The Case for PC or Console upgrades *spin-off*

[Deleted member 11852]

what else would they have ? There wont be a 2018 ps4 upgrade or even a 2019 I think. Its way to close to the 2016 ps4 pro.

Sony themselves said that they bleed users to the PC platform as their tech gets old. PS4 Pro is a mid-gen. Four years for another console seems decidedly risky for what Sony want to prevent. When rumours of Pro was originally circulating, many didn't think it'd be launched in 2016 yet that's right where they launched it. Sony's reasons for Pro are likely to Microsoft's reasons for XBOX.

 

[eastmen]

Sony themselves said that they bleed users to the PC platform as their tech gets old. PS4 Pro is a mid-gen. Four years for another console seems decidedly risky for what Sony want to prevent. When rumours of Pro was originally circulating, many didn't think it'd be launched in 2016 yet that's right where they launched it. Sony's reasons for Pro are likely to Microsoft's reasons for XBOX.

We will see , I think with the constant 3 year cycle sony will loose customers who would rather just go pc. If you built a pc in 2013 you'd still have a solid cpu and you could dump the cost of a pro into a gpu upgrade. 3 years later after that you could refresh the vital parts of your pc . Costs wouldn't be much higher and you'd have better graphics the whole time

 

[Deleted member 11852]

We will see , I think with the constant 3 year cycle sony will loose customers who would rather just go pc. If you built a pc in 2013 you'd still have a solid cpu and you could dump the cost of a pro into a gpu upgrade.

This is the PC fallacy that all PCs are high end PCs but that's not the case as the steam hardware survey shows. A cheap PC built in 2013 may be struggling as much, if not more, than a console. A cheap PC is as much a bunch of compromises as a console.

 

[bunge]

We will see , I think with the constant 3 year cycle sony will loose customers who would rather just go pc.

Can a modern day high end PC play Horizon Zero Dawn as well as even a stock PS4?

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Sony themselves said that they bleed users to the PC platform as their tech gets old.

I don't think that's true. Unless these customers come back to PS on a new gen, or new blood comes in at which point PC should be seeing console-like numbers accumulating, actual impact is likely minimal.

If you owned your console from day 1 and now it's long in the tooth in year 4 so you get a PC, surely you'll stick with PC next gen? It had higher initial investment, is cheaper to upgrade than a new console probably, and has BC and your library.
If you didn't own a console from day 1 but are looking at one in year 4, the price difference is mammoth and clearly you aren't going to choose a $700+ PC over a <$200 console because PC is prettier.

We will see , I think with the constant 3 year cycle sony will loose customers who would rather just go pc.

Except PC isn't a substitute for a console. It's a different experience, still, and until there's a Windows 10 console mode or such, PC will never be a direct replacement for a console for most console owners. A 3 year cycle will just mean few sales of the mid-cycle refresh. Major console updates will still appeal as they always have so long as they're maintained as new generations with suitable improvements from the old gen.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

I don't think that's true. Unless these customers come back to PS on a new gen, or new blood comes in at which point PC should be seeing console-like numbers accumulating, actual impact is likely minimal.

He's stated this is reason for Pro multiple times. It's presumably easy for Sony to detect when active accounts become more dormant and when they become more active again. How they know the migration is to PC is another questions but given the ease with which individuals can be tracked, this isn't hard. And it may not be a significantly large number of number to inflate PC numbers it just has to a statistically significant number of the 100+:1 attach ratio people like me who buy a disportionately large number of games. When I switch to buying third party games on Steam, Sony lose a lot of licensing and retailer cut profit. This isn't happening so much this generation because of PS4 Pro.

If you owned your console from day 1 and now it's long in the tooth in year 4 so you get a PC, surely you'll stick with PC next gen? It had higher initial investment, is cheaper to upgrade than a new console probably, and has BC and your library.

Some people may lurch from cheap console to cheap PC back to cheap console - as long as cheap console is competitive in performance terms and we generally know it is as time wears on, this generation more than ever because the consoles were realtively weak, in comparison to PC technology, to begin with.

