The LAST R600 Rumours & Speculation Thread

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True enough. Obviously, that is the best case scenario and certainly possible. It'd be nice to see all 9'' (retail) cards using the A15 revision, just hope it doesn't delay the darn things longer.

On the other hand, if I were a high-end OEM, I'd be pissed with getting the ungodly hot/not clocking as well, huge-fanned, full-case sized pcb w/ beta-chip monstrosity to pitch in my machines. (Yeah, that was a bit over-the-top...)

I suppose we shall see how it unfolds.

Not as high clocking? That's assuming a bit, in fact I would bet its the same core clock and OEMs (even companies such as Falcon Northwest and Voodoo) rarely OC the video card and instead focus on the much easier CPU. So how high it goes over stock would be of little care as long as the card meets the stock requirements without burning a hole in the side of the case, which is why it probably has the monster of a heatsink. The cases would also be designed around the card internally so that should not be an issue as well.

Only in the retail would such a huge card really be an issue. Where people often times would not have the luxury of ripping out a hard drive rack easily to make the extra room.
 
Exactly , an OEM wont really care if the card is large. They put it in a case that fits it and thats that. The end user will most likely never see the card again . As long as it clocks the same it wont matter to them .

To us its important because we want them to fit in our case and we have to work in the case.
 
Either your case is huge or you're tiny; I for one can't sit inside the darned thing.... *snicker* ;)

I for one can sit on top of mine (a black CM Stacker 820, sturdy and heavy as an elephant) and use it as a convenient race car to drive around the house. :LOL:
I don't think i'd fit in there, though...

Incidentally, i wonder if a R600 XTX fits, if it's really 34 centimetres long... ?
 
Actually you can change the metal layer after production has started, as the metal layer added late in production pipe. So even if A15 did not exist when the production started, the final chips can end up as stepping - there are only a 3 month delay for silicon changes (and A12 and A15 is the same silicon).

That's only half true.
  • Even if you try to avoid it, metal fixes usually happen on lower metal layers. Those are processed roughly 25 days before silicon back... at best. That's because...
  • ...we're talking here about production, not prototype sampling: it's unlikely (and certainly extremely expensive) to process higher volumnes as hot or super-hot lots. For regular production, the processing time is significantly longer.
Once also wonders: A12 -> A15? WTF happened with 13 and 14? Unless you're very incompetent (and I'm sure they're not), you don't go through 3 revisions just to get the speed up. It's more likely there were critical bugs to be fixed that couldn't be waived.

OEM's are reluctant to switch silicon revisions once the product has been qualified. It'd be a pain for AMD to have to deal with 2 sets of silicon.

Finally, the Inq has been known to confuse, among other things, tape-out with silicon-back, so it all doesn't really matter anyway.
 
Not as high clocking? That's assuming a bit, in fact I would bet its the same core clock and OEMs (even companies such as Falcon Northwest and Voodoo) rarely OC the video card and instead focus on the much easier CPU. So how high it goes over stock would be of little care as long as the card meets the stock requirements without burning a hole in the side of the case, which is why it probably has the monster of a heatsink. The cases would also be designed around the card internally so that should not be an issue as well.

Only in the retail would such a huge card really be an issue. Where people often times would not have the luxury of ripping out a hard drive rack easily to make the extra room.

I beg to differ. The OEMs would be very pissed if they had to do with ultra long and hot cards, that are worse then the retail versions. The can live with such monsters if the card is not available in reteil (7900GX2), but surely won´ t if there is a better retail version. The reason for that is very simpel. OEM would have to invest more into cooling the case, need a bigger case and would have more problems to keep the whole PC quite, as silent PCs are a must today. If there really is a OEM version that is longer and hotter, then I would epxect to see the retail version being available much later then the OEM.
 
I beg to differ. The OEMs would be very pissed if they had to do with ultra long and hot cards, that are worse then the retail versions. The can live with such monsters if the card is not available in reteil (7900GX2), but surely won´ t if there is a better retail version. The reason for that is very simpel. OEM would have to invest more into cooling the case, need a bigger case and would have more problems to keep the whole PC quite, as silent PCs are a must today. If there really is a OEM version that is longer and hotter, then I would epxect to see the retail version being available much later then the OEM.

