Web Browsing Confirmed For Revolution

[NANOTEC]

I do, very much, see the market for this. using the internet on Revolution could bring in millions of people in Japan who do not use the internet because they lack a PC or won't use one. provided that Revolution itself is successful.

Agreed. Also some points I want to make.

Browsing doesn't have to be at SD or ED resolution. You can surf the web at 1024x768 or higher on an ancient 2D videocard with 8MB of memory. Also since Nintendo said you'll be able to hook Revolution up to computer monitors out of the box, this would be very attractive for people who only game using monitors instead of tvs. In fact small LCD monitors are becoming very cheap and many people would rather use that than a big tv especially people in Japan who don't have much space to begin with.

Finally since Revolution also has USB ports, you can attach external storage devices as you please. I'm begining to really like what Nintendo is doing here. MS doesn't seem to want the Xbox360 to be called a stripped down PC just like they did the original Xbox, but Nintendo would be smart to exploit web browsing on Revolution. Since SONY's PS3 would have Linux preinstalled on the optional HDD, Nintendo could easily do the same. I wonder what OS Nintendo would choose though. How about Nintendows?

Also they could apply instant bootup using flash RAM too.

 

[Megadrive1988]

I am wondering if Nintendo will roll out a feature-packed "Nintendo Online" world network such as the so called
"Star Road" network that was rumored for Dolphin prior to the Spaceworld 2000 unveiling of the Gamecube.

 

[pc999]

I am wondering if Nintendo will roll out a feature-packed "Nintendo Online" world network such as the so called
"Star Road" network that was rumored for Dolphin prior to the Spaceworld 2000 unveiling of the Gamecube.

Can you give me more info on that, I dont knew about it.

Thanks in advance.

Those who have DSL or FTTH in their home and can plug Rev/DS in LAN/WiFi are most likely those who already use internet via PC anyway.

If they (or others) can get a cheap solution to provide that to user that will not be a problem( specially if it is in a boundle ). I mean as long as it does not become a (relatevely) high price to put it functional

 

[Rodéric]

Those who have DSL or FTTH in their home and can plug Rev/DS in LAN/WiFi are most likely those who already use internet via PC anyway.

Around here, we have ADSL modems with a cable & WiFi...
So someone having such a modem (and they are common) don't need to worry about having a WiFi Revolution or DS to connect to the web...

What I mean (since I'm not sure I'm clear) is that you can get an ISP just for your Revolution or DS if you wish, provided you get the correct modem, no need to have a computer.

 

[Sis]

...Err, am I the only person who do not see the point of this? Other than the Marketing bulletpoint potential advantage.

I mean, anyone who can take the Revolution online, must have a Wifi connection, and not a lot of folks would have a Wifi connection without a PC/Mac.
And why would those people pay for what is a free browser, on the PC, that is not going to be easy to use on a TV and with no keyboard?

If it was a free browser, I'd say, why not, it would not be specially useful, but at least it'd be a free function.

I don't see it either. It's not just web browsing, either. You need Flash support and SSL and DHTML and cookie support and audio and video playback. Basically, there's a moderate bar that an internet browser must hit for it to be even usable, let alone desired.

And as others have said, SDTV support for web browsing will be painful. I use my HTPC on my 720p TV set, and in fact I actually use Opera for this since they are really good about making websites usable in non-optimal viewing environment. But I couldn't imagine trying to do that at 480p...

 

[Farid]

Im pretty sure that all consoles would have the ability to perform at HD in 2D. As far as i know, games are SD only... so far. I know nothings been mentioned of this, it just doesnt seem unreasonable.

It'll depend of the eDRAM management on the Hollywood GPU.
If the GPU can render in tiles, then yes, I guess it could support HDTV resolutions, if it can't, then 2D or 3D it will be the same, ED/SDTV only.

But then again, if it can render in tiles, why would Nintendo precise that the console doesn't support HDTV resolutions? Sure 99% of the games might be EDTV compliant only, but they still could say that the Console is HD ready and that it's up to the developer.

 

[pc999]

Anyway most people will play it on a SD TV.

Anyway it should be able to render to main Ram, it wouldnt be the case here the buffer take too much space from game content.

 

[Ty]

Anyway most people will play it on a SD TV.

Anyway it should be able to render to main Ram, it wouldnt be the case here the buffer take too much space from game content.