 

[eastmen]

This is the PC fallacy that all PCs are high end PCs but that's not the case as the steam hardware survey shows. A cheap PC built in 2013 may be struggling as much, if not more, than a console. A cheap PC is as much a bunch of compromises as a console.

you don't need a high end pc . My gf is still playing on a phenom 2 6 core that is like 7 years old right now . She plays civ 6 and garden warefare 2 just fine. She updated from a 6950 to a radeon 480x

Can a modern day high end PC play Horizon Zero Dawn as well as even a stock PS4?

So a single game ? What about all the pc games not avalible on ps4 but on the pc or all the games that run better on pc than even a ps4 pro ?

Except PC isn't a substitute for a console. It's a different experience, still, and until there's a Windows 10 console mode or such, PC will never be a direct replacement for a console for most console owners. A 3 year cycle will just mean few sales of the mid-cycle refresh. Major console updates will still appeal as they always have so long as they're maintained as new generations with suitable improvements from the old gen.

A

 

[Deleted member 11852]

you don't need a high end pc . My gf is still playing on a phenom 2 6 core that is like 7 years old right now . She plays civ 6 and garden warefare 2 just fine. She updated from a 6950 to a radeon 480x

Exactly.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Some people may lurch from cheap console to cheap PC back to cheap console - as long as cheap console is competitive in performance terms and we generally know it is as time wears on, this generation more than ever because the consoles were realtively weak, in comparison to PC technology, to begin with.

From £300 console to £700 PC to £300 console? I can't see anyone gaming on PC for the graphics returning to console. Anyone ever heard of that? If it is happening, I'm completely taken be surprise. Once you have better graphics on PC and it's cheaper to upgrade the GPU than get a new console and your library's all on there, I expect PC gamers to stick to PC-ing.

 

[Cyan]

Sony themselves said that they bleed users to the PC platform as their tech gets old. PS4 Pro is a mid-gen. Four years for another console seems decidedly risky for what Sony want to prevent. When rumours of Pro was originally circulating, many didn't think it'd be launched in 2016 yet that's right where they launched it. Sony's reasons for Pro are likely to Microsoft's reasons for XBOX.

Guess so. People just get tired of 30 fps, abuses and so on. The most powerful console this generation, the PS4 -or does he mean the PS4 Pro?- has been recently criticised by "A Way Out" developer saying that it is like a 5 years old PC and that it holds developers up.

“Do you want the honest truth? This machine is not so strong as you think. This is like a five-year-old PC. If consoles were as powerful as PCs are today, you would see all different games. Most of the work developers put out there is to make them work on consoles.”

https://www.engadget.com/2017/06/11/the-passion-behind-the-prison-break-in-a-way-out/

 

[RancidLunchmeat]

From £300 console to £700 PC to £300 console? I can't see anyone gaming on PC for the graphics returning to console. Anyone ever heard of that? If it is happening, I'm completely taken be surprise. Once you have better graphics on PC and it's cheaper to upgrade the GPU than get a new console and your library's all on there, I expect PC gamers to stick to PC-ing.

Isn't that why Sony made the PS4 Pro? Because they didn't want to lose players to PC gaming because, as you said, it's nearly impossible to gain them back? It's easier (and cheaper) to not lose them in the first place. Once somebody makes the initial investment in the PC and the only upgrade that is needed is the GPU, that is a more economical proposition.

It's the reason that 'You can't build a more powerful PC than the XB1X for $500' argument is ludicrous as well. If you already have most of the components, it's very easy to upgrade to a system more powerful than an XB1X and gets progressively cheaper the newer those components (W10 license, fast HDD or SD, DDR4 so you don't need a mobo replacement, etc..)

 

[DrJay24]

Guess so. People just get tired of 30 fps, abuses and so on. The most powerful console this generation, the PS4 -or does he mean the PS4 Pro?- has been recently criticised by "A Way Out" developer saying that it is like a 5 years old PC and that it holds developers up.

“Do you want the honest truth? This machine is not so strong as you think. This is like a five-year-old PC. If consoles were as powerful as PCs are today, you would see all different games. Most of the work developers put out there is to make them work on consoles.”

https://www.engadget.com/2017/06/11/the-passion-behind-the-prison-break-in-a-way-out/

So a console designed in 2012 for $400 is like a 5 year old PC? Who would have thought. Anyhow, the guy is an idiot. If he wants to make his games for a top of the line PC, he is welcome to do it.

 

[MrFox]

Can a modern day high end PC play Horizon Zero Dawn as well as even a stock PS4?

