players. It's free, but everyone not downloading them is saving MS licencing costs.

PS4 did this for both DVD and Blu-ray playback capability and I believe PS3 did it too.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

PS3 had playback built in. Considering it was a key selling point and naysayers said the only reason it was selling as a cheap BRD player, silly not to!

 

[Tkumpathenurple]

PS4 did this for both DVD and Blu-ray playback capability and I believe PS3 did it too.

Shifty's right about the PS3 coming with playback by default. I don't remember the PS4 requiring a download for the Blu-Ray playback. Are you 100% positive?

Please note, 99.86% certainty is woefully inadequate and will bring great shame upon your family.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Shifty's right about the PS3 coming with playback by default. I don't remember the PS4 requiring a download for the Blu-Ray playback. Are you 100% positive?

On PS3 no, it was 12 years ago, haha! On PS4, yes!

 

[ultragpu]

And for the love of god please support Dolby Atmos and DTS:X Sony, all those TFs and raytraced sound but skimp on audio output format support is simply criminal.

 

[AlNom]

maybe they can do a 18+2 and dedicate 2 DCUs to audio tracing.

 

[MrFox]

balanced at 18?

 

[AlNom]