Uhm.. what?
An OEM shops for a card, purchase those on a design decission and that's it.
By the time these machines actually ship, they're allready have a tender out for a new design.
If the card is cooled propperly and OEM would never have to add extra cooling.

And 34cm is a normal length for a card. it's within specifications. A propper workstation case should have space to house a 34cm card any time of the day. 12+ inch cards are rather standard.
 
And 34cm is a normal length for a card. it's within specifications. A propper workstation case should have space to house a 34cm card any time of the day. 12+ inch cards are rather standard.
Not for your typical consumer PC's.
 
Not for your typical consumer PC's.

We're talking about OEM designs here right? Not Joe Smoe's HTPC... it's a bummer if your case just doesn't comply with any form factor whatsoever ;)

Seriously... we're talking about OEM designs, when was the design win? october last year? did ATi win those with one of their Arctic Cooling like coolers? AMD stepped up after that on the cooling department.

So basically the OEM card would be more as what ATI had in mind as a solution to the heat "problem."

On the other hand.. with that size .. it's easier to integrate the main board on a graphics card... ;)
 
OEM's probably won't be happy if customers know they're getting a second class HE-card if they choose to buy OEM's computer. Besides, that A12->A15 "information" is quite suspicious.
 
I really don't see the need to defend a 13" card - it's huge by ANY criteria! Whether OEM's care or not is pretty irrelevant IMO. In any case, it's not like the smaller retail form factor won't be made available to OEM's as well.
 
Maybe the OEM and FireGL version 34cm, and this is missing from vrzone article ;)
They write now 2x6pin connector, so the max. power usage somewhere between 150-225watt, before they write about 6pin and 8pin connector and 225-300watt power usage.

When retail version coming with 34cm long PCB and not much (40-50%) faster than the 8800gtx, than this is a big engineering mistake, they need to bundle a PC case with the card :LOL:
 
the PCB is not 34cm.. the whole card+cooler is 34cm. the fan itself is the reason the card is not 9" but 11"/12"/13"

I don't think AMD would be stupid enough to not leverage one design but instead developr 7 different PCB's. two or three are plausible, seven would kill any margin. I just think the rumourposters confuse a 11" product with a 9" PCB
 
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the PCB is not 34cm.. the whole card+cooler is 34cm. the fan itself is the reason the card is not 9" but 11"/12"/13"

I don't think AMD would be stupid enough to not leverage one design but instead developr 7 different PCB's. two or three are plausible, seven would kill any margin. I just think the rumourposters confuse a 11" product with a 9" PCB

I don't think this cooling solution (longer than the PCB) can be better than a PCB long cooling solution (or little (0.5-1inch) longer) , there is a huge airflow area where there is nothing what need air cooling,
r600cooling0uw.jpg

and i don't think, this longer AIR channel solution can be better.
 
and i don't think, this longer AIR channel solution can be better.
It's a single slot solution.
The solution looks inspired by the Arctic Cooling system in which it takes air from a cooler part of the system instead of near the cpu.

For a disadvantage, there's also an advantage..
 
It's a single slot solution.
The solution looks inspired by the Arctic Cooling system in which it takes air from a cooler part of the system instead of near the cpu.

For a disadvantage, there's also an advantage..

In the graphics it's not single slot solution, the heatpipes (left in the picture) can't be 1 slot high, and i see only one exit for the warm air, and this is end of the card, and the heatsink is starts above in the DVI connectors.

Yes, its looks like a artic style (they was the first used this solution) cooler, hot air going out from the case, this is the best aircooling solution yet ;)
 
Are you kidding me? 40-50% faster would be complete and utter domination!

Depends on the scenario. If that's at 1920x1200 8xaa 16xaf, then yeah me and all my Dell 2405 homeboys start licking our chops. If that's only for 2560x1600 8xaa 16xaf, then just the 20 members of the 30" panel club start high-fiving each other. :smile:
 
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