cheapchips
Veteran
As leader of the Daleks, I guess you're literally driving round on pepperpot pedestal all day .
WTH with people putting one person in the pedestal? (HIDEO Kojima, Elon Musk, etc)
- Thread starter orangpelupa
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As leader of the Daleks, I guess you're literally driving round on pepperpot pedestal all day .
Oh! I remember that! That was nice. Hmm if I found the video I'll tweet it to kojima
Not sure what you mean by that, in the context of the half-sentence of mine that you quoted. I was referring to the incumbent space launch providers when SpaceX entered the marke, eg. ULA, Arianespace and Roscosmos, who would cheerfully charge $100M+ for a launch just because. They were the organisations that got to charge whatever they chose to charge.
If it helps, I'm not really trying to defend Musk here, personally I think he's a bit of a bell-end. Nevertheless SpaceX has managed to take established and emergent technology to upset the apple cart in the space launch industry and that is interesting.
cheapchips
Veteran
Seem to recall had an issue with Musk's ambition to do point to point passenger transport with Starship. It was a view based on a really bad and ill informed video. It's incredibly challenging, may never happen for a host of reasons, but cost won't be one of them.
green.pixel
Veteran
You are being very delusional if you think there was no outside funding (and other) help. There is around 5 billion of state subsidies and tax breaks and 5 billion in orders from gvt. institutions. He wasn't Trump's advisor for nothing. He has ties with the deep state, so do Amazon and Google.
https://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-hy-musk-subsidies-20150531-story.html
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/10/21/how...axpayer-money-have-helped-musk-and-tesla.html
I didn’t say he couldn’t accomplish this without resources. I didn’t say he couldn’t accomplish this without his team either.
where did I say that? People want to know why leaders are adored. There are roles that leaders must play. Coaches don’t play in the games, players do, so people should not respect Coaches? the trainers? The GMs?
The organization is a whole and will always be. In some industries the workers are praised and in others the leaders are.
good leaders will definitely bring to spotlight their team as being the reason for success. That doesn’t make them bad because people
Choose to praise the leader instead. You can’t stop the way people think. But instead of bitching about it; I want to add more perspectives on it.
shit comes across as heavy envy or something. Yea I get people hate musk. Doesn’t mean you can take any yahoo off the street give him a couple billion and they would be off building rockets and electric cars.
Be real. What did Notch do with his 2Billion When MS gave it to him? Buy a house that jayZ and Beyoncé wanted for 1 B.
most billionaires would spend their time and money doing something else. Far from trying to spend their time and money from trying to make a rocket company and electric car company. Start where all the Saudi princes are waging war and blinging their entire Mercedes in white gold. Buying super car after super car. Yachts and helicopters.
Any of them start anything of use to this world?
But okay. Musk is an asshole and narcissistic. So should we discredit his work?
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green.pixel
Veteran
Maybe someone else would be better at that role, it doesn't have to be off the street. We can't know that.
It's not hard to "compete" when you network allows you to sustain losses for years. That's not really competing in the proper sense, but bullying others in the space with a help of a vast safety net.
You’re trying to operate into heavily monopolized industries. What do you mean it’s not hard to compete ?
green.pixel
Veteran
Electric cars are not monopolized, not yet. What Musk's armchest allows is helping Tesla to become one.
So were Amazon's losses over the years allowing in the book selling and retail merchant fields.
Competing in the transportation sector where combustion engine is the monopoly. And quite possibly the deepest most entrenched industry there is (Oil and gas).
Would you really spend your time there as a billionaire to make more money?
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I don't think that there is any indication that Tesla has been set up to make a profit selling electric cars. Their production volumes are tiny and losses are still very large.
However, they have the brand name, the accumulated experience of problems which can arise and, most importantly, the technology and charging networks already set up.
At some point (my guess is within the next 5 to 10 years given the progress in battery development), the major car manufacturers are going to have to decide whether to buy out Tesla or make licensing deals for the charging network. That's when Musk's efforts in the electric car field will pay back the investors.
All IMO, of course.
Musk is, of course, a complete dick in most respects, but he is a canny businessman overall.
However, they have the brand name, the accumulated experience of problems which can arise and, most importantly, the technology and charging networks already set up.
At some point (my guess is within the next 5 to 10 years given the progress in battery development), the major car manufacturers are going to have to decide whether to buy out Tesla or make licensing deals for the charging network. That's when Musk's efforts in the electric car field will pay back the investors.
All IMO, of course.
Musk is, of course, a complete dick in most respects, but he is a canny businessman overall.
Silent_Buddha
Legend
There's always someone that can do things better. The problem isn't whether they can do it better. The question is them actually doing it.
I can't stand Elon Musk, but at least he got off his rear end and got the ball rolling. Plenty of other people had the opportunity and just sat there and did nothing.
Tesla may still be considered at the forefront of Electric vehicles in the western world, but Chinese EV makers already produces multiple times more electric vehicles than Tesla likely every will. Tesla still has the best selling car model (Tesla 3), but total vehicle shipments by Tesla are challenged by multiple EV makers in China who each manufacture large volumes of EVs.
If Chinese EV makers can successfully transition to shipping their vehicles globally, it would likely spell the eventual doom of Tesla or relegate them to just the upper market brackets (like Mercedes, BMW, Aston Martin, etc.).
If/when EVs ever overtake traditional petrol based vehicles, it isn't Tesla that the large automotive makers have to fear. It's all the vehicle makers in China.
Regards,
SB
Actually, it looks like Tesla will beat BYD this year regarding car shipments.
you must of missed the news, they made 143million dollar profit last quarter
And lost $700 million in the first quarter of the year. As long as they are in the luxury market only, they are going to struggle to recoup all the money spent over the years. Hence my view that they are ultaimtely looking to be bought out by one of the really big car manufacturers.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not criticising Tesla as they have most definitely promoted the electric car very well and their machines seem to be very good (as you'd expect, for the cost!). I just don't think that they are going to be able to roll out the lower priced cars quickly enough to become a major player in the market. Not sure they really want to, truth be told.
Silent_Buddha
Legend
I should have been more clear, I suppose. I meant that total car shipments by all Chinese manufacturer's is multiple times what Tesla ships. On top of that, multiple Chinese EV manufacturers compete with Tesla for the top spot.
Recent reductions in the amount of subsidies by the Chinese government impacted sales by Chinese EV makers, so I was curious whether Tesla would be able to regain the top spot for a manufacturer.
That said, Tesla sells to the world. Chinese EV makers, for the most part, only sell to China (there are a few exports but the bulk is in China). If Chinese EV makers were to export to most of the Western world, I'd expect to see a relatively large increase in their share of the market as they have a larger focus on affordable EVs than Tesla does. And that is needed if you really want to challenge the large auto makers.
Regards,
SB
Electrically maybe but the engineering in them is very inefficient there are a couple of teardown video's on youtube
Who can afford them?
the market cap numbers are all over the place depending on the date, but the only company that prolly could is Toyota (or maybe a german one if they team up), most places seem to agree it has the highest market cap of the USA car companies
current numbers, I just looked up
tesla Mkt cap64.60B
gm Mkt cap50.94B
uber Mkt cap48.60B
ford Mkt cap36.72B
