AbsoluteBeginner
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Seems like AMD has booked the shit out of 7nm waffers at TSMC. Next year Apple is moving to 5nm and with console designs, AMD will become biggest TSMC customer.
Baseless Next Generation Rumors with no Technical Merits [post E3 2019, pre GDC 2020] [XBSX, PS5]
- Thread starter BRiT
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I agree with you. It a lot of statements that can be taken either way you want them to. We can believe vague insiders or we can believe accidentally leaked numbers from the manufacturer. That's not to say things can't change like clocks and maybe there is another SOC out there that hasn't been leaked, but I'll go with the actual leaked numbers.
Redundant design cost for RT based Navi on 7nm and 7nm+ makes no sense.
AMD would be undergoing additional design costs and passing that unnecessary cost off to Sony and MS if the chips were on two different nodes.
The best situation for AMD, Sony and MS is that all the effort poured into PS, Xbox and PC RDNA+ products goes into the same basic design on a single node.
This isn't the early 2000 days where you can quickly flip to a newer node and realize a substantial cost savings. MS and Sony are going to be stuck with their initial node for quite a while. Jumping to newer enhanced nodes aren't going to bring significant costs savings. Sony nor MS have made use of the enhanced nodes (11/12nm) of 14/16nm for the PS4 or the One (outside of the transition from 28nm) where costs are cheaper versus 7nm. And 5nm isn't going to be cheap and will probably remain prohibitively expensive until its super mature.
This is why I opine that 7nm EUV makes sense. Take upfront the power saving and 17% greater density and move to 5nm when it makes sense.
No. I assure you they won't.
there is a misunderstanding on what MS is trying to accomplish with Series X. Spectators looking in are lacking the creativity to understand the business goals of MS with respect to what they want to accomplish with Series X. The answer is that if they manage to hit 12TF for release silicon, it will hit _their_ business objectives. It's not about besting Sony. Once people understand that, you'll understand why this whole discussion about who will have more power is nothing more than a projection of fans hoping to come out on top.
It's nothing to do with business decisions that Sony and MS are looking to achieve. Sony might be all about their console; but MS has a much wider berth of products. People need to think outside the box a little more (and look at their course as a company for all of their products) when coming to understand why MS makes the decisions that they do.
Microsoft will have their very own exclusives though
HBM is off the table, so is ReRam and exotic RT and SSD hardware. NVME, GDDR6 (just 16GB of it), and AMD's RT solution.
Yeah everyone keep their PS4's so adoption will be next to nothing. Most of those 100 million will be left with PS4 base units for some years i guess.
Oh there we have him again, lol.
Sounds about right. He has proven nothing. We have specs and DF believe it, i don't see DF taking up Klee, thank god.
Total denial i see, nothing more.
Lol wtf, then what the hell does he know about technical specs of those next gen consoles?
He can be smarter then that, since he himself isn't even the leaker, he can blame his 'friend' and say he had it all wrong. 13+TF people will be unhappy but they cant blame Klee, ever.
AMD themselfs already showed in a slide that next generation consoles will be 7nm.
We're sinking to resetera level with this Klee even being mentioned here. B3D is a technical forum, where we like to discuss baseless specs, not 'oh it's powerfull' or 'it's more powerfull'. He has come with nothing.
It about business yes, but it's also about the brand, for many years, people think Xbox=powerful console, so that's why many people disappointed about XB1, and few years later MS release XB1X even it need to be $499 to break even the cost.
Even PS5 is just slight edge(say 5%), and 3rd devs don't give a crap about it aka just make every games looks same for both console, i can promise you can see many people will still unhappy with it again.
Plus it's not like they need to boost it by a lot to match PS5, unlike the PS4 vs XB1.
This Xbox Series X is for the brand image even more than being best seller.
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Are you for real?
AbsoluteBeginner
Regular
Decision on RAM type or amount has been different since forever. Only time it started tobconverge was Pro/XBX. On the other hand, last 3 times Sony and MS released their consoles they were always on same node.
Of course, there is always a chance for it not to be, but considering what we know about them and the fact that there are dev kits with actual silicon inside, I'd say there is 99% chance they are using N7P process.
I think he mean Sony will use 7nm+ and MS will use 7nm just like Sony use GDDR5 and MS use DDR3.
AbsoluteBeginner
Regular
It's not always better.
20nm was a worse choice than 28nm, the consoles skipped it entirely.
Right now any EUV is expemsive, not high enough volume, and whoever wants it will pay a lot more for it. So it might be much less expensive to spend a bit more on cooling than trying to compete against apple for the available EUV volume.
We might see 7nm+ being skipped for a 5nm or 3nm slim revision, by then the EUV mask issues might be solved, and they'll have much more powerful frickin lazer beams.
AbsoluteBeginner
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I'm wondering how much info developers have gotten back in the beginning of this year compared to Durango/Oberon and 360/PS3 years? Because, with PS4 Pro, developers got actual documentation fairly late (compared to gens before). I am wondering if they got target specs with actual hardware ins and out ~2 years before actual release of the console or will these be going out right about now.
I suppose with the state of simulation and tools now, they can release it much later then it was the case in history.
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