Zenimax vs Oculus Lawsuit

Discussion in 'VR and AR' started by Ike Turner, Feb 1, 2017.

  1. Ike Turner

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    Palmer Luckey not giving a fuck about the NDA he signed with Zenimax = $500M http://www.polygon.com/2017/2/1/14474198/oculus-lawsuit-verdict

    "Of the $500 million, Oculus is paying out $200 million for breaking the NDA and $50 million for copyright infringement. Oculus and Luckey each have to pay $50 million for false designation. And Iribe has to pay $150 million for the same, final count."
     
    #1 Ike Turner, Feb 1, 2017
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2017
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  2. hughJ

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    Do you have some personal attachment to this case that you aren't sharing? Because the way you've been axe-grinding over a case where the details aren't fully known seems weird to me.
     
  3. Ike Turner

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    Please tell me more about that....
    Thread title : "Rift, Vive, and Virtual Reality" Sub-Forum "VR and AR". The most prominent VR company is sued by one of the biggest game publisher for $4B and I post about it with my opinion on the case which, contrary to what you said, most of the details have been known about for years in part in Zenimax's court filings, Valve employees public statements, industry veterans chichat, the 100s of posts on the MTBS3D forums, friends of mine in the industry etc...I mean practically everything about this particular case was publically known to anyone who took the time to do a little research or who has been following VR in the past 5/6 years... THe outcome of the case is pointless in the grand scheme of things but it's always interesting to see how shady VC funding is. Same thing applies to Magic Leap who has recently been outed 2 months ago.
     
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  4. hughJ

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    If you knew practically everything about this case then I'm not entirely sure why you're having to use so much hyperbole to make your points, or having such difficulty calmly laying out which particular deeds were done by Oculus, Palmer, or other actors that you feel were ethically wrong, and what relevance those played in this particular trial. It seems to me to be an emotional reaction rather than a rational one.
     
  5. Ike Turner

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    You seem to be particularly hell-bent on trying to discern, for god knows what reason, my "emotions" here. Are you a shrink or something? http://www.psychforums.com/ would be a better place for these kind of discussions if that's what you are after. Anyway, feel free to continue to derail the thread or maybe send me an PM if you are that much interested about my "emotions" ?
     
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  6. xz321zx

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    Probably read this before you go there : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attribution_bias

    Well, it's known that Palmer was always scornful of megacorps in early days when he was a fledging internet sensation ,he has numerous tirade posts over at the now empty and devoid mtbs3d forums (where the "rift" was born) then when he met his new friends, his behaviour quickly tipped towards the opposite end, so afterall maybe it's him who deserves the scorn (big fuss, big FOMO & get rich in the process ),
    though Brendan Iribe doesn't seem like your ordinary VC ,he's a "programmer" , looks like he was co-founder of Scaleform (another sold company), makes you wonder if they became great friends with Palmer due to that apparent salesmanship skill.
     
    #6 xz321zx, Feb 2, 2017
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2017
  7. Silent_Buddha

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    So basically Oculus were found innocent of all charges brought on by Zenimax except for that involving the breaking of NDA.

    Looking at what was said on both sides. Zenimax contends that trade secrets were stolen. Oculus counters that Zenimax filed the lawsuit because they couldn't force Oculus into a partnership deal via threats. Yada yada.

    Yawn. Hopefully it's finally over although it appears that Oculus might appeal the NDA ruling, while Zenimax might attempt to file an injunction against further sales of the Oculus Rift. Neither of which I believe have a leg to stand on considering the rulings from this case.

    Regards,
    SB
     
  8. Ike Turner

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    Here's a good summary on how Valve totally screwed up by not making Oculus sign an NDA and how this whole VR investment craze spun out of control with the FB acquisition which lead to other shady stuff like Magic Leap's VC funding which at this point in time is looking more & more like a fraud (for some good laughs here's Magic Leap CEO spreading FUD about Microsoft's HoloLens just after its unveiling: here & here)

    Inside The Growing Rift Between Valve And Oculus

    The company who would have had the strongest case against Oculus would have been Valve..but they totally screwed up by not making Luckey sign anything (which Zenimax did and now got $500M for it).