Don't get us wrong. It's better to have it than not have it. But the potentially limited resolution really could hurt its usefulness.

 

[pc999]

Don't get us wrong. It's better to have it than not have it. But the potentially limited resolution really could hurt its usefulness.

But that is the error the, first thing you think is the problems that actual internet users will see, but eg: grand parents will not notice, ophra audience will not notice etc...

 

[Ty]

But that is the error the, first thing you think is the problems that actual internet users will see, but eg: grand parents will not notice, ophra audience will not notice etc...

No, you're the one making the error assuming that grandparents will be the only ones who would like to browse the web via Revolution.

 

[NANOTEC]

I don't see it either. It's not just web browsing, either. You need Flash support and SSL and DHTML and cookie support and audio and video playback. Basically, there's a moderate bar that an internet browser must hit for it to be even usable, let alone desired.

DS is getting a version of Opera that allows surfing the full internet except for flash only sites. You don't think Revolution is powerful enough to support flash? You also don't think Revolution is powerful enough to play audio/video?

And as others have said, SDTV support for web browsing will be painful. I use my HTPC on my 720p TV set, and in fact I actually use Opera for this since they are really good about making websites usable in non-optimal viewing environment. But I couldn't imagine trying to do that at 480p...

And who says it will only allow SD resolution browsing?

 

[pc999]

No, you're the one making the error assuming that grandparents will be the only ones who would like to browse the web via Revolution.

Not really, because one can easly think that most people that will use this isnt those that already use (extensively?) net on PCs , or those that find more comfortable or preferable to use it on Rev by some reason (eg see news about games in a couch can be much better than in a desk, at least for those without HDTVs), and given this tow conditions people will not notice or bother about its low rez.

Of curse I am assuming that it will not be as be as good as a PC (at least outside of a recreative use) even if it is only point and click, do have voice to text, etc... I doubt it can be as good and featured (eg. software wise ergo very limited possibilitys from what is possible normaly) as a PC use of it even if it do a good job on the basics.

 

[Ty]

Not really, because one can easly think that most people that will use this isnt those that already use (extensively?) net on PCs ,

1> I own quite a decent PC at home. I personlly would like the option to surf the web on my couch much in the same way I often like to play games on my couch instead of my PC. But if the resolution sucks, then it's not a viable option. That is, now you're assuming and justifying the limited resolution to "people that wouldn't care about it anyhow" and that's a shame.

2> Your statement above is quite the self-fulfilling prophecy. By this I mean, because the resolution sucks, only those that don't care about it will use it.

or those that find more comfortable or preferable to use it on Rev by some reason (eg see news about games in a couch can be much better than in a desk, at least for those without HDTVs),

You've just made my argument because it's not as if people are necessarily exclusive to one method of surfing the web. Again, it's not as if people WANT to be limited to PC-Surfing Only or Console-Surfing Only, but by not supporting useable browsing, they've curtailed this use period. Note that I was the first to bring up the hopeful possibility that browsing might be in HD anyhow so I am NOT assuming it is in SD.

 

[Sis]

DS is getting a version of Opera that allows surfing the full internet except for flash only sites. You don't think Revolution is powerful enough to support flash? You also don't think Revolution is powerful enough to play audio/video?

It's not about power. Note that you quote "flash only" sites, which I take to mean "flash is not supported".

And who says it will only allow SD resolution browsing?

I'm basing that on two thoughts: 1) That the majority of gamers are on SD sets, so it's a statement of commonality and 2) Nintendo has stated they don't support HD resolutions. However, as I noted and will make a stronger point of: Opera does a very good job of handling non-optimal resolutions. But at SD resolutions, you will still have a non-optimal experience.

 

[NANOTEC]

It's not about power. Note that you quote "flash only" sites, which I take to mean "flash is not supported".

The version of Opera for DS doesn't support flash. We're talking about Revolution here. Is there something about Revolution that prevents it from supporting flash? I doubt it..

I'm basing that on two thoughts: 1) That the majority of gamers are on SD sets, so it's a statement of commonality and 2) Nintendo has stated they don't support HD resolutions. However, as I noted and will make a stronger point of: Opera does a very good job of handling non-optimal resolutions. But at SD resolutions, you will still have a non-optimal experience.

Nintendo stated Revolution will not support HD and they meant for games. A Web browser is not a game. A web browser can also run at different resolutions very easily. It makes no sense at all to allow web browsing on Revolution and not allow at least two resolution options.

