Alternative distribution to optical disks : SSD, cards, and download*

Discussion in 'Console Technology' started by Cheezdoodles, May 26, 2008.

  1. AlphaWolf

    AlphaWolf Specious Misanthrope
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    I'm sorry, Considering you're all just pulling numbers out of your asses I thought I would play along.
     
  2. corduroygt

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  3. corduroygt

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    Look at prices yourself:
    http://www.dramexchange.com/
     
  4. corduroygt

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    So now you've lost 100 points (a buck or so), 50 cents, and then there's the issue of reprogramming thousands of flash. It's not feasible.
     
  5. AlphaWolf

    AlphaWolf Specious Misanthrope
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    what does that have to do with anything?

    I was referring to -tkf- and the nonsense that $5 cost = $15 at retail.

    ps3 was $2500 retail at launch amirite?
     
  6. eastmen

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    of course its feesible thats just silly talk on your part.


    Look instead of a game sitting on shelves ready to be bought used for a few bucks and take a sale from a newer title the flash nand can be reporgramed for a new game. Yea your out 100 points if your MS but if the flash and programing costs $5 you may come out ahead by using the already produced flash nand
     
  7. corduroygt

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    I don't share his sentiment that $5=$15-20, it'll be $10 at most, and that'd be due to prices ending with 9.99 being more effective than those ending at 4.99.

    However, I was showing pricing for flash and it's more than $10 per 8GB, and that's without the case, PCB, assembly, and programming, without even getting into retail overhead.
     
  8. AlphaWolf

    AlphaWolf Specious Misanthrope
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    Good thing its still not 2014 when the price will be 1/4 of that. If they can ship carts for DS and make money, they can do the same for a home console.
     
  9. corduroygt

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    I wouldn't be so sure and 8GB won't be enough for next gen to begin with. There's still the assembly, programming, etc. DS carts are sold at $40 despite the fact that they're 512MB at most and usually 64-128MB, and the development costs for DS are very low. They use carts because that makes sense for a handheld, when home console does not have portability or battery life requirements. If they could get away with using discs in the DS, they definitely would.
     
  10. AlphaWolf

    AlphaWolf Specious Misanthrope
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    Why wouldn't you be so sure? Did intel just scrub all future shrinks off of their roadmap? Toshiba and Samsung (and others) are all expanding production.

    What do you think you get when you buy flash? A pile of transistors that you have to assemble? The packaging costs should be pretty flat, certainly more easily absorbed in a $60 game than a $40 game.

    Just because home consoles don't run on battery or get carried around doesn't mean power and size aren't meaningful to shipping and production costs.
     
  11. eastmen

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    3ds has carts up to 8GB and launch titles will be using 2GB at the $40 price point. DS games used up to 512MB carts as you say and nintendo titles sell for $35 on the platform. So at launch nintendo feels that a 4 times increase in data storage only costs them $5 or less and they also have quite a large graphical leap going from better than n64 graphics to better than gamecube/wii graphics .


    So i don't see the problem is MS goes from $60 to $65 or $70 to include flash in what will most likely be another 2 years before the console hits the scene


    As for dram exchange we don't know how many layers or middle men are included in those prices nor what process it is.

    MS would be buying flash memory in the tens of millions each year and will get way better prices than whats seen on dram exchange
     
  12. Squilliam

    Squilliam Beyond3d isn't defined yet
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    Dram exchange average price for a 2GB SD card is $3.90
    Newegg sells said 2GB SD cards from $4.90

    Dram exchange average price for 2GB DDR3 sticks are at $16.50
    Newegg sells said 2GB sticks from $19.90

    Now is there seriously *only* a 20% margin from manufacture to delivery to Newegg? That includes everyones margins, costs, taxes in between.
     
  13. -tkf-

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    So you do admit that $5 dollars at manufacturing is not just $5 dollars added to the cost of games?

    That took some time :)

    And this is still with you claiming that it´s only $5 dollars more to manufacture a 25GB game on a cartridge compared to SL Blu-Ray. Which is still very positive thinking and what i would consider an average size for the next gen games.

    One thing that should be remembered here is that this is high profit stuff. Comparing this to stuff where there is an intense price competition is wrong. When i was selling Console games the markup was "stupid" high and that was the case for the whole chain, the distributor made some good profit as well.

    Since then the prices just went up.

    That was the reason for my "nonsense" real life experience. Of course, is might be the case that Microsoft, Sony or Nintendo would decide to eat the extra price for a cartridge future but i can safely say, that any cost that starts at the bottom grows quite a lot during the distribution to the actual shop.
     
  14. -tkf-

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    This

    And this

    makes for an interesting question, where do you pull from? :)

    Everyone in here is guestimating you included, your ass, our ass.. it´s all from the ass then.
     
  15. AlphaWolf

    AlphaWolf Specious Misanthrope
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    No. I'd explain but its already been done numerous times in this thread and you've not bothered to read them.

    And for cost reductions, try looking at a process road map.
     
  16. -tkf-

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    If it´s been discussed many times then it shouldn´t be a problem to point it out once again, or maybe it´s been discussed many times and it´s you that comes to the same conclusion everytime which doesn´t have to be true.

    As for cost reductions , sure they are bound to happen, but anyone claiming to know exactly how much they are gonna be and know exactly that they are gonna be true within the next years is.. using that thing again to pull out facts.

    And besides all this, games are way to expensive as it is today, the console makers should be focusing on making next gen games cheaper.
     
  17. AlphaWolf

    AlphaWolf Specious Misanthrope
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    Learn to read. Where the hell did I ever suggest anything exact?

    Uh... too expensive for who? Sales data doesn't support that pricing this gen has been a major problem.
     
  18. Silent_Buddha

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    Like ditching traditional retail 1 game = 1 media game distribution?

    There really isn't anything else that could possibly make next gen games cheaper. Well I suppose if console manufacturers mandated 320x200 as the maximum allowed resolution, game developement would suddenly get a lot cheaper. :lol:

    Regards,
    SB
     
  19. -tkf-

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    Was a response to cost on carts, i think that is you claiming to know "exactly" what the price will be in 2014

    No reason to get carried away, you hitting the red line with your last comments.. or "chill" as they say.

    And yes i think console games are to expensive i have to pay around $100 for a console game and around $60 for a PC game. While i personally have enough money to the games i want, i find that i am withholding on anything but stuff i am pretty certain i will like. Raising prices because of an expensive medium is not going to help.
     
  20. AlphaWolf

    AlphaWolf Specious Misanthrope
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    because 1/4 was intended as exact value in response to current DRAM prices... (that's sarcasm, because I know you will have missed that) if I wanted to give an exact value I'd have given an actual $ value.

    If that's the red line you have a tolerance issue, and you're going to run into often if you continue to misrepresent people's arguments.

    Doesn't really matter what an individual thinks, it matters what the market thinks. $60 at retail for this generation doesn't seem to have been a problem for game sales.
     
    #880 AlphaWolf, Feb 25, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 26, 2011
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