    For some totally odd reason Carmack decided to defend himself on Facebook today by posting the following even though Oculus can still appeal the case & Zenimax is threatening an injunction (I'm fairly sure that Facebook legal team would have probably ordered/advised him to not say anything for the time being...especially given Zenimax's answer below):

    It didn't' take long for Zenimax's lawyers to release this following statement:

     
    #8 Ike Turner, Feb 2, 2017
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2017
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  9. ProspectorPete

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    Never seen such bad losers as Oculus and Carmack..
     
  10. Silent_Buddha

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    Zenimax isn't exactly smelling of roses here either. It's all up to personal preference who you want to believe. The Jury obviously sided with Oculus on most of the damaging claims that Zenimax brought in the case and awarded just 500 million USD out of the 2 billion USD that Zenimax was seeking. I wouldn't say there were any winners in this. Both Zenimax and Oculus won some and lost some. Zenimax for being greedy and Oculus for breaking NDA.

    Side rant, below.

    The funny thing here is that out of the 3 major VR players, Oculus and Sony are the main reasons that VR has any chance of success at all due to large monetary investments into game development. Valve only recently started a development fund, and it's absolutely miniscule compared to the money that Oculus and Sony are giving to developers. And you can tell by the quality of VR games being released on each platform. Developers for the most part can afford to develop for VR games in the same way they can for traditional gaming.

    Valve and HTC may make good hardware, but they are doing very little to actually try to make VR a success. And yet, Valve gets all the good publicity on PC among the internet plebs for doing almost nothing to make VR gaming a lasting thing.

    Regards,
    SB
     
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  11. ToTTenTranz

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    Facebook is actually starting to show signs of losing faith in Oculus, so those $500M may be already showing their marks.
    As for Valve, I don't get their attitude with hardware. The only thing they really held on to was the Steam controller and maybe Steam Link (though this last one is a bit of a low-effort product IMO).
    The Steam Machines were all way too expensive so I can only guess they tanked hard and no one hears from those anymore. Vive looks like it has 90% effort from HTC and 10% effort from Valve. They don't really make games anymore so one has to wonder if the company isn't simply being kept profitable due to Steam's sheer popularity.
    Gabe Newell said in the past that they would only develop new games when a new gaming platform/experience appeared that would justify the effort. The Vive was released almost a year ago and there's not even a hint for anything from Valve. There's that small Portal demo and that's it.
    Why the hell was Valve involved with the Vive if not to release system-seller games for the platform? They thought just making the Vive available to purchase through Steam would make it a success? As if they didn't learn that from Steam Machines before?

    To be honest, Sony is looking like the last bastion of VR. At least until those $300 headsets from Asus&Friends start coming out.
     
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  12. Ike Turner

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    Valve just announced this week that it is (for the first time in nearly 10 years) developing 3 new games (real games not experiences like The Lab)..and they are VR exclusive. Valve is also the biggest contributor to the VR platform with its OpenVR API which has also been brought to the Krhonos Group to become the industry standard...the notion that Valve isn't investing in VR is quite ridiculous given that they are actually the main driving force right with the most robust tracking tech, industry standard API. Oh and the HTC Vive (which is not 90% HTC 10% Valve at all..there are countless reports & articles published detailing how the partnership to place in a hurry once Oculus jump ship to Facebook with Valve's prototype..) has been outselling the Rift 2-1....
    Anyway...3 new Valve games in development...exclusive for VR..
     
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  13. ToTTenTranz

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    I had written that post about half a day before the 3 games news came up. Up until that point, Valve's commitment on VR was questionable at best.

    3 full games for VR is great! It'll definitely give a boost on VR's selling points.
     
  14. ProspectorPete

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    It's still a Valve promise though..
     
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  15. milk

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    3 games in development? Or is it a game with a "3" in the title in development? It can only possibly be that.
     
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  16. ProspectorPete

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    Apparently Carmack now remembers Zenimax owning him 22.5 million dollars..
     
  17. Rodéric

    Rodéric a.k.a. Ingenu
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    No, it seems he used his contractual right to sell his shares at a negociated price but ZeniMax refuses to honor the contract.
     
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  18. ProspectorPete

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    I don't trust the guy, but we'll see.
     
  19. Ike Turner

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    #19 Ike Turner, Mar 10, 2017
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2017
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  20. Silent_Buddha

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    Zenimax still hasn't paid for the purchase of iD Software? How is that even a thing?

    Regards,
    SB
     
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