 

[Rolf N]

I know of quite a few people who build "secondary" PCs specifically for minimum noise, size and power consumption, and use them to browse the web or perform other mundane tasks that don't need much processing power.

It's probably not much of a phenomenon in the USA but it does happen in parts of Europe and Asia. It's essentially the market that VIA's Epia products address, and there are actually many different manufacturers now that support this with custom cases or sell pre-built rigs.

Perhaps Nintendo wants some of that market to buy their console instead.

I'm still not entirely sure about the whole HDTV/SDTV situation with Revolution. As far as I remember, there was just one official quote, and it said something along the lines of "Game developers must make sure their stuff runs fine at 480p", and while that can be interpreted to mean that there will be no HDTV support at all, it's still a bit on the speculative side IMO. E.g. it could be a simple precaution for ensuring compatibility with VGA displays (emphasis on 480p).

If anyone can point me to an actual official quote where this is clarified either way, please do so.

 

[pc999]

Meybe I didnt express myself clear, I didnt said that people will use one or anouther exclusively I said that there will be differences from SD to features (because we will probably can see a lot of sites like B3D, FR, etc... and see some kind of movies meybe eve write on foruns/mails if there is some special tech, but you probably will not be able to download the latest version of programes/codecs... or more than a few doc etc... probably people will only be able to do the basics standards of internet) and the people that will use this is the ones that find this way better for at least some uses and dont mind with the differences for those uses, there will be people that will not allow such differences and will not use it (meybe if there is a PS/XB version with their HDD and os will be a good option to such people).

To sum things up, this will not replace the PC (given all we know about the Rev) so only some (yet a large market IMO) people will use it, the others that want to use "it" as well as a PC will need to wait for a better "version" (probably outside Rev).

And the people that will use it is those that do not use the PC and like this, or those that use it but dont mind with the differences.

 

[Sis]

The version of Opera for DS doesn't support flash. We're talking about Revolution here. Is there something about Revolution that prevents it from supporting flash? I doubt it..

Wow. I said, "It's not about power." It's even in the quote you are responding too. Regardless of how powerful you make the Revolution, it still won't be able to run code that hasn't been written.

Nintendo stated Revolution will not support HD and they meant for games. A Web browser is not a game. A web browser can also run at different resolutions very easily. It makes no sense at all to allow web browsing on Revolution and not allow at least two resolution options.

We've confirmed then that the Revolution is shipping with component cables? Regardless, it's counter to Nintendo's own marketing: that gamers primarily still gaming on SD televisions.

 

[NANOTEC]

Wow. I said, "It's not about power." It's even in the quote you are responding too. Regardless of how powerful you make the Revolution, it still won't be able to run code that hasn't been written.

I read what you said but you're not paying attention. OperaDS doesn't support flash but nobody said Opera on Revolution will be OperaDS. A port of Opera for Revolution could support flash just like the Opera for Windows and Mac. Opera on Revolution only needs to be ported from the Mac version just like OperaDS was ported from the Opera mini for mobiles. Of course the code needs to be written. How do you think OperaDS came to be...magic?

We've confirmed then that the Revolution is shipping with component cables? Regardless, it's counter to Nintendo's own marketing: that gamers primarily still gaming on SD televisions.

No the Revolution will be able to be hooked to a computer monitor using a VGA connector. A VGA connector supports a plethora of resolutions.

 

[Sis]

I read what you said but you're not paying attention. OperaDS doesn't support flash but nobody said Opera on Revolution will be OperaDS. A port of Opera for Revolution could support flash just like the Opera for Windows and Mac. Opera on Revolution only needs to be ported from the Mac version just like OperaDS was ported from the Opera mini for mobiles. Of course the code needs to be written. How do you think OperaDS came to be...magic?

We're finally on the same page. We both now agree that the software has to be written and until it does, and you hit the moderate bar of functionality (see my first post), then it's not a very usable application.

No the Revolution will be able to be hooked to a computer monitor using a VGA connector. A VGA connector supports a plethora of resolutions.

A VGA connector requires a monitor that supports VGA input. Of those, I can think of PC monitors--and I won't even touch this one--or a TV set that supports VGA, such as some (all?) of the Samsung.

Surely you see that this market is dreadfully small? And that given all these issues, web browsing functionality on a console, though "interesting", is not really practical in an overal market sense?