I tried it on my gtx780... I guess my card is too old, the Awesome: Robot Dinosaur game doesn't even start.

 

[eastmen]

Exactly.

exactly what ? The ps4 barely plays garden warfare at 1080p 60 fps and her pc plays it at that just fine. I've also played a bunch of vr stuff on it like star trek bridge commander and it has a phenom 2 . Everything in that machine except the 480 is old. I built it for her the year after we met and we have been together almost 8 years now. I think aside from a 128 gig ssd the only other upgrade was the 480.

 

[eastmen]

So a console designed in 2012 for $400 is like a 5 year old PC? Who would have thought. Anyhow, the guy is an idiot. If he wants to make his games for a top of the line PC, he is welcome to do it.

I think the problem is what is a top of the line pc .

You can get a xbox one but that is barely going to get you 1080p . The ps4 is likely going to go down that road too as more love gets shown to the pro and x . Then you can get the pro and get good 1080p or checkerboard 4k with some full 4k . The x will most likely have more full 4k games .

But if you sit down and plan your build well for a pc. You can get a 6 core zen , 16 gigs of ram and a 580/1060 and spend less than a grand . Your going to get better performance than you will from even the x . Yes you will have spent more on the initial box. But in 3-4 years you can just buy a new video card to replace the 580/1060 and again have better performance than the boxes out at the time. The pc will also let you do more

 

[dobwal]

PC vs console doesn't have to be a "either or" proposition. I can imagine a ton of gamers buying into both ecosystems since there is a plethora of reasons to do so.

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

To some extent yes. It depends though. Me and my brother game on pc with Nintendo as the second platform because it offers something different from what is on PC. PC/XBOX/PS mostly offer the same experience and most games are available for all three platforms.

For me the choice is easy. I need a pc anyway and for the price of a half decent pc + the price of a console I can build a pc that can be used for pretty high end gaming so the logical choice is a pc. I also like the fact it performs how I want it and not how the dev wants it to.

It will be different for others but I don't think PC + PS/XBOX is the most likely scenario as it mostly offers more of the same.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

From £300 console to £700 PC to £300 console? I can't see anyone gaming on PC for the graphics returning to console. Anyone ever heard of that? If it is happening, I'm completely taken be surprise.

Sony have based a business strategy on this.

 

[dobwal]

To some extent yes. It depends though. Me and my brother game on pc with Nintendo as the second platform because it offers something different from what is on PC. PC/XBOX/PS mostly offer the same experience and most games are available for all three platforms.

For me the choice is easy. I need a pc anyway and for the price of a half decent pc + the price of a console I can build a pc that can be used for pretty high end gaming so the logical choice is a pc. I also like the fact it performs how I want it and not how the dev wants it to.

It will be different for others but I don't think PC + PS/XBOX is the most likely scenario as it mostly offers more of the same.

And I can imagine others who don't care enough for PC building and gaming and place a greater emphasis on portability, sleek design and less on TFLOPs. So while their Surface Pro or MacBook Pro offers some gaming options, they rather buy a $250-$500 dollars no-fuss console to fill out their options.

It all comes down to your own personal preference. Telling someone they can build a PC capable of out doing a xb1 or PS4 means nothing if they have no interest in actually building or maintaining a PC. Shit you can give me an electronic catalog and tell me I can build a great toaster for 50 cents and 5 hours of my time and I would probably just take 15 minutes of my time and go and buy a $20 one from the store.

And telling someone they can't build a PC equivalent of a xbx1 for less than $750 might mean nothing to them because they extract pleasure from the process itself. They like shopping for the necessary parts, putting it all together and tweaking the hardware to death to push it towards its peak performance. In that case the actual value of the build can't be readily describe by the cost of the parts themselves.

For others they like it all. PC, consoles, handhelds, mobile or whatever. They find pleasure in all things gaming. It's their hobby and care nothing for brand or hardware-type loyalty. If they can afford it, they will buy and fiddle with it because they find value in all things gaming.

 

[BRiT]

PC vs console doesn't have to be a "either or" proposition. I can imagine a ton of gamers buying into both ecosystems since there is a plethora of reasons to do so.

Especially with Microsofts PlayAnywhere concept, buythe game once and play on xbox